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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Fife => Topic started by: Scottleneveu on Wednesday 25 March 15 18:49 GMT (UK)
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Hello,
I'm just wondering if anybody could look up a Robert Inglis Haggart who was born about 1840, in Markinch, Fife. He married a Margaret Nicol and his children was named Robert, Andrew, William, David and Margaret. I'm trying to find out the names of Robert Inglis Haggarts siblings if any? And I'm not sure how to search census records myself :)
Many thanks
Scott
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Hi,
Possible 1841 for Robert -
David Haggart 41
Mary Haggart 35
David Haggart 14
Mary Haggart 12
Jean Haggart 10
Willm B Haggart 5
John Haggart 3
James Haggart 3
Robert I Haggart 1 b. Markinch
JJ
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1851 -
David Haggart 50 b. Cuss, Fife
Mary Haggart 48 b. Alyth, Angus
David Haggart son 24 b. Markinch, Fife
Mary Haggart son 22 b. Markinch, Fife
Jane Haggart dau 20 b.Markinch, Fife
John Haggart son 13 b. Markinch, Fife
James Haggart son 13 b. Markinch, Fife
Robert Haggart son 11 b. Markinch, Fife
Living in Markinch, Fife
JJ
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Thank you for this :) I've seen a death certificate for Robert Inglis Haggart that somebody sent me a while back, and it looked as though it said something like Janet Crockert in his mothers name, I couldn't really see it as it was quite blurry and I've deleted it by accident, but like you, all the records I've found has a mother named Mary :-\
Scott
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Scott, his siblings' entries show mother as Mary Crockatt (and many variants). Likely Janet is probably reported in error.
https://familysearch.org/search/record/results?count=20&query=%2Bsurname%3Ahaggart~%20%2Bbirth_place%3Ascotland~%20%2Bfather_givenname%3Adavid~%20%2Bmother_givenname%3Amary~
If you, would check Robert's marriage and death certs and further census entries etc. for additional confirmation.
Monica
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Is there any specific addresses given ?
Annie
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Hello again :)
Yes, in the death certificate I believe that it said 'uppergreens, auchtermuchty' but as I said, I deleted the copy that I had by accident when I was cleaning out my emails a while ago
Scott
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Scott, thought you might like to see a photo of an old cottage on Upper Greens Auchtermuchty here www.buildingsatrisk.org.uk/ref_no/4915
Monica
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Oh wow! That's such a beautiful little cottage, thank you for sending me the link, it was fascinating to see :)
Scott
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Here's more of "Upper Greens"
(copy & paste this into websearch bar)
urlm.in/tjcm
Annie
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1851 -
David Haggart 50 b. Cuss, Fife
Mary Haggart 48 b. Alyth, Angus
I suspect Cuss to be Culross ???
Alyth comes under Perthshire now
Annie
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Hello Annie,
Yes it could be Culross or maybe Cults ???
Scott
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The 'ss' as opposed to 's' would suggest Culross I think ???
Do you have a specific Markinch address?
Annie
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Yea I can see that, perhaps you're right. No, I've only seen the death certificate at the moment and as if said earlier, it only had upper greens auchtermuchty on it. I'll have to buy it again as I can't remember it clearly and I can't remember who sent me it in the first place! :)
Scott
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Downloadable www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk for less than £1.50 bp which is fantastic as no waiting up to 14 days for post ;D
Annie
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I think Cuss is a transcription error to be honest as it's a fair distance from Markinch or Auchtermuchty but Cults is near both ??? ::) ;D
Annie
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I've seen a death certificate for Robert Inglis Haggart and it looked as though it said something like Janet Crockert in his mothers name, I've found a mother named Mary :-\
It seems that Robert Inglis grandparents were David Haggart & Jean/Janet Crockart (various spellings) & his parents were David Haggart (1800) & Mary Crockart although David had a brother Robert (1806)
Annie
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Oh really? That's interesting, it's weird that both his mum and his grandmother were named Crockert isn't it
Scott
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Robert Inglis Haggart who was born about 1840, in Markinch, Fife. He married a Margaret Nicol and his children was named Robert, Andrew, William, David and Margaret.
1901 (wondering what the connection is with this family)...... Robert Inglis son ???
David Haggart
Age:36
Estimated Birth Year:abt 1865
Relationship:Head
Spouse's name :Annie Haggart
Gender:Male
Where born: Auchtermuchty, fifeshire
Registration Number:192
Registration district:Ellon
Civil Parish:Ellon
County:Aberdeenshire
Address: 6 Ythan Terrace
Occupation: Coler Sergt Gordon Highlanders
ED:1
Household schedule number: 181
LINE:1
Roll: CSSCT1901_66
Household Members:
David Haggart 36
Annie Haggart 37 (Kinross)
David Haggart 3 (Aberdeen)
Margaret Nicol Haggart 1 (Aberdeen)
Annie
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Name: Margaret Nicol Haggart
Gender:Female
Marriage Date:17 May 1918
Marriage Place:Collessie Fife
Document Year:1918
Residence Place: Pittencarty Shothaugh
Relationship to Soldier:Spouse
Form Title:Information Supplied By Recruit
Other Records:
Family Members:
Name Relation to Soldier
Charles Wilkie Clark Self (Head)
Margaret Nicol Haggart Spouse
Annie Skinner Clark Child
Christina Wilkie Clark Child
Annie
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Yes this could well be Robert Inglis son David as I believe that he was born around 1867 in Auchtermuchty. Also on Robert jnrs marriage certificate to Annie Nicol Bruce, it has his address as 6 Pinnies? Lane, woodside, Aberdeen. Perhaps the whole family relocated there?
Scott
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Name: Margaret Nicol Haggart
Gender:Female
Marriage Date:17 May 1918
Marriage Place:Collessie Fife
Document Year:1918
Residence Place: Pittencarty Shothaugh
Relationship to Soldier:Spouse
Form Title:
Information Supplied By Recruit
Other Records:
Family Members:
Name Relation to Soldier
Charles Wilkie Clark Self (Head)
Margaret Nicol Haggart Spouse
Annie Skinner Clark Child born 1 May 1918 Collessie
Christina Wilkie Clark Child born 24 Jan 1920 Collessie
Annie
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Yes this could well be Robert Inglis son David as I believe that he was born around 1867 in Auchtermuchty. Also on Robert jnrs marriage certificate to Annie Nicol Bruce, it has his address as 6 Pinnies? Lane, woodside, Aberdeen. Perhaps the whole family relocated there
David was in the Army & his daughter Margaret Nicol Haggart married a soldier but that was back in Fife :P
Annie
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This Is wonderful, thank you :)
Scott
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David also had brothers named Andrew F Haggart and William Y Haggart, I'm wondering if the F was for Forsyth, as I'm sure that I've seen a census record saying that before, but I can't remember how I found it or if it was even him! Have you came across anything saying that?
Scott
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Hi Scott,
I am searching what/when I can but you will understand it's very time consuming too & there are so many Haggarts to be honest so it's an elimination process..................one at a time or I would get mixed up ;D
I don't have the proof of who belongs to who so I have to use educated guess work i.e. you need to check that my finds are who I think they are with the proper paperwork ???
Annie
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Scott,
Is it possible you could add some more info. regarding dates/places etc. please to help searches as all info. helps & saves time ;D
Annie
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Hello Annie,
Yes I understand that and I really appreciate everything that you've done for me :) I got a little bit carried away I think
Scott
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David also had brothers named Andrew F Haggart and William Y Haggart, I'm wondering if the F was for Forsyth
Andrew Forsyth Haggart married Agnes Mary Howden Crookston, 20 Sep 1907, Cannongate, Edinburgh, Scotland
I haven't looked for William Y (yet)
Annie
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Children of Robert Haggart & Margaret Nicol
Name: Mary Ballingall Haggart
Gender: Female
Birth Date: 14 Sep 1862
Birth Place: Auchtermuchty,Fife,Scotland
Father: Robert Haggart
Mother: Margaret Nicol
FHL Film Number: 6035516
--------------------------------------------
Name: Mary Jane Ballingall Haggart
Gender: Female
Birth Date: 14 May 1864
Birth Place: Auchtermuchty,Fife,Scotland
Father: Robert Haggart
Mother: Margaret Nicol
FHL Film Number: 6035516
-----------------------------------------
Name: David Haggart
Gender: Male
Birth Date: 26 Jun 1866
Birth Place: Auchtermuchty,Fife,Scotland
Father: Robert Haggart
Mother: Margaret Nicol
FHL Film Number: 6035516
----------------------------------------------
Name: William Haggart
Gender: Male
Birth Date: 25 Oct 1868
Birth Place: Auchtermuchty,Fife,Scotland
Father: Robert Haggart
Mother: Margaret Nicol
FHL Film Number: 6035516
-----------------------------------------
Name: Margaret Haggart
Gender: Female
Birth Date: 15 Mar 1870
Birth Place: Auchtermuchty,Fife,Scotland
Father: Robert Haggart
Mother: Margaret Nicol
FHL Film Number: 6035516
------------------------------------------------------
Name: Robert Haggart
Gender: Male
Birth Date: 6 Sep 1872
Birth Place: Auchtermuchty,Fife,Scotland
Father: Robert Haggart
Mother: Margaret Nicol
FHL Film Number: 6035516
--------------------------------------------
1871
Name: Robert Haggart
Age: 31
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1840
Relationship: Head
Spouse's name : Margaret Haggart
Gender: Male
Where born: Markinch, fifesh
Registration Number: 406
Registration district: Auchtermuchty
Civil Parish: Auchtermuchty
County: Fife
Address: Burnside
Occupation: Blacksmith
ED: 1
Household schedule number: 123
LINE: 22
Roll: CSSCT1871_69
Household Members: Name Age
Robert Haggart
31
Margaret Haggart
30
Mary Jane Haggart
6
David Haggart
4
Margaret Haggart
1
1881
Name: David Haggart
Age: 14
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1867
Relationship: Son (Child)
Father's name: Robert I Haggart
Mother's name: Margaret Haggart
Gender: Male
Where born: Auchtermuchty, Fife
Registration Number: 406
Registration district: Auchtermuchty
Civil Parish: Auchtermuchty
County: Fife
Address: Donsbank
Occupation: Farm Servant
ED: 1
Household schedule number: 64
LINE: 11
Roll: cssct1881_113
Household Members: Name Age
Robert I Haggart
41
Margaret Haggart
40
David Haggart
14
Margaret Haggart
11
Robert Haggart
9
Andrew F Haggart
6
William Y Haggart
3
Annie
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1891
Name: Mary J Haggart
Age: 26
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1865
Relationship: Head
Gender: Female
Where born: Auchtermuchty, Fife
Registration Number: 406
Registration district: Auchtermuchty
Civil Parish: Auchtermuchty
County: Fife
Address: Dons Bank
Occupation: Domestic Servant
ED: 1
Household schedule number: 61
LINE: 14
Roll: CSSCT1891_123
Household Members: Name Age
Mary J Haggart
26
Maggie Allan
5
Charles B Allan
4
Janet Haggart
9 Mo
Annie
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1871
Name: William Haggart
Age: 35
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1836
Relationship: Head
Spouse's name : Isabella Haggart
Gender: Male
Where born: Markinch, fifeshire
Registration Number: 692/1
Registration district: Leith North
Civil Parish: Leith North
County: Midlothian
Address: 8 Trafalgar Lane
Occupation: Engine Smith
ED: 14
Household schedule number: 128
LINE: 6
Roll: CSSCT1871_168
Household Members: Name Age
William Haggart
35
Isabella Haggart
35
Janet Haggart
13
Mary Haggart
7
Robert Haggart
5
Isabella Haggart
1
1881
Name: William Haggart
Age: 45
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1836
Relationship: Head
Spouse's name : Isabella Haggart
Gender: Male
Where born: Markinch, Fifeshire
Registration Number: 692/2
Registration district: Leith South
Civil Parish: Leith South
Town: Leith
County: Midlothian
Address: No 113 C Stair Bonnington Road
Occupation: Engine Smith
ED: 17
Household schedule number: 146
LINE: 9
Roll: cssct1881_298
Household Members: Name Age
William Haggart
45
Isabella Haggart
45
Robert Haggart
15
Margret Haggart
9
James Haggart
7
Hugh Haggart
5
Annie
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1920
Name: Hugh Haggart
Age: 44
Birth Year: abt 1876
Birthplace: Scotland
Home in 1920: St Louis Ward 25, St Louis (Independent City), Missouri
Street: Finney Avenue
House Number: 4364
Race: White
Gender: Male
Immigration Year: 1908
Relation to Head of House: Head
Marital Status: Married
Spouse's Name: Anna Haggart
Father's Birthplace: Scotland
Mother's Birthplace: Scotland
Native Tongue: English
Able to Speak English: Yes
Occupation: Grocery
Industry: Self
Employment Field: Employer
Home Owned or Rented: Rent
Naturalization Status: Naturalized
Able to Read: Yes
Able to Write: Yes
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Hugh Haggart
44
Anna Haggart
44
Ellen Haggart
18
Johnella Haggart
12
Hugh Haggart
0
[5/12]
Annie
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1930
Name: Hugh Haggart
Birth Year: abt 1920
Gender: Male
Race: White
Birthplace: Missouri
Marital Status: Single
Relation to Head of House: Son (Child)
Home in 1930: Toledo, Lucas, Ohio
Map of Home: View Map
Street address: North Street
Ward of City: 7th
Block: 3
House Number in Cities or Towns: 537
Dwelling Number: 98
Family Number: 135
Attended School: Yes
Able to Read and Write: Yes
Father's Birthplace: Scotland
Mother's Birthplace: Germany
Able to Speak English: Yes
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Hugh Haggart
55
Anna Haggart
55
Ellen A Haggart
27
Hugh Haggart
10
Mary Ellen Haggart
9
Annie
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Goodness me, all this information! It's so interesting ;D thank you so much
Scott
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Hello,
Is anybody still researching this line? I a also trying to trace it back. When did Roberts dad pass away? I've seen on another post regarding the same family that somebody said it was 1857 in Markinch. Was this proven? A david haggart did pass away then but his parents were said to of been David Haggart and Jean Crawford, not Crockart. Davids son Robert married a Crockart
Molly
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Hi Molly,
That death cert. would cost less than £1.50BP to download on scotlandspeople.gov.uk which would confirm any discrepancies.
You could also check this rc link & add your query which may help...
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=509122.0
Annie
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Molly and Annie, just adding link to another new post by you Molly to try to keep all new responses together otherwise there is a risk of repeat searches by others trying to help.
www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=734661.0
Monica
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Thanks Monica for link ;)
EDIT...........
Hello Annie,
Yes it could be Culross or maybe Cults ???
Scott,
I think your suggestion of Cults is more accurate as it's closer to the areas mentioned.
Annie
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Son Robert Inglis Haggart died 1900. Robert's parents' details were reported by son David:
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I am going to guess (haven't see it) that the likely 1857 death of David Snr was in those early years where registrars simply reported marital status as single/married/widowed. This might add to the uncertainty on names.
Doesn't help Molly that you mentioned that when Robert married Margaret, he gave mother's name as Crawford ?
However, you have Robert Inglis with his family in both 1841 and 1851 in Markinch. He is working away from home by 1861 and then you have him from there until his death up to 1900.
As Annie mentions, maybe have a look at David, father's, DC, for yourself. This is good affirmation of what you have so far. Not sure if it would show as married or widowed. Can't see Mary Crocketts' death reg so far, so this info from David's help would help you know.
Also, if you hare happy with the 1841 and 1851 censuses, have you tries searching on siblings' marriages and deaths. This is additional verification on parents' details.
Monica
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Monica and Annie :)
Yes I have a copy of the death cert, I've had it for a while for David Haggart who died 1857 in Markinch, and it says that his parents where David Haggart and Jean Crawford. I'm just getting confused as to whether it's MY David as I've seen posts on here that say his mother was Jean Crockett
Molly
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I forgot to say, when Robert married Margaret he put his mothers name as MARY CROCKETT not CRAWFORD but on the death cert for Robert it says Janet Crockett. Also you are right, on the 1857 death cert that I have for David Haggart it simply says ''married''. Hope I haven't confused you further :D
Molly
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David also had brothers named Andrew F Haggart and William Y Haggart, I'm wondering if the F was for Forsyth
I haven't looked for William Y (yet)
Annie
Scott,
There's a marriage in Edinburgh between 1898 & 1910 for a William Y Haggart
Although you would be best with "all records" option from 1855 - 2014 as there are 4 who may be related & cost for that index same as for 1 name.
I suspect the "Y" to be Yule?
The marriage would confirm his parents which will help locate any children & his full name may be on a birth cert. as I can't find anything with the middle name showing so far.
Annie
ADDED..Does the surname "Yule" figure elsewhere in your tree, possibly g grandmothers maiden name?
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Scott,
This link has all William Yule's born but I left surname blank.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01gfv/
This one all William Y (only) & left surname blank
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01gfw/
This may help in identifying surnames already in your tree but maybe not :-\
Annie
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Scott, Annie and Monica,
Was it William Young Haggart born 1878 Auchtermuchty?
Molly
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Molly,
Good detective work there....could well be .
Annie
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Thank you Annie ;D
Although as of yet I haven't found a family member with young or forsyth as a surname ??? Also Robert had a brother named William B Haggart, was this William Baillie Haggart?
Molly
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There is something that makes me wonder if I have the right person though. Robert Haggart born 1840 is said to of been a beam maker on his sons birth ( 1872) and marriage (1895) certificates but on HIS marriage (1862) and death (1900) certs he is said to of been a blacksmith. So was he a blacksmith then a beam maker then a blacksmith again? I just wonder why it doesn't match up?
Molly
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There is something that makes me wonder if I have the right person though. Robert Haggart born 1840 is said to of been a beam maker on his sons birth ( 1872) and marriage (1895) certificates but on HIS marriage (1862) and death (1900) certs he is said to of been a blacksmith. So was he a blacksmith then a beam maker then a blacksmith again? I just wonder why it doesn't match up?
Molly
Molly,
The best way to try to clarify Robert's occupation is through census records 1861, 1871, 1881 & 1891 which would give reference between the dates you have him with different occupations.
A Blacksmith worked with iron & the reference to "Beam Maker" may be to do with "lintels" which to me sounds quite plausible as they would be made of steel as well as other combinations (wood, cement). People were very adaptable.....they had to be.
Check out freecen.org.uk for census.
Annie
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Hello Annie,
Thank you for telling me about Freecen, I'll have to try and figure out how it works as my searches seem to come back with nothing! :D
Thank you though,
Molly
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Molly, FreeCen is a volunteer transcribed service. Grows every year but probably still best for the earlier censuses. This gives you an indication of current coverage www.freecen.org.uk/statistics.html
Monica
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Molly,
Is it possible you can do a summary with names, dates & places (in order) please as this is getting too confusing. I would do it if I had the time.
If you put name of primary person b & date (of birth) & where son of & names, married whoever, date & where with wife's birth year & place with parents.
Then children...e.g.
Adam Haggart b date & place son of ? & ? - married 1854 in Markinch to Eve Berry born date & place & her parents.
Meanwhile, I couldn't find anything re census info.
You can look through this though...
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01gga/
Annie
ADDED...Variants of surname Haggart on records Hoggart & Haggard although possibly others which helps to know for your research
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Ammack,
Most certainly.
I have,
David Nicol Bruce Haggart b 1895 Laurancekirk son of Robert Haggart and Annie Bruce. He married Nellie Allison Sunter Cowdenbeath 1920, daughter of william sunter and Clementina Wright.
Robert Haggart b 1872 Auchtermuchty son of Robert Haggart and Margaret Nicol. Married Annie Bruce 1895 daughter of William Bruce and Ann Ramsay Nicoll.
Robert Haggart b 1840 Markinch son of David Haggart and Mary Crockett. Married Margaret Nicol 1862 Kinross daughter of william Nicol + mary ballingall
Then if this David died in markinch 1857 I have him as the son son of David Haggart and Jean Crawford
Molly :)
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Thanks Molly,
Robert b 1840...is he Robert Inglis?
"Then if this David died in markinch 1857 I have him as the son of David Haggart and Jean Crawford" ADDED..Who registered his death?
Is this the David b 1800?I've seen a death certificate for Robert Inglis Haggart and it looked as though it said something like Janet Crockert in his mothers name, I've found a mother named Mary :-\
It seems that Robert Inglis grandparents were David Haggart & Jean/Janet Crockart (various spellings) & his parents were David Haggart (1800) & Mary Crockart although David had a brother Robert (1806)
Annie
From what I can see, it's been an error where the women's names have been mixed up?
Annie
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Hello Ammack :)
Yes I believe Robert b 1840 is Robert Inglis, although 'Inglis' wasn't used on the marriage cert, don't know if this is normal? ???
I really don't know who registered the 1857 death for David Haggart, the writing on the certificate is really really faint unfortunately and it's quite difficult to make certain parts out. I think the informant could've been William Haggart...possibly?
Molly
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Hello people,
Another problem has now arisen. When I try to find a birth for Robert Haggart 1840 Markinch on scotlandspeople the only person that comes up within the right time frame is a robert haggart 1840, strathmiglo son of Thomas Haggart and Margaret Mudie this also came back when I searched a few of his siblings. Could this be MY robert Haggart? Wasn't everything recorded? I'm a bit confused. Has anybody else experienced this and can shed light on the subject?
Molly
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.........Hagart......Haggart.
Lt William Hagart & Spouse - Marion Cairns; lived in Bonnington Lodge. In Bonnington Rd.
I note you have this Haggart Family in Bonnington Rd.
William was a "Know" citizen. He was a Wine Merchant in Leith.
Secretary "The Hunt Club"
Member- "Royal Archers"
(Bn 1728- Death1792. Leith. Scotland.
...................The Men who went on to be Merchants or W.S - were Hagart; many who went onto farming and the land were Haggart?..............Maybe worth investigation further. Cheers. V.Hagart.
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A website called www.markinchchurch.org.uk has an Alexander Haggart (1) son of David Haggart of Markinch, 10 may 1849, in grave of Jean Crockatt, widow of David Haggart in Markinch, interred 21 December 1847.
Also, David Haggart (70) in Markinch, 6 Dec 1833, north side of Joshua Gadd at Newton of Markinch, interred 28 Dec 1825.
Also... Jean Crockatt (86) widow of David HOGGAN at Markinch, 21 Dec 1847, in grave of said husband, north side of stone.
I feel as though there is something here bit I can't figure it out as I feel as though I have an information over load at the min!
Wonder if anybody else can do anything with this information?
Molly