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General => The Common Room => Topic started by: Rishile on Friday 22 May 15 19:51 BST (UK)

Title: Would this have been a crime?
Post by: Rishile on Friday 22 May 15 19:51 BST (UK)
I found this newspaper article about my Gtx3 Grandfather and wondered if this is really a crime?  I'm sure there were a lot about at that time - and most of them in my family  :)
Title: Re: Would this have been a crime?
Post by: Rosinish on Friday 22 May 15 20:05 BST (UK)
I would assume so as it was a Magistrate & would he refer to "prison" if it wasn't the case  ???

What year was this & Where  ???

Annie

Title: Re: Would this have been a crime?
Post by: CaroleW on Friday 22 May 15 20:06 BST (UK)
No different to today - it's a crime to fail to support your children unless illness/unemployment etc prevents it

Title: Re: Would this have been a crime?
Post by: Victor Harvey on Friday 22 May 15 20:08 BST (UK)
Hi,
I have recently been researching ledgers of Previous Convictions at Gloucester Goal for a fellow RootsChatterer and I can assure you that non-maintenance was a crime generally resulting in a fine or Hard Labour.
Victor
Title: Re: Would this have been a crime?
Post by: Rishile on Friday 22 May 15 20:08 BST (UK)
Quote from: ammack on Friday 22 May 15 20:05 BST (UK)
What year was this & Where  ???

Annie

This was in Tormorham, Devon in 1848. 

Rishile
Title: Re: Would this have been a crime?
Post by: stanmapstone on Friday 22 May 15 20:45 BST (UK)
It was a crime under Section 3 of the Vagrancy Act 1824 http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1824/83/pdfs/ukpga_18240083_en.pdf and the penalty was for hard labour for any time not exceeding one calendar month.
See http://www.duhaime.org/LegalDictionary/V/Vagrancy.aspx
Stan
Title: Re: Would this have been a crime?
Post by: wee mammy on Friday 22 May 15 21:01 BST (UK)
It was a crime even in Scotland. My own grandfather in 1915 was given 30 days for neglecting his family as he was away at sea and never sent them any money.
Title: Re: Would this have been a crime?
Post by: stanmapstone on Friday 22 May 15 21:51 BST (UK)
A Vagrancy Definition: A criminal offence of being intentionally unemployed and thereby neglecting to maintain himself or his family.

Stan
Title: Re: Would this have been a crime?
Post by: alanmack on Friday 22 May 15 22:26 BST (UK)
Must've changed a bit by now though Stan. I caught a burglar in my garage a couple of years ago. He was charged and convicted, not of burglary, housebreaking etc, but with Vagrancy. He got 10 months. I felt cheated  ???

alanmack
Title: Re: Would this have been a crime?
Post by: stanmapstone on Saturday 23 May 15 08:10 BST (UK)
The Vagrancy Act has been frequently amended since 1824. See http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/Geo4/5/83

Stan


Title: Re: Would this have been a crime?
Post by: Rishile on Saturday 23 May 15 18:24 BST (UK)
Thank you for all your replies.  It appears he may have got off lightly then.

Rishile
Title: Re: Would this have been a crime?
Post by: Geoff-E on Saturday 23 May 15 20:20 BST (UK)
I came across this a while back (1895)
Title: Re: Would this have been a crime?
Post by: suey on Saturday 23 May 15 21:29 BST (UK)

There is a sad story on one of the branches in my family tree.  I have a lady who aged 50 in 1939 who was sentenced to 14 days, described as an "aged female tramp".  Sentenced again in 1940 to 21 days hard labour for Vagrancy and failing to provide a valid identity card.

This lady had been widowed some 8 years or so earlier and it seems that she could not find employment and things had gone from bad to worse for her.  Sadly I don't know what became of her.  I can't find a death registration so wonder if she simply died with no-one knowing who she was or where she was from.