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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Renfrewshire => Topic started by: nkbauer on Wednesday 19 August 15 16:40 BST (UK)
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I'd be interested in sharing information with anyone working on this family. My 2xgreat grandfather James Lang was born in 1815 in Houston and Killelan(West Glen I believe) His parents were Gabriel Lang (b. c1784 and likely died bef 1851 census) and Elizabeth Patereson (b. c1783 and died 4 Jul 1854 Abbey Renfrewshire) James married Margaret Jack (b. c1817 and died 3 Jan 1900 at 15 Kempock, Gourock. They married 5 June 1841 in Kilbarchan, Renfrewshire. They had 10 children. My great grandmother Georgina Jane Lang (1842-1918) was their eldest daughter. Her siblings were:James b 1844, Elizabeth Paterson b 1846, George b 1849, Gabriel b 1851, Margaret Stewart b 1853, John Boyd b 1855, Janet b 1858, Wm b 1861 and Malcolm b 1862.
Looking forward to making some connections,
regards, Nan
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Hi, I'm not researching the Lang family but found these and thought they may be useful.
Births:
Gabriel Lang
born: 30 Jan 1784
place:Houston,Renfrew
parents:John Lang & Isobel Baxter
Elizabeth Paterson
born: 16 Nov 1783
place:Houston,Renfrew
parents: James Paterson & Agnes Barr
Regards, Kim
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Thank you, Kim. I did have that information but I appreciate your efforts on my behalf.
Nan
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Is nobody researching the Lang family?
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I am! No idea if we intersect at all, but I have an Elisabeth Lang in my tree. She married William Burton August 1818 in Kilmacolm. I have no information any further back from this, but given the marriage year, and daughters born in 1818 and 1820, I'd guess a birth year in the late 1780's-late 1790's. I also believe I've found her on the 1841, 51, and 61 census' in Greenock.
I'm always hoping for more information (as I know everyone on this site is!), so if you are connected to this Elisabeth, I'd love to connect!
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I'm not, but I am :D . If you connect to the Lang families of sugar refiners in Greenock, 1820s-1900s, you'll find considerable info at www.mawer.clara.net/sugarll.html
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Hi lyoung03,
Is Elizabeth Widowed by 1841?
Is she using Walton or her maiden name in 1851/1861 Census?
(I am struggling to find her on Census)
What year, pob does she have in 1851/1861 Census?
Familysearch has a few possibles for her Christening 1792-1799 so need to narrow down pob.
Trish :)
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Hello lyoung03,
I took a quick look at my tree but didn't find an Elizabeth Lang that fit into that time period unfortunately. Elizabeth is certainly a name that appears frequently. My Langs were sometimes found in Greenock but more often in Houston and Killelan or Gourock. There is likely a remote connection but I can't see it yet. Too bad. I would love to connect with another Lang descendant.
Regards, Nan
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Trish- She was using Burton on those census. I believe that she was widowed by the 1851 census. The 1841 census lists her birth as 1791 Renfrewshire, 1851 census shows 1788 Lanarkshire, and the 1861 census shows 1787 Lanarkshire. All have her living in Greenock. Her marriage to William Burton is shown as August 1818 Kilmacolm.
Now a question as I am Stateside and still learning about international records...Would parish marriage records or any state record have information about the parents of the bride and groom in Scotland/UK in general? Here, I've seen (in my experience so far at least) that parent's names etc. may not be included in the indexed information, but do remain on the originals. So going to the State Archives is worthwhile to possibly get one more generation back. Is this the same in Scotland? Will it be worthwhile to make a side trip (while visiting Glasgow anyway) to the towns/local archives to try and gather these names?
Nan-As I was browsing through the forum, I saw your thread title and I had to restrain my giddiness and remind myself that just because we're researching the same family name doesn't mean anything. However, given that we're looking in the same region, I agree with you that there is likely some kind of connection!
Cheers-Leslie
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Hi nkbauer
Nan,
I am researching LANG, but of Lanarkshire / Dunbartonshire. You have probably noticed on Ancestry that some researchers have our families intertwined. I don't believe this is correct! But, who knows.
I am at a total loss with mine, a very high brick wall indeed. The most that I can confirm at that Agnes LANG born abt 1815 - 1817 in Lanarkshire.
Agnes married James ROBERTS, although I cant find a marriage under LANG or ROBERTS.
1851 census states born - Monkland Lanark
1861 census states born - Caddar Lanark
1871 census states born - Cadder Lanark
1881 census states born - Chryston Lanark.
At her death in 1886 at Twechar Dunbartonshire, her parents were stated as James LANG and Agnes SINCLAIR. I am unable to find them on ANY census. I also cant find their deaths.
Ring any bells?! If you come across anything let me know.
Regards, Steven
Melbourne, Australia.
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Hi again lyoung03,
Scottish Death Certs are amazing.
Civil Reg started 1855
Check out Scotlandspeople for her Cert which should contain all the info you require on Elizabeth .
And compared to other Countries are very inexpensive.
Quote from Scotlandspeople'
1855 death records show the date, time and place of death, deceased's name, sex, marital status, age and occupation, cause of death, duration of last illness, doctor's name and details of the informant. In addition, they show the usual residence, the deceased's place of birth, spouse's name, PARENTS' names****, occupations and whether they were deceased, names and ages of children or age and year of death if the child pre-deceased the parent. Up to 1860, the place of burial, the name of the undertaker and when the doctor last saw the deceased alive, were also included. As with births and marriages, this amount of detail had proved difficult to maintain. The deceased's birthplace was removed from 1856, as were the names of any children. The spouses name was also not required from 1856, but was reinstated in 1861.
The 1818 Parish Marriage Entry will not contain any info on her Parents.
Trish :)
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Hello Steven from Melbbourne,
It was interesting to hear from you. I did a quick check on my Langs to see if we were connected. My only "James" who could have been the father of Agnes timewise never married, however I still have many gaps on secondary branches of my tree. The only Agnes I have in that time period was the daughter of a John Lang and Margaret Paterson. She like many of my Langs was born in Renfrewshire. (10 Jul 1815) There is a possibility that we are connected but I haven't found it yet unfortunately.
If you do find a connection, please let me know and I'll do the same.
Regards, Nan
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Will do Nan...
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hello Stephen from Melbourne
We have in our records that James Roberts, son of William Roberts and Margaret Greenhorn, was born in 1823 in Falkirk, Stirlingshire, Scotland, and he died on 19th of June 1891, 7hr 30m am, in Braes of Yetts, Dumbartonshire, Scotland. He married Agnes Lang in 1840.
Agnes Lang was born in 1817 in Cadder, Lanarkshire, Scotland. She died on 11 March 1866 in Noon, Barhill Rows, Twedras, Kirkintillock, Dumbartonshire, Scotland but we have no further details about her parents.
Agnes Lang and James Roberts had nine children. Sinclair appears to be indicative of an area in Scotland which was used to preserve family connection and heritage, rather than a surname, as we had a similar problem researching a descendant, Muriel Irene Sinclair Gibson, daughter of John James Gibson and Euphemia Gartshore Roberts (descendants of James Roberts.) Muriel Irene Sinclair Gibson was born 1905 in Beulah, Victoria.
We have relatives in Victoria who are descended from the Gibson, Lang and Roberts families, who have conducted research into the ancestry, so if you are interested in finding out more information please contact me for further contact details / email address.
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Hi Stephen
We have only recently discovered that Gibson is my grandfather's mother's surname, (Muriel Irene was my great grandmother), so all this information is rather new to us.
Sorry if the information was already known to you - if we happen to discover anything about Agnes Lang, or any of the other family members, please share here.
I have the contact details of one of the Gibson descendants who has done a lot of research so perhaps she might turn something of interest up in her search?
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Hi scotland11
I had already sent you a private message.
bitzar. :)
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Hi Leslie,
You can find this information via the Scotland's People website. If you go to the local area, you can make an appointment with the registrar who will access the same information. If you are going to be in Glasgow, book a day at the genealogy centre at the Mitchell library where you can acess lots of records on births, marriages, deaths, census and wills - again via Scotland's People.
:)
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Yes. My great great grandmother, Jane or Janet Lang was born in Pollokshaws in 1815. I have found only one birth record but don't trust that it is correct. Can't find other family members. Anyone else have births in Pollokshaws?
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Yes. My great great grandmother, Jane or Janet Lang was born in Pollokshaws in 1815. I have found only one birth record but don't trust that it is correct.
Where/when did Jane/Janet die?
Annie
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Agnes Lang was born in 1817 in Cadder, Lanarkshire, Scotland. She died on 11 March 1866 in Noon, Barhill Rows, Twedras, Kirkintillock, Dumbartonshire, Scotland but we have no further details about her parents.
I'm unsure as to how you know she was born in 1817 & where but no parents names?
It looks like you have her DC from SP?
Were her parents names unknown?
Annie
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Jane Lang Purvis died in 1897 in St. Jean sur Richelieu, Quebec, Canada. She lived most of her life in Glasgow, but travelled to Canada to assist with her grandchildren when their mother was ill. She died there, reputedly from falling down the stairs. She is buried there. Her husband, Robert Turnbull Purvis, died in 1886 in Glasgow and is buried in Govan.
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Was there an obituary with any details pointing to anything?
Annie
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Hi. No obit (everything is in French and I haven't delved the newspaper option in that small town). Just the parish record. Nothing on the tombstone either. I need to push harder in Quebec. I tried all the census records in the Glasgow area, too.
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isbean,
Did any of the children have middle names which may be a clue?
What were the names of her childre in order eldest to youngest?
Annie
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Hi Annie... Already tried that, the normal pattern seems irregular in this family.
Children in descending order:
1st infant died, female, no name known, born act 1846;
2nd child, 1st son: Thomas Purvis (after paternal grandfather);
3rd child, 2nd son, Charles Watson Purvis (named after paternal grandmother's brother...a little weird, but this great uncle was influential in starting them all in the family pottery trade in Glasgow);
4th child, 2nd female, Margaret Purvis, after paternal grandmother... could be that Jane Lang also had a mother named Margaret, too...
5th child, 3rd son: James Watson Purvis, named after paternal grandmother's father;
6th child, 4th son: Robert Watson Purvis, Robert after his father, Watson again;
7th child, 3rd daughter: Emma Ann Purvis, named after a sister in law of father.
The only birth record I found for follows:
in Pollockshaw: Janet Graham Lang 1816 Volume 21, page 360. The record reads:
Archibald Lang writer and Elizabeth Graham LD Janet Graham bo 6th Augt. Wit: John Lang & Alexander Graham. ‘in Pollockshaw Glasgow’...
There are no other Jean, Jane, Janet Langs born about that time in Pollockshaws...
However, there are no children named after Archibalds, Elizabeths, Alexanders or Johns. I find that suspicious, which makes me wonder if this record is correct.
The 'Pollokshaws' location is in numerous census returns, etc. as her place of birth.
Stumped, and unwilling to completely trust this one record. I have been gnawing on this bone for years!
Thank you for your thoughts and ideas. Have you done a DNA test? Perhaps we might match, and that would be a clue...
Best,
Jean
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Jean,
I'm not related, only trying to help ;)
So they were in the Pottery trade maybe why the have their own design for naming children ::)
Charles Watson Purvis....
Was it the Charles or Watson or both which was the name of the paternal g/mother's brother?
"2nd female, Margaret Purvis, after paternal grandmother... could be that Jane Lang also had a mother named Margaret, too"
Very likely as it was a very common name.
I would agree the only baptism found doesn't seem a match?
Annie
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Hi again.
Thank you for your opinion ... this birth record seems iffy at best. She married Robert Turnbull Purvis in Linlithgow... again a little weird, as she was from Glasgow, and he had recently moved from Prestonpans to Glasgow. I did search Langs in the Linlithgow, but didn't turn up anything. I shall continue and I much appreciate your interest and comments!
Cheers,
Jean
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isbean
Very interested to see if WE match! My LANG's are extremely illusive?!?!?!?!?!?!?!
bitzar.
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According to the 1855 birth certificate of James Watson Purvis his parents married in August 1844 in Linlithgow, however SP have the marriage recorded in Barony.
In 1855 the family were living at 30 Grace Street, Barony. In both 1851 and 1861 the family of a John Lang and Agnes Lang nee Shaw were also living in Grace Street ( at no 52 in 1851 and 62 in 1861). Census says John Lang was also born in Pollockshaws ( around 1821/2). John Lang died on 24th Feb 1890. He was a Retired Machinary Merchant, age 69 married to Ann Shaw and his parents are given as Thomas Lang, Handloom Tenter (dec'd) and Mary Lang nee Wallace (dec'd). Given John's place of birth and the fact he was living in the same street as your Lang family, I think it is possible that John was a brother of Jane Lang. There are a couple of Lang births recorded in Eastwood ( reg district for Pollockshaws) for parents Thomas Lang and Mary Wallace - Janet 1808 and James 1810 - but no later births, including one for John, who we know for sure was a child of theirs. There are therefore possibly other children of this marriage also not recorded.
Isobel
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Janet's death in Canada was recorded in the 13th and 14th August 1897 editions of the Glasgow Herald, but yields no further clues for you.
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Thank you very much for checking. I don't have access to the Glasgow Herald records.
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According to the 1855 birth certificate of James Watson Purvis his parents married in August 1844 in Linlithgow, however SP have the marriage recorded in Barony.[/i]
I haven't figured out the reason for this. Robert Turnbull Purvis, groom, was born on the east coast in Prestonpans, somewhat nearby to Linlithgow. But, seems weird.
In 1855 the family were living at 30 Grace Street, Barony. In both 1851 and 1861 the family of a John Lang and Agnes Lang nee Shaw were also living in Grace Street ( at no 52 in 1851 and 62 in 1861).
Hmmm... never picked up on this. Very interesting. I will follow up.
Census says John Lang was also born in Pollockshaws ( around 1821/2). John Lang died on 24th Feb 1890. He was a Retired Machinary Merchant, age 69 married to Ann Shaw and his parents are given as Thomas Lang, Handloom Tenter (dec'd) and Mary Lang nee Wallace (dec'd). Given John's place of birth and the fact he was living in the same street as your Lang family, I think it is possible that John was a brother of Jane Lang. There are a couple of Lang births recorded in Eastwood ( reg district for Pollockshaws) for parents Thomas Lang and Mary Wallace - Janet 1808 and James 1810 - but no later births, including one for John, who we know for sure was a child of theirs. There are therefore possibly other children of this marriage also not recorded.
Isobel
Very plausible... and a father named Thomas, too. But no Marys anywhere in the family.
I am new to RootsChat and can't figure out how to reply to specific posts, so please forgive the repeated preamble. Thank you very much for your thoughts.
Jean
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Hi Biztar... where is your DNA posted? I am on family tree DNA, Ancestry, 23&me and Gedmatch. Thank you! Jean
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Think there was a Lang provost of Renfrew back in the 60's?
Skoosh.
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Isbean
You will find my DNA on Anc* and GedM*.
I am supposedly descended from Agnes, the daughter of James LANG and Agnes SINCLAIR who was born at Chryston, Lanarkshire c1816. Her birthplace and DOB changes with each census though. There is no marriage of James LANG and Agnes SINCLAIR.
bitzar.
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Almost a year to the day of being 3 years later to this post!!
I'm researching the LANGS of Renfrewshire! And hoping you may help me.
Searching records available and other Ancestry members, I can take my Lang family back to PATRICK LANG, born 16/2/1691 (1st query) Kilmacolm (and assumed died there) who married Grizall (or Grizel) Barnhill 18/12/1716 in Kilmacolm. Are you tracing this line of Langs? The date of birth came from an Ancestry member and I cannot remember who , so searched ScotlandsPeople to no avail (don't appear to have records going back that far) to verify date of birth. Do you have a copy of birth record for Patrick?
My Lang family were predominantly farmers, born and lived in Kilmacolm and Kilbarchan areas and only later on spread a wee bit to Erskne and Greenock. Only in the mid-late 1800's did the Langs start moving further afield. My 2nd Gt-Grandfather (son of Alexander Lang) though emigrated to Australia in 1837, sponsored by John Dumblane Lang, settling in New South Wales.
The second Query is of Patrick's Gt-Grandson, John [b.16/3/1776], son of Arthur. Only two records come up on SotlandsPeople for the birth of John's son Alexander born in Kilbarchan and each shows a different mother - Sarah Whithill and Elizabeth Spiers. Ancestry members are divided; many showing or the other. I am leaning towards Elizabeth Spiers, only because one daughter is named Elizabeth, and none of the other daughters are named Sarah after the mother, as most families did back then. Are you able to help with this puzzle?
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Hi, I believe he was a forester on 'Gartshore Estate' along with his father James ROBERTS, and his father William ROBERTS. I guess this is why William and Ellen ROBERTS (nee PHILMORE), named their 1st born Euphemia Gartshore ROBERTS.
G
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Now a question as I am Stateside and still learning about international records...Would parish marriage records or any state record have information about the parents of the bride and groom in Scotland/UK in general?
In Scotland, before 1855, a parish marriage record occasionally names the bride's father, rarely names the groom's father, and I have never seen one that names the couple's mothers. However you can often find the names of the parents of people married before 1855 if they died in Scotland after 1855, because a Scottish civil death certificate names both parents of the deceased, including the maiden surname of the deceased's mother (assuming that the informant knew this, of course, and that the informant got it right, which is sometimes not the case).
From 1855 onwards, a statutory civil marriage certificate gives the full names of both parties' parents, including the maiden surnames of their mothers.
English, Welsh and Irish marriage certificates (1837 onwards in E and W, 1845 onwards for Protestants and 1864 onwards for Catholics in Ireland) usually name the couple's fathers but not their mothers. E, W and I death certificates contain no information about the parents of the deceased, and sometimes not even the name of the deceased's spouse.