RootsChat.Com
Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Wales => Breconshire => Topic started by: Dannemois on Saturday 18 April 15 11:22 BST (UK)
-
Hello
I wonder if there is a member who can help finding the 'parents' of John Herbert Speake
Born 1891, registered Quarter Apr-May-Jun. in Brecknock, Brecknockshire (Volume 11B, Page 102, Line Number 170). I located 9 year-old John Speake on the 1901 residing with his uncle stone mason John Speake at ‘Canteen’ Llanbadan, Knighton, Radnor. On the 1911 census John Herbert Speake aged 19 was boarder with Charles Hutton and family at 8 Harcourt Terrace, Brithdir, Gelligaer.
Regards, Roy
-
This looks like the uncle in 1851 - so your John's parent should be one of his siblings. The only way to be sure would be to get his birth certificate
HO107; Piece: 1983; Folio: 147; Page: 17
Samuel Speak 47 Cardington, Shropshire
Elizabeth Speak 50 Hoapsay, Shropshire
William Speak 21 Clun, Shropshire
Ann Speak 15 Clun, Shropshire
John Speak 12 Clun, Shropshire
Mary Speak 8 Clun, Shropshire
-
Hello Groom
Thanks for taking interest and posting the 1851 details. I am researching all the names on the war memorials within the Rhymney Valley and although I appreciate the need to purchase certificates when researching ones family, it would be prove costly in this case as there are several unidentified casualties on every memorial and I am trying all other means first. John's brother William Speake, widower was also living in Brithdir in 1911 (partially attached) so there's a chance he could be John H's father. I need to get his birth certificate.
Thanks again for your input
-
John Herbert Speake could be the ilegitimate son of Ann or Mary shown in the 1851.
-
Hi Groom
I suspected John Herbert Speake could be have been born out of wedlock; I presume his birth was still registered in a parish records?
-
There's something not quite right about this and I'm now wondering if either that is the wrong family in 1851 or whether we have the wrong generation, as all the children from 1851 would be quite old to have a child born 1891.
I'm presuming that John was killed in WW1, have you found his war records or a mention on the CWGC site?
-
Hi Groom
That is the problem I have, he is named on the village war memorial as J. Speake but unfortunately his military records have not survived. Hence I am clutching at straws.
Roy
-
Hi Groom
That is the problem I have, he is named on the village war memorial as J. Speake but unfortunately his military records have not survived. Hence I am clutching at straws.
Roy
Hi Roy, just spotted this thread, so what other evidence suggests a middle name of Herbert?
Keyboard
-
Are you absolutely sure that he was John, if it just says J Speake? The CWGC has 2 John Speakes, one has details of parents and is from Lancashire. The other is a John Speake, Rifle Brigade who died 4/5/1915 and is commemorated at Ypres on the Menin Gate.
-
Has I mentioned previous; I am clutching at straws, no evidence that J is John, or even John Herbert Speake. With very little to go on and no army records to make a positive identity I turned to the census. There is no guarantee that the casualty J Speake on the war memorial is John Herbert Speake but with so little to go on I was hoping to find some clue that would help identify him. Speake is an unusual surname for Brithdir and with William Speake and family residing at Rock House in the village and likewise John Herbert Speake a boarder living close by, I hoped searching this family via the census might offer some lead that would help identify the casualty J Speake.