RootsChat.Com

Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Orkney => Topic started by: joker on Sunday 19 July 15 02:33 BST (UK)

Title: Matilda Clouston Irving
Post by: joker on Sunday 19 July 15 02:33 BST (UK)
Researching Matilda Irvine/Irving, daughter of James and Margaret, of Sandwick, Orkney, born circa 1837. She married in Ontario Canada to Thomas Shelton.   Now I find a Matilda Clouston Irvine/Irving  child of same people......have never seen middle name of Clouston before.   Family Search gives 1841 Census with James, Margaret, matilda, James Jr and Lumina.....trying to find 1851 Census perhaps of family....and a marriage of James and Margaret.  Hope someone can help. Thank you!
Joker
Title: Re: Matilda Clouston Irving
Post by: whiteout7 on Sunday 19 July 15 05:43 BST (UK)
I can see Lumina as Jemima on the 1841 census for Sandwick, Orkney on Freecen.co.uk

Orkney, Sanwick, Freecen 1841:
Piece: SCT1841/27 Place: Sandwick -Orkney Enumeration District: 3
Civil Parish: Sandwick Ecclesiastical Parish, Village or Island: -
Folio: 3 Page: 11
Address: Lower Aith, Chamber Of Aith
James Irving M 40 Agricultural Labourer, born Orkney
Margaret Irving F 35, born Orkney
James Irving M 5, born Orkney
Matilda F 4, born Orkney
Jemima F 1, born Orkney

From the IGI
James Irvine
Scotland, Marriages, 1561-1910
marriage: 2 March 1830
Sandwick, Orkney, Scotland
spouse: Margaret Corgile

Their Children all born in Sandwick, Orkney:
Margaret Irivineborn 8th May 1831
Isobella Howie Currie Garson Irvine born 24th June1832
Meran Irvine born 21st March 1834
James Irvine born 25th May 1835
Matilda Clouston Irvine born 20th April 1837
Jemima Irvine  born 16th April 1840
Ann Irvine born 1842 (? born in Sandwick? Not in IGI this one)

Matilda Irving/Irvine is not a common name in the 1851 census (paid version) for Scotland
http://www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk/people/matilda_irvine_1836_1852
and
http://www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk/people/matilda_irving_1836_1852

Old Parish Records Banns & Marriages 1829 - 1831 (paid version) show Margaret Corgile's marriage but not sure the original image would tell much more:
http://www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk/people/margaret_corgile_1829_1831


Title: Re: Matilda Clouston Irving
Post by: whiteout7 on Sunday 19 July 15 07:13 BST (UK)
I think I can explain where the Clouston name comes from too. I think it was borrowed from the parish priest - Revd. Mr Charles Clouston.

I think your James Irvine (born c1801) may have had an illegitmate daughter before he married Margaret Corgil with a lady called Catherine Johnston the daughter named Janet Irvine (born 1825)

"Nor was there any Irving in Sandwick in 1851" (This explains the lack of records to find)  - This website may be of direct interest to you as it has lots of information on the Irvings/Irvine of Sandwick: http://joomla.quivis.co.uk/LINKLATER/gedcom_pages/indiI29.html

"As for James Irvine/Irving, according to one source he, his wife Margaret and their unnatural children (meaning lawful children of marriage) Margaret, Isabella, Mareon, James, Matilda, Jamima and Anne emigrated to Tuckeresmith, Huron, Ontario, in 1842."

By the sounds of it James Irvine's natural daughter Janet Irvine married a David Linklater and continued living in Sandwick.
Title: Re: Matilda Clouston Irving and family members
Post by: joker on Sunday 19 July 15 17:41 BST (UK)
Thank you whiteout7 for all your information.  I really appreciate this.  Had information on the birth/christenings of several of the children, but couldn't find them when they arrived in Canada.  On my way out now, but will study it further when I get home...and can put it with the history I'm working on!   Thanks again.
Joker.
Title: Re: Matilda Clouston Irving
Post by: bjroossien on Friday 30 December 16 17:03 GMT (UK)


I found this noted birth in the Orkney Family Historical Society

58725   21/05/1837   Birth of Matilda Clouston Irvine (F), 1837-05-21, Sandwick
Dau of James IRVINE & Margaret CORGILE
[IGI/OPR Index: 1837-027]
Title: Re: Matilda Clouston Irving
Post by: trish1120 on Saturday 31 December 16 10:24 GMT (UK)
Likely Baptism for James;

James IRVINE, 28 Dec 1802, Parish Church, Sandwick
Parents JOHN/MARGRAT Irvine (Margrat nee GARSON)
Abode Northdick
(FreeREG)
Siblings;
N (female), 17 Feb 1788
JOHN, 28 Dec 1794
PETER, 9 Feb 1800
(may be others not on FreeREG)

Possible Marriage same Church 1786
John IRVINE to * GARSON, abode Northdick
(FreeREG)
Title: Re: Matilda Clouston Irving
Post by: trish1120 on Saturday 31 December 16 10:32 GMT (UK)
deleted
Title: Re: Matilda Clouston Irving
Post by: Gtyler8 on Friday 19 October 18 03:40 BST (UK)
Joker et al.,

I found this posting several years late, but hopefully not too late.  I descend from Matilda Clouston Irvine's sister (Mary) Anne Irvine.  I've been trying to track down Anne's family for years and am pretty certain that I've succeeded. 

This is what I know from family lore and available records:  my great grandmother, Mary Anne Irvine, was born in Canada in December of 1842.  I found Mary Anne Irvine in the 1861 Canada census living with the Angus family in Tuckersmith, Ontario.  She married one their sons, Francis Angus, in 1862 in Tuckersmith, Canada. On the marriage certificate, her parents are listed as James Irvine and Margaret. But Iíve had an extremely difficult time figuring out which James Irvine and Margaret from Scotland were her parents.

In looking at various James Irvine/Margaret combinations, I did find one in the 1841 Scottish census for Sandwick, Orkney; the one noted by whiteout7 in an earlier response.  Comparing AncestryDNA results, I have matches with descendants of James and Margaret's other children.  So, I feel pretty confident that this is the correct family.  And pictures that I have of Mary Anne seem to show a resemblance to pictures I have seen of Matilda Clouston Irving/e.

Iíve found birth records in the Scottish records for all of the other children, but not my Mary Anne; which is what Iíd expect because she always reported her birth location as Canada.

This would have been a year before my Mary Anne was born. And the children show up in various records as having an 1842 arrival date in Canada. So I suspect that the family traveled to Canada in 1842 and Mary was likely born less than a year after her parents' arrival. 

I'm still trying to hunt down a birth record for Mary Anne Irvine in Canada, and I would love to know more about these families if anyone is willing to share what they know. 

And to add another theory for the origin Clouston middle name:  James Irvine's brother Nicoal Irvine married a woman named Margaret Clouston.  So, maybe Margaret Clouston Irvine was named after her aunt?
Title: Re: Matilda Clouston Irving
Post by: hoganmel on Wednesday 24 February 21 15:52 GMT (UK)
Hi there!
I am excited b/c we are most likely related!
We might even be matched DNA-wise on Ancestry, but I don't know your name, so...

Matilda's other daughter Margaret (Maggie) is my great-grandmother. So our ancestors were sisters.
I even have a photo of of Matilda and two of the daughters (not Maggie). One is Anne.

Clouston shows up as a last name in baptismal records that I bought from Sandwick last night. I also wonder if it is a Confirmation type middle name? Matilda did not show up in those baptismal records as I had hoped, but other last names (Garson, Irvine/Irving) showed up that are probably extended relatives/ancestors who stayed in Orkney.

I would love to chat more--I live less than 4 hrs from ancestral locations in Canada (in Michigan). I wish the border would open. We had a 2020 trip planned down toward Lake Erie and also Waterloo County for research!

Melissa Hogan
(not my real name. My great-grandfather changed his name when he left Quebec and went to Ontario. He met my great-grandmother Margaret Shelton there. My family has had all this information recorded in a huge notebook since the 1970s).
Title: Re: Matilda Clouston Irving
Post by: hoganmel on Wednesday 24 February 21 16:01 GMT (UK)
Thank you, @whiteout for your information!
Are you related or just helping out?

Matilda Irving won't show up in the later censuses b/c her family emigrated to Ontario
when she was a child (early 1840s). I never really paid much attention to that and always wondered how a Shelton from north of London hooked up with a maid from Orkney, which as remote as you can get. Well, they met in Canada!

I cannot wait for our 2024 trip to the UK. Easy tour to plan by myself and hopefully hit some "this is where my ancestors lived" spots on the way.

Thank you to others with the paid sites who have found the actual images to back everything up. I can still see the name Irvine/Irving in Orkney today, but it isn't common. I would think there are more Irvings/Irvines near where the Clan Castle is? (was reading up more about it this past week).

Title: Re: Matilda Clouston Irving
Post by: Forfarian on Wednesday 24 February 21 21:20 GMT (UK)
Clouston shows up as a last name in baptismal records that I bought from Sandwick last night. I also wonder if it is a Confirmation type middle name?
Not if they belonged to the Church of Scotland; in the C of S you don't get confirmed and there is no tradition of adding middle names on the occasion of a non-existent event. I believe, but am willing to be corrected, that the same applies to all the dissenting presbyterian denominations in Scotland.

It is very common for people to acquire in later life a middle name that doesn't appear on their baptism record. I have read that this is because the Kirk did not recognise middle names as significant, but I have not seen any definitive statement that this is or was the case.
Title: Re: Matilda Clouston Irving
Post by: hoganmel on Wednesday 24 February 21 23:25 GMT (UK)
You knowómy brain didnít register the parish wasnít Catholic. I have so many Catholic ancestors in Protestant nations...good point!!!!!