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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Lanarkshire => Topic started by: Kendy on Monday 16 March 15 22:49 GMT (UK)
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I am hoping to find out more about Marion Kelly (a sewing machinest) who gave birth to my grandmother Alice on 6th November 1903 at 25 Mair Street, Govan. On the Registration of Birth, Marion is shown as being unmarried and lists Alice as 'illegitimate'. These are the only details I have, and because the document does not show Marion's age when she gave birth to Alice, I have no further leads. The 'family story' is that Alice's natural father was a captain on a ship and he did visit baby Alice on a couple of occasions in the first few weeks following her birth and subsequent adoption, but visits suddenly stopped and there was no further contact. Alice was 'adopted' by Mary Jane and Michael Cullen a few weeks after she was born and was brought up in Coatbridge, but I presume that, in 1903, this was not a 'legal' adoption, and despite being shown on the 1911 census as being their daughter (ie Alice Cullen) she is shown as using her natural mother's maiden name (Kelly) on her marriage certificate. At some point after Alice's adoption, Marion married (although I don't know to whom) and went on to have several other children and remained in the Glasgow area. If anyone recognises any of these details (or can offer any further leads) I would love to hear from you. Thanks. :)
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Looking at the 1901 census for 25 Mair St Govan.
It was a multi occupancy building but there is one family called Kelly.
I really can't say if this is relevant or not but I think this could be your family.
Patrick Kelly 46 Dock Labourer, born Ireland
Helen Kelly 45Wife, Born Ireland
Mary Mcv Kelly 25 dau born Glasgow. Shirt Machinist
Edward Mcv Kelly 5 grandson born Glasgow b Glasgow
Susan Mcv Kelly 3 granddaughter b Glasgow
Helen Mcv Kelly 7mo Granddaughter b Glasgow
Edit:
Found the same family at 1891 and 1881.
The elder daughter is called Mary Ann Kelly rather than Marion which is a fairly common mistranscription.
Mary Ann Kelly also had a younger sister called...ALICE!
1891: 32 King St, Tradeston
Name Age
Patrick Kelly 46
Ellen Kelly 46
Patrick Kelly 18
Mary A Kelly 15
Alice Kelly 13
Catherine Kelly 11
1881:Gorbals
Patk Kelly 35
Helen Kelly 35
Patk Kelly 9
John Kelly 11
Mary Ann Kelly 6
Alice Kelly 3
Kate Kelly 1
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Anne, that looks like a really good lead :)
Monica
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I think so too Monica.
Kendy also placed the same request on the beginners thread and I dont know if he/she saw my post on this one?
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Saw that now too. Sure they will connect with your info now.
Monica :)
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Hello Anne, I can't thank you enough for the information you have provided! Although you 'can't say whether it is relevant or not', I would say there are too many coincidences for it not to be the family I am looking for! So many things have fallen into place and it brought a lump to my throat when I saw that Mary Ann had had a sister called Alice, presumably the sister after whom she named my grandmother, and her 'birth family' are suddenly 'real'.
As you suggested I have gone onto Scotland's People and the information you provided has enabled me to also find Mary Ann's Register of Marriage to a John McVeigh in 1896, and consequently his parents and siblings. What I would like to do now is to find out if Mary Ann remarried after 1903, what happened to John McVeigh (as he died so young) and, in particular, what happened to Mary Ann's sister Alice. I wonder if, perhaps, she also died some time between 1891 and 1901 (and that is why my grandmother was given her name) but as yet I have been unable to find anything on the SP site. Of course, she may have just moved away for work, or even emigrated... but I am not giving up hope of finding out!
Thank you for your time, effort and interest, Anne. It is so very much appreciated! :)
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Kendy,
Are you certain that the 1896 marriage of Mary Ann Kelly to John McVeigh refers to the same person from the census returns that I posted?
What were her parents names and her address at the time of the 1896 marriage?
Even if she had been married and widowed prior to the birth of her child Alice Kelly in 1903, I would have expected the name McVeigh to appear somewhere on the birth cert.
(An illegitimate child is entiltled to have the same name as the mother)
I have doubts because Mary Ann is listed with her parents at 1901 and entered as Mary Ann Kelly
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Hi Anne.
At the time of the wedding (April 1896) both bride and groom appear to be living at the same address, 5 Burrells Lane, Glasgow. Mary Ann, aged 20, is listed as a sewing machinist. Her parents are Patrick Kelly (Dock Labourer) and Ellen Kelly (nee Reilly).
I obtained the details above by using the information on the 1901 census you provided, where she is named as ‘Mary McV Kelly’, so when I did a search for her marriage I entered the husband’s surname as a wildcard (McV*) and her name as Mary Ann Kelly. The three grandchildren on the 1901 census also have the name ‘McV Kelly’ and the eldest would have been born around 1895/96. Her marital status in 1901 says she is a widow, but I have to say, it does seem strange that she is showing both her marriage and maiden name for herself and her children on the census return. Do you know if it was likely/acceptable, back then, for a woman to revert back to her maiden name if deserted, by her husband, rather than widowed?
I don't have a copy yet of my grandmother Alice’s Birth Certificate, but I presume it would just say the same as the Registration of Birth which shows Mary Ann as just Kelly, and until I saw the 1901 census I had always presumed her to be single. Perhaps, because Alice had a different father, she didn’t feel it appropriate to give her the name of her (presumably) dead husband when he had no connection to her (and especially if she intended not to keep her). Who knows what ‘logic’ goes through peoples minds when completing census and registration forms, lol?!
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Apologies Kendy,
I was half asleep last night and wasn't thinking about the names on the 1901 return.
It hadn't occurred to me that the 3 children were Mary Ann's own children.
Based on info from family search,I did have an inkling that this was the family of Patrick Kelly and Helen/Ellen Reilly
It may be worth getting the birth cert for Alice b 1903 .
Perhaps Mary Ann made an application for Poor Relief?
My own grandfather b 1890 was also informally adopted after his mother died.
I found the true information in a PR application made by his own father, in 1901.
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No problem Anne. It took me a while to realise that the children were Mary Ann's; I initially thought they must belong to an older brother until I spotted that they all had 'McV' before the Kelly and that Mary Ann was widowed. Little details like that can be easily overlooked, especially when trying to decipher handwriting!
The Poor Relief records sounds like a good idea. I hadn't thought of that. Could you tell me where I would look for these, please (I don't think they are available on Scotland's people, are they)? Thanks again. :)