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Research in Other Countries => Australia => Topic started by: GeorgiyH on Wednesday 29 July 15 10:59 BST (UK)
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Hello, I am trying to find out more of the background of the great-grandfather of a friend of mine. I was able to take his wife's side back quite a way, but this gentleman has me stuck. His name was Donald Morgan Evans, son of David and Elizabeth (Death registration number 36470/1962). He was born around 1902 and died in Wellington NSW in 1962. A David Evans, son of Seth and Jane, is recorded as having died in Wellington, 1924; there are two Elizabeth Evans deaths in Wellington - one in 1937, the other in 1953. There seems to be a Seth and Jane Evans based in Newcastle in the 1880s.
If anyone is able to help me work out some more details about this family I would really appreciate it. Thanks in advance
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Hi GeorgiyH
On Trove there is a memorial for David Evans who died in 1924 at Wellington - with sons Donald and Thomas, and grandson William and wife Elizabeth. Does this fit with other info you have?
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/137386336?searchTerm=%22donald%20evans%22&searchLimits=l-category=Family+Notices
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/143265611?searchTerm=%22donald%20evans%22&searchLimits=l-category=Family+Notices|||l-state=New+South+Wales
If this is your man he was 87 in 1924, so born about 1837.
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Also had a daughter Ida and son-in-law Will CAMERON.
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/141548542?searchTerm=%22david%20evans%22%20elizabeth&searchLimits=l-category=Family+Notices|||l-state=New+South+Wales|||l-title=660
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There's also this interesting memorial
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/141611797?searchTerm=%22david%20evans%22%20elizabeth&searchLimits=l-category=Family+Notices|||l-state=New+South+Wales|||l-title=660
Christina Ann DREW died aged 90 in 1920. Daughter and "sister-in-law" Lizzie and David Evans and grandchildren Ida, Thomas and Donald.
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Yes, that fits in with the information I have found.
I also found the obituary for Elizabeth's mother: OBITUARY.
The death took place on Tuesday last
at her daughter's residence in Fergus-
son's Lane, of Mrs. Christina Drew,
at the great age of 90 years, the cause
of death being senile decay. The de-
ceased lady had been living in the Ba-
thurst district for the past 30 or 40
years, and she came up to her daugh-
ter's residence (Mrs. D. Evans), at
Micketymulga, in the hopes that her
health would improve, and later on
she was brought into town so as to be
near her medical adviser, and despite
every care and attention she passed
away as stated. The late Mrs. Drew
was a native of Dublin (Ireland), and
came to this country with her parents
when quite a young girl. She was mar-
ried three times, her first husband be-
ing Mr. John Moss, whom she married
in Sydney. Afterwards she was wed-
ded to Mr. Edward Ryan, at Ba-
thurst, her third husband being Mr.
Henry Drew, who also pre-deceascd her.
She is survived by three daughters and
one son, the former being Mrs. D.
Evans (Micketymulga), Mrs. Potter
(Condobolin), and Mrs. J. Mitchett
(Cowra), the son being Mr. Charles
Drew, of Cowra. After a short service
at St. Patrick's Church, the remains
were interred in the R.C. portion of
the Wellington cemetery yesterday af-
ternoon, the services at the graveside
being read by the Rev. Mons. Long.
The funeral arrangements were carried
out by Mr. C. J. Shakespeare.
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There are a number of online trees that have him as the son of a Seth Evans who died in 1899, however, this particular Seth was born in the 1840s, so right name, wrong man!
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Yes, looks like that Seth's wife was "Gwen"
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/139875615?searchTerm=%22seth%20evans%22&searchLimits=l-category=Family+Notices|||l-state=New+South+Wales
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Yes, so certainly the wrong person there. I guess with a name like Evans, they are ultimately from Wales.But who came over? David or Seth?
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No David Evans born in NSW or Qld with father Seth in the right time frame, so I would guess David came from os (of course he may have been somewhere else in Australia). Too many David Evans on FreeBDM in England! Without knowing where they came from, very difficult ???
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Yes, it will be hard to track. Story goes they are from Pembrokeshire, but I haven't found anything there. David Evans is common enough, but Seth seems rarer.
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Actually, taking a step back, I can't see any births for Donald EVANS in NSW around 1902 - is this date correct? There is a Thomas Seth EVANS with mother Elizabeth born in Wellington in 1901, but I'm wondering now if Donald who died in 1962 with parents David and Elizabeth is definitely from this family? (Think I'm getting myself confused now ;))
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Definitely from this family from information via his descendants and newspaper reports - Donald mentioned as grandson in several in memoriam columns for David. It is strange not finding a registered birth though - I have had no luck either. Maybe there is a mistranscription in the records.
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Can't see a marriage for David Evans and Elizabeth in NSW.
There is a David and Elizabeth EVANS arrive in Melbourne from England in 1862, aged 30 and 23 (from "The Ship's List"), but I don't think this is your couple as the obit above implies Elizabeth was born in NSW.
Going back again, looking at Elizabeth's mother's obit, I can see the marriage of Henry DREW and "Hannah" RYAN at Bathurst in 1898, and Edward RYAN and Hannah WARREN at Bathurst (Roman Catholic) in 1850, but can't find a marriage for John MOSS and Hannah (or Christina) in Sydney before this. (Or someone WARREN and Hannah before this.) So not sure what Elizabeth's maiden was.
They certainly are an elusive family.
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Hi there,
May I ask you to type up information from any of the relevant NSW BDM documents that you hold. There's often quite detailed information on those records. The Official Transcriptions will provide you with the same level of detail so, if you have these instead of the real deal (and more expensive) documents, I am sure there's many NSW based RChatters who are willing to help. I know I am happy to to go through my many off line NSW resources to help you unravel these ancestors, but I need clues.
Cheers, JM
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1930 Electoral Roll NSW Wellington.
Donald Morgan EVANS, Dibbs Street Wellington, Labourer
Elizabeth EVANS, Dibbs Street, Wellington, home duties
Thomas Seth EVANS, 2 Dibbs Street, Wellington, labourer
ADD:
http://www.bdm.nsw.gov.au/Pages/family-history/family-history.aspx
Thomas S's birth registered Wellington NSW born 31 December 1901. The index has his Mother as Elizabeth EVANS, but his father's names not displayed. In that era, babies births registered under the surname that Mum was known by at that time. Thomas is indexed under both MOSS and EVANS. # 27845/1901
Perhaps the following birth may be of interest?
Donald M, mother as Elizabeth MOSS , no father's name displayed, registered Wellington NSW born 29 January 1903. Donald is indexed under MOSS, # 8363/1903
Cheers, JM
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Re Christina DREW (Elizabeth's Mum)
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/158718786 17 May 1920 National Advocate, Bathurst
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/141614278 13 May 1920 Wellington Times (live link for Obit given earlier by OP)
So, there's a John MOSS mentioned as Christina's first husband, then an Edward RYAN, and thirdly Henry DREW. Is it likely that Elizabeth's maiden name was MOSS?
Cheers, JM
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Yes, I agree the maiden name is Moss. It looks like she and David Evans lived de facto for many years as there is a marriage between David Evans and Elizabeth Moss in 1919.
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Will add registration records later this evening, :)
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May I suggest that before you "add registration records later this evening" that you obtain the actual records, and carefully verify the information on those records to ensure they do belong to this particular family that you are researching for a friend of yours.
NSW BDM certificates are quite informative, and the NSW BDM appointed Official Transcription Agents provide an excellent service.
http://www.bdm.nsw.gov.au/Pages/family-history/family-history.aspx (Scroll down :) )
"Ask a family history transcription agent
Family history transcription agents provide full and partial transcriptions, or verification of details. A good idea if you only need the facts, and not full certified copies of certificates. For more details and fees, see below."
Cheers, JM
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There may have been impediment for David and Elizabeth to marry.
Charles Ernest EVANS, aged 29 years and 10 months enlisted for AIF in September 1916. His dad was his next of kin. Dad was David, living at Mickety Mulga, via Wellington.
http://recordsearch.naa.gov.au/SearchNRetrieve/Interface/ViewImage.aspx?B=1908585
Cheers, JM
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http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/143233544 Wellington Times 7 January 1918
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/137916039 Wellington Times 21 December 1905
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/138975046 Wellington Times 27 November 1902
David Evans, previously mail contractor until 1911 route changed.
ADD
NSW ER 1903 ROBERTSON, polling at Ponto
David EVANS, of Micketymulga, farmer
Elizabeth EVANS of Micketymulga, domestic duties
Add 2
Ida J EVANS and William CAMERON married 1921, registered Wellington NSW #8004
1930 Electoral Roll
Ida Jane CAMERON, Park St Wellington home duties
William CAMERON, Park St, Wellington, engineer
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/137386336 28 June 1926 Wellington Times.
TWO In Memoriam notices (both mentioned earlier on this thread, this is a different link :) )
In loving memory of our dear father who died 28th June 1924 aged 87 years and 4 months….
Inserted by his loving daughter and son in law, Ida and Will Cameron…
Also had a daughter Ida and son-in-law Will CAMERON.
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/141548542
Cheers, JM
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I am certain this is the right family based on what my friend passed on to me. Here is the information she gave.
"Donald was born in NSW his parents were David Evans and Elizabeth Evans (nee Moss) they were married in Orange NSW and Elizabeth was Davids 2nd wife, he first married Mary Evans (nee Davis) ..from what we can tell he was born in Pembrokeshire in South Wales and came from a mining family and when moved to Australia they became farmers and were given a plot of land we think just outside of NSW 😊
"oh and I believe Davids fathers name was Seth Evans but not sure of the Mum
"David and his first wife had 7 or so children and then he had 7 or so more with Elizabeth of which Donald was the youngest
"my aunty said the siblings didnt really associate after the death of the father David though I know some of the names are Eben Evans, Edith Evans, Ida Evans, James Evans off the top of my head ...and I believe there were some children who died in infancy also ...
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Well, may I suggest that if the family does not already have it, that they consider obtaining a transcription of the NSW BDM death for David Evans. These NSW records can be quite informative. And, as both Ida (daughter from first marriage) and Elizabeth (wife from second marriage) inserted In Memoriam in the Wellington Newspaper, I am of the view that the dc will have information about each marriage.
NSW BDM death certs (including official transcriptions) should give you his parents names, including Mum's nee (perhaps as he was 87 years 4 months when he died the informant may be relying on old memory), and his place of birth (hopefully the town/village and not just the country/colony), and the details of his marriages (how old when he married, who he married including her nee, where married) and under each of the marriages there should be a list of the names and ages of the (then) living children of each marriage, and the number and gender of any who had already succumbed.
May I mention that NSW BDM seems to have Charles Ernest's birth indexed, (at Rylstone) and his mum's name as displayed is not Mary :)
Cheers, JM
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I have ordered the death information for David Evans. Elizabeth Moss' side seems relatively straight forward.
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May I mention that NSW BDM seems to have Charles Ernest's birth indexed, (at Rylstone) and his mum's name as displayed is not Mary :)
Hi JM,
I think this birth is from 1900, so a bit late for Charles Earnest who was 29 in 1916, unless of course he was registered at 13 years old?
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http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/141301528 30 October 1944 Wellington Times
Obit for Charles Ernest EVANS, with mention of his parents and siblings, his wife and daughter ....
http://austcemindex.com/?surname=evans&cemname=Wellington
http://austcemindex.com/?surname=cameron&cemname=Wellington
http://austcemindex.com/
Cheers, JM
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Thank you for that - it is a very useful article!
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David's death registration came. He died in 1924 and had been in NSW approximately 67 years. He was born n Pembrokeshire Wales, son of brickmaker Seth Evans and Jane Morgan. Can not find any shipping for him, nor any info via ancestry.com for a birth in Wales.
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Hi, I'm from Wellington NSW and David Evans was my great grandfather. My grandfather was Arthur from his second marriage to Elizabeth Moss. Most of the children from this marriage were born before they married and were registered under Moss. I have a bit of information which I have gotten from relatives. So if there is something you need to know I may be able to help out.
Regards
Maria
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Hi Maria,
Thanks for the reply. I think if you write at least one more, you should be able to send me a message. I would be interested to hear some more information, so I can pass it on to my friend.
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Don’t know if you found his birth.
The is only one for 1857:
EVANS, DAVID mmn MORGAN
GRO Reference: 1857 M Quarter in SWANSEA UNION Volume 11A Page 482
However, if you search with a +-2, you get 10. Common names in WALES, I’m afraid.
Jamjar
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Yes, it was a while since I looked into this one - and I seem to recall there were a number of people of the same name and born in the same general area around the same time.
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There are no UK marriages between a Seth Evans and Jane Morgan between 1838 and 1870.
Not on the censuses, either.
Jamjar
Added: I read this incorrectly He died in 1924 and had been in NSW approximately 67 years.
He was therefore born before 1857.
Am I reading correctly that his folks came to Australia, also.
Jamjar
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Maybe they weren't married - or the mother's maiden name has an error.
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A post on the WALES Pembrokeshire board is the way to go. They may have records available that we don’t know about.
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/pembrokeshire/
Jamjar
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Hi, Donalds Birth was 1903 in Wellington, Registered Donald Moss Certificate number 8363.
He married Edna Ward in 1926 Certificate 3534. I know he had at least 2 daughters.
He married again to Bridget Reidy in 1945 certificate 5876. They adopted 2 children.
I can probably give more information if needed.
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Mariajune - do you know anything of David and Jane Evans?
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I have his death certificate but apart from that I don't know a lot. I believe he came out to Australia when he was 21 from Pembrokeshire, South Wales, England. His father was Seth Evans who was a Brickmaker and Mother was Jane Morgan.
David married Mary Davis at the age of 22yrs near Bathurst. Certificate 2018, date 1868, place Carcoar.
Children to this marriage was Eben,James, Harriet, Esther. The certificate says Living 2 males and 1 female deceased.
2nd Marriage to Elizabeth Moss certificate 14656, date 1919, place Orange.
Children to this marriage was Charles 1876 certificate 1733, Arthur 1885 certificate 31360, Ethel 1892 certificate 20881, Edith, Ida, Doris 1898 certificate 17237, Thomas 1901, certificate 27845, Donald 1903, certificate 8363.
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Hi, I'm from Wellington NSW and David Evans was my great grandfather. My grandfather was Arthur from his second marriage to Elizabeth Moss. Most of the children from this marriage were born before they married and were registered under Moss. I have a bit of information which I have gotten from relatives. So if there is something you need to know I may be able to help out.
Regards
Maria
Hi Maria, My great grandmother was Edith, your fathers sister. Love to learn more about them.