RootsChat.Com
England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Yorkshire (East Riding & York) => Topic started by: Pennines on Monday 08 June 15 18:54 BST (UK)
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I wonder if anyone can help me please.
Strange as it may seem, I have been contacted by an Heir Hunting Company who found the names of my husband's Irish grandparents on my Ancestry Family tree. The tree is private -- so they must have searched for each name separately. It is apparantly an intestacy case going back to 1991 - so must relate to one of my father in law's brothers/sisters. Sadly all his generation, who we know of, -- have passed away. I haven't been given a name of the person who has died intestate.
The company is DS Researchers of Main St, Willerby, Hull.
They do have a website --- but have been communicating with me, requesting family information -- by email, initially via Ancestry - but I was then given their email address -- so now we are corresponding by email.
Has anyone had any dealings with this company please? Does anybody know of it?
I am naturally reticent to give name, address details etc - of my husband's family to this 'company' and I don't live anywhere near Hull, so I cannot just pop along and into their office.
I would be very grateful for any information anyone may have about this firm. I just need to know that they are what they say they are.
Many thanks in advance.
Pennines
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I can't help with any personal knowledge of DS Researchers, but from a check on the Companies House website they appear to be a legitimate registered company.
Jebber
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They will no doubt take a large cut for doing this.. you could check the bona vacantia list yourself and do it all yourself if you find something ;-) They provide a list of all unclaimed estates in .csv format and tell you how to claim it yourself without paying a company a large chunk to do it for you.
https://www.gov.uk/government/statistical-data-sets/unclaimed-estates-list
Also worth noting DS researchers have a web site with a warning over fake emails pretending to be from them... If you are unsure and want to go ahead with their services I would call them directly. http://dsresearchers.co.uk/
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Not on their site but this link could be useful
http://www.titleresearch.com/heirhunterfees/know_your_rights
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Thank you SO very much everyone for your helpful advice and the useful links.
I used them all --- may have identified a possible person on the Bona Vacantia list who this case could refer to.
I have printed the 'Heir Hunters - Know Your Rights' article from the link provided as well.
I have also rung the company this morning. This has set my mind at rest that this is a genuine case -- and I have been given a reference number. They are now going to write to us to put things on a formal footing.
My grateful thanks to you all.
Regards
Pennines
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Mum had a letter from DS Researchers today claiming they were looking for a beneficiary which could be her. The letter said they were looking for someone with my mum's name and even included her year of birth and the names of her parents. We don't know if the letter is genuine or who the deceased person could be.
I checked the Bona Vacantia list and found a Baverstock on there who has the same first names as my nan's cousin and who was born Kentish Town, London which was where my mum's mum was from. So far, so good, all the names and places match. However the date of birth on the Bona Vacantia list differs from his known date of birth which we have from his birth certificate and baptism record, plus other sources. Could the date on the Bona Vacantia list be wrong? Or could this be a sign that this letter is a scam?
Matthew
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Hi Matthew,
DS Researchers approached me via my Family Tree on Ancestry as I had both the parents of a particular deceased person in my Family Tree. Like you I was very sceptical -- things like this don't happen to normal people do they! So I rang the company, after looking at their website;
http://dsresearchers.co.uk/contacts.html
I spoke to a lady named Anna. They were genuine in my case and were able to give me a case number reference.
Funnily enough the birth date on the Bona Vacantia list was exactly 1 year out from the deceased's date of birth on the death certificate. The date and the month were correct - but the year was wrong.
I emailed the Bona vacantia people to explain this and to ask where they had obtained the date of birth from -- they had obtained it from the Benefits Agency - so I figured that was the correct date. Whoever had registered the death must have been a year out.
DS Researchers charge 25%. The family decided to go it alone as we figured it would be a very small estate (it was an old case - 1991 -- someone would have picked it up earlier as the amounts used to be shown on the list).
In your case I figure that they will have done some homework to see if it's worth pursuing before researching beneficiaries.
If you want to contact me by personal message - to see how we went on - please feel free to do so.
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Hi Matt
Have a look at my link in reply #3.
Contact the company and ask who the deceased person is. They should tell you.
Dawn
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Hi Matt
Have a look at my link in reply #3.
Contact the company and ask who the deceased person is. They should tell you.
Dawn
Hi thanks for that. I've checked the Bona Vacantia list and have found someone who matches a member of our family tree. The only puzzle is that the date of birth on the Bona Vacantia list is different to what we have.
Matt
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which is why is suggested phoning the company.
It could be another relative.
Under the rules of intestacy in England and Wales, depending on the classification of the deceased person, the researchers can go back to the deceased person's grandparents, then look at all their children and if deceased, their children.
They don't work on the grandparents siblings.
The person they are researching could be a more distant relative.
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which is why is suggested phoning the company.
It could be another relative.
Under the rules of intestacy in England and Wales, depending on the classification of the deceased person, the researchers can go back to the deceased person's grandparents, then look at all their children and if deceased, their children.
They don't work on the grandparents siblings.
The person they are researching could be a more distant relative.
Good point, thanks for that. The one advantage of being a family historian is that you tend to accumulate lots of lists of names and dates of birth etc. I've compiled a database of all our relations and their dates of birth, baptism, marriage (if known), and death (if known) or burial. I'll check the dates we have and the sources and go from there. Could they have the wrong details though?
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Have the company given you the name of the deceased person they are researching and their date of death?
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If you look at that person on the Bona Vacantia list of unclaimed estates -- and tab to the right along that Excel Spreadsheet -- there is often additional information contained there that you cannot immediately see by just looking at the name section.
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Hi this is Anna from DSResearchers:
I note your comments, and what I would like to say if somebody is sceptical about letters they receive from ourselves or other companies they should call the company in the first place. You will soon realise if the letter is genuine or a scam.
With regards to Matthew's listing, yes the Bona Vacantia has the wrong date of birth for the deceased. This is currently going through administration and there are quite a number of relatives.
Anna
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..... in continuation:
With regards to people sorting out their own claims they should note:
1. The purchase of the certificates or documents they may require might not be covered by the amount of money they receive back.
2. Under intestate law, they will need to find all the beneficiaries and prove them before the funds from the estate can be distributed. If there is a significant amount and only a known hand full of beneficiaries are paid, then the personal representative may find themselves in court.
I hope this is helpful.
Anna
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Hi Anna,
I am the person who first started this thread, being unable to believe that an heir-hunting company were looking into a case relating to anyone connected with me! After raising the topic on this board I took the advice of Rootschatters and rang you. You will be pleased to know that I was immediately reassured that everything was above board.
I thought others may be interested in the outcome of this case.
The deceased lady was called Mary -- she was Irish and the eldest of 10 children. She had apparantly died in Eastbourne some years ago.
The mystery was - no-one in the family had ever heard of her. My father in law was always reminiscing about his life in Ireland - you could never shut him up (!) -- but Mary was never mentioned.
Unfortunately all of her generation had passed away - so theories abounded that she had become pregnant and run away from Ireland, or - as the eldest of 10 - had to be a 'little mother' to her siblings - and just revolted and left home. Was it a case of 'her name must never be mentioned in this house again'?
5 other siblings eventually settled in England - but Mary was never included, or mentioned, in family meet ups. She had never married.
We went alone on this case, figuring that it would not be worth much and there were 24 cousins!
Administratively it was hard work - we had to produce all sorts of evidence and send it to the Bona Vacantia people. Once they had 'ticked' the boxes on the first batch - we had to produce the next batch and so on and so on. Postage cost a lot as well, as we wanted to send each batch securely.
The estate was worth only £1,800 - and there were 24 beneficiaries. The bona-vacantia people also took out their costs. However we wanted to go through with it, out of interest, just to experience what these things involved.
One of the cousins went down to Eastbourne and was taken to where Mary's ashes were buried in the local cemetery - and we all have a photograph of her final resting place.
It just seems SO sad that this lady had family over here, but appeared to have been estranged for so many years. It was certainly an intruiging discovery -- and we would never have known abour her had we not been contacted by DS Researchers. So thank you Anna -- your company gave us - as a family- a most fascinating time.
Thank you also to everyone who gave me advice initially at the outset of this case.
Regards June
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Good to hear something came out of that case June, it is always good to hear that people are interested in the family history part of the case, because the money part is sometimes more disappointing.
Anna
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There have been 2x similarly-named companies,
Comment regarding a previous post -
Up front, they do not have to tell you who(the case) that they are investigating.
If you sign up to have them work for you then expect to pay them a commission and you should also expect to pay a solicitor's fee (to them). Then and only then will they confirm the details of the estate.
They have already carried out sufficient research to align (but not connect) you with the deceased.
If, that is, their research was correct.
HeirHunters do not do this for free.
Back to this case . . . . . they may be working to exclude people.
Ray
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Up front, they do not have to tell you who(the case) that they are investigating.
If you sign up to have them work for you then expect to pay them a commission and you should also expect to pay a solicitor's fee (to them). Then and only then will they confirm the details of the estate.
They have already carried out sufficient research to align you with the deceased.
If, that is, their research was correct.
HeirHunters do not do this for free.
Ray
Just because they don't, doesn't make it right.
If anyone is contacted by an heir hunting or probate genealogical company, google "heir hunters know your rights" and read the many articles that are listed before going any further.
If you are legally entitiled, the administrator has a legal duty to distribute your share to you.
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Hi Dawn
I didn't distinguish between right or wrong.
I was building up to the last sentence in my post.
Googling for answers may not get you the correct answer.
See Govt Legal Dept link below.
There is no substitute for your own proper legal advice, if you are at all unhappy.
See GLD link below for a better definition / davice.
Government Legal Dept should be the ones to talk to, in the first instance
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01jv4/ (https://www.gov.uk/guidance/make-a-claim-to-a-deceased-persons-estate#make-a-claim-to-bvd)
Ray
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Ray you are not correct in what you say.
Just to give you a scenario : A deceased man with an uncommon name has died, you find a birth in the database that fits, you find a marriage that fits, you find a daughter. You check that there may have been a divorce so that fits, you find the daughter and ask her if her parents divorced, and if her father was born in the year that you have for the deceased. She asks what it is all about and you tell her that you think it is her father that died, she asks when, you say about 6 months ago, then she tells you that she saw him 2 weeks ago!
So how can it be a good thing to tell somebody that a relative has died before you have purchased all the certificates that will prove or disprove that you have the correct family? The researchers will only start to buy the certificates once they have a signed agreement from you. Then if they are wrong then it has been at their expense as they took the risk.
All cases have to be administered and each case is different depending on what is involved, therefore the charges for administration are to the estate and not the person.
Please don't give out information about legal things when you are only guessing as this is not fair and it can confuse people.
A
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with regards to the Government Legal Department, they deal only with Bona Vacantia cases. That means ownerless property/goods. So if somebody submits a fully documented claim to them, they will drop it like a ton of bricks and have no more to do with it, it is not their job. They will only deal with it if there are NO relatives.
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.the person who administers an intestate estate is a Personal Representative with a capital P and R. Yes there is only one in the majority of cases. They have a duty to make sure that distribution is only made to people that can prove their blood line and not to someone who says they are entitled because they are a relative.
A scenario: 4 children to the deceased man's estate. 2 have signed with a Researcher and 2 haven't, so is it correct that the other two are paid without proving through certificates that they are entitled?
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Anna
I have given no legal advice.
What I repeat here, from my earlier post, is . . . . .
"See Govt Legal Dept link below.
There is no substitute for your own proper legal advice, if you are at all unhappy."
The link ensures people are singing from the same song sheet, including me.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01jv4/ (https://www.gov.uk/guidance/make-a-claim-to-a-deceased-persons-estate#make-a-claim-to-bvd)
which includes their definition ( 2nd para ) . . . . .
"The Bona Vacantia division (BVD) of the Government Legal Department administers the estates of people who die without blood relatives and without leaving a Will."
Ray
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Ray
Most contracts with a researcher advises that potential beneficiaries seek legal advice.
Also as I have said Bona Vacantia only administer estates where there are NO relatives as per their website.
A