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Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Wales => Caernarvonshire => Topic started by: sallyyorks on Sunday 17 May 15 15:19 BST (UK)
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While searching for some Smith ancestors from north Wales, I came across this large household (in lodgings?) in Drum St, Bangor. But I am having trouble finding them on any later census or other records.
It states all born "foreign parts" (it is clearly an "F" on the image), except for one person *.
Listing them as transcribed on a*y. No occupations listed ?
1841 Census
Bangor
Piece 1398
Book 2
Folio 13
Page 17
Joseph Brockey (Buckley/Brinckley?)1813
John Batty 1821
Leedise Roboth (Roberts?) 1811
Leason Rostgeney 1801
Thomas Bischell (Boswell?) 1819
Fredlock Boswell * 1827 ?
Fredluke Jolan 1838
Joseph Brokely 1841
Starma Boswell 1819
Sarah Boswell 1821
Andrew Smith 1790
Isasy Smith 1784 ?
Ceely Robet (Roberts?) 1830
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Hi
The people shown are not necessarily related to each other unless you know differently?
Why did you single this entry out? Are your Smith ancestors Andrew & Issy? as shown on the entry?
Given their ages - have you checked for deaths for them?
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Hi Carole
Yes I know they might not be related but they are all in the same "household"
No I don't know "differently", its the first time ive seen them.
I "singled the entry out" because I am looking for a Sarah Smith b 1784 North Wales? on the 1841 census and can't find her.
The same Sarah Smith buried at Llanarmon-yn-lal 1845? (burial gives age at death b1784) . Widow of Robert Smith (occ miner) who died before 1841. They had children bapt at Mold and at Llanarmon-yn-lal. Also a possible connection with a Bangor bapt 1802 ? Don't have the marriage.
One of the children was Charlotte Smith b 1814 Llanarmon-yn-lal. She is my line and I have the further info on her.
There are not many Smiths in N.Wales and I am trying to get back further.
Thanks for reply
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Smith and Boswell are well-known gipsy family names, so they could be 'under the radar' so to speak, on later census returns.
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Hi Keith.
Yes I thought they might be when I saw Boswell. Perhaps they are visiting family and have just arrived from or are going back to the States? Was thinking that the two Smiths might not have been in the same household and they just got put together on census by mistake
The Sarah Smith 1784 I am looking for might be born somewhere in Flintshire or Denbighshire area, though I don't know for sure. I can't find her on the 1841 census but luckily for me there are not many Smiths in N. Wales at this time. I was surprised how few there are. I am hoping she is with relatives if I find her, as I don't know much about them . She would be a widow and so probably be near family.
I also remember visiting relatives in the Bangor area when I was a child. But I don't know if it was the same branch of family and could just be a coincidence
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I think the best way forward for you is to start with the 'definites.' Try and locate the family who you know for certain are your Bangor relatives and work your way back. All being well you should eventually reach the point where they and your family intersect.
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The problem is that I haven't got a clue who the "relatives" in Bangor were or when they moved there. I just remember we visited them when we used to go on holiday.
The definite is Charlotte Smith b 1814 Llanarmon-yn-lal. Daughter of Robert and Sarah Smith.
Sarah (a widow) b 1784 should be on the 1841 census but I cannot find her.
I can't find her daughter Charlotte either on the 1841. She is married to an Evan Edwards by then, who is about twenty years her senior. They have a baby, Mary Anne.
Sarah is buried at Llanarmon-yn-lal. I can't decipher where she was resident at the time of death. But I believe it is written in the register.
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Evan Edwards is given as from Nerquis Hall on the marriage certificate.Unfortunately,Nerquis(aka Nercwys) is one of the missing pieces of the 1841 census.Perhaps Sarah was staying with them.
Regards
Roger
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Evan Edwards is given as from Nerquis Hall on the marriage certificate.Unfortunately,Nerquis(aka Nercwys) is one of the missing pieces of the 1841 census.Perhaps Sarah was staying with them.
Regards
Roger
Hi Roger
Nercwys Hall is on the 1841 census . With a long list of servants/ farm servants, ag labs and the like. There is an Evan Edwards (farm servant) there (and a possible for Evans spinster? sister Jane, who is with them on a later census) but the age is quite a long way out and no Charlotte and Mary Anne.
I suppose where they lived might be missing though. And unfortunately Charlotte's mum Sarah might be with them on the missing pieces too. I had hoped to find her in another area.
I was trying to research as many Smith families as I could figure out. It isn't as daunting as it sounds, as Smith is not a common name in N Wales at the earlier dates (late 18thC).
There are other Smith marriages in this family too. Charlotte's daughter, Sarah, marries a Smith. The same Sarah's second husbands first wife was also a Smith.
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In the Llanarmon-yn-Ial parish register transcripts published by the Clwyd FHS, there is a marriage in 1801 between Robert SMITH and Sarah SIMON.
Also a Llanarmon-yn-Ial burial for a Robert SMITH, age 58 in 1834.
In 1776 there is a baptism at Llanarmon yn Ial for a Robert SMITH, s/o Thomas and Rose.
I checked for a baptism for Sarah SIMON at Llanarmon but it is not appear to be recorded at that location.
Upon checking the Mold baptisms, there is one for a Sarah SIMON in early 1785, d/o John (miner) and Mary.
Many of the lead mining families migrated from Derbyshire to Flintshire then Denbighshire during the early to mid 18th century, hence the proliferation of "English" surnames in the registers!
Hope this helps
Heather
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Wow Heather. I don't know what to say. Thank you so much for looking up this info for me :)
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You are very welcome sallyyorks :) These new leads should help you on your way further back.
It's been a few years since researching my lead mining families in North Wales of Denbighshire and Flintshire. I got lucky by finding a link back to Youlgreave, Derbyshire so a lot more fell into place for the families I was searching for.
I hesitated a few months ago when it came to clear out the printed books but now I'm glad I kept them ;)
All the best
Heather
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I'm glad you kept them too. Your post has been a great help :)