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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Antrim => Topic started by: rossendalerose on Friday 02 October 15 10:03 BST (UK)
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Doing friends husbands family tree and looking for the DRAIN family some of whom were living in Dunloy, Co Antrim in the 1930's/1940's. There were 11 children and I have searched high and low and cannot find births etc for any of them. Some are still living but HUGH DRAIN (1933-2015) is recently deceased - still can't find his birth. His father was Hugh as well and came from Glasgow, according to the family.
Can anyone point me in the right direction with at least some evidence of a birth? Had hoped to leapfrog back to the 1911 and 1901 census but completely stuck!! thanks Rose H
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Not sure where you tried searching but the birth records you are looking for are too recent to be found online.
The online civil registration index at www.familysearch.org only goes up to 1921 for Northern Ireland counties. GRONI's online index has a 100 year restriction for births.
The Catholic Parish Registers for Dunloy are now online but do not even come to 1900-
http://registers.nli.ie/parishes/0406
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I think by asking the question i formulated some of my own answers. Looked at 1911 census and have found a DRAIN family with all the right christian names and a Hugh born in Glasgow - James DRAIN , age 47, Farmer of house 20 in Caldanagh, Dunloy with family including Hugh, age 18 born in Glasgow. Will follow this up BUT still puzzled why I can't find Hugh's marriage and births of his children in the 30's and 40's so would still appreciate someone else looking. thanks
(just read post by Aghadowey - didn't realise I couldn't search for recent births in Northern Ireland - so used to doing it for English births). Will continue to follow up the census return I have found.
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Hi,
Yes, Hugh Drain the father is in the 1901 Census in Ireland, he was 7 and as you say in Dunloy.
They are in house number 1, this means the first house on the census for that area, it may be a mile away from the next house, but not as we number hoses in the UK. Also there is another Hugh Drain in House number 5.
Your Hugh was born in Glasgow. (there are 7 Hugh Drain altogether.)
They are also in the 1911 Census.
As he and his siblings were born in Scotland you would have to use Scotland's People. If you live in Scotland, request a PC at the Scotland's People building, you have to book in advance, the Scotland records are they best I have ever seen. I spent a day up there. They even give the Time of Births and Deaths.
I looked for the births in familysearch and got Margaret b 1891 the address was Bridgeton, Lanarkshire, this is near Celtic Park. If you type in Bridgeton on google you will see it on the map.
I hope this has helped.
Maggsie
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If their Mother was Leech then Hugh was registered in 1929 as Michael H Drain.
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James Drain & family in 1911-
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Dunloy/Caldanagh/129789
and in 1901-
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/Dunloy/Dunloy/946092
1891 census- 328 Nuneaton St., Bridgeton (Glasgow), Lanarkshire
James Drain, 27, Ireland, gas stoker
wife Matilda Drain, 30, Ireland
son James Drain, 2, Glasgow
daughter Margaret Drain, 8 months, Glasgow
boarder John McCausland, 40, Ireland, bricklayers labourer
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Marriage: James Drain (5 Nov.1883 Ballymoney district) Matilda Caves.
Added- James' father is called Hugh
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Thanks - weather is a bit dismal here in Lancashire so working on the family tree rather than gardening!! Thanks for the marriage info. Found the family in Scotland in 1891 but some questions:
-Mary, age 6 is not with them (she is on 1901 census age 16) - has she been left in Antrim?
-have tried to look at Dunloy registers (register.nli) but found it unreadable - are there any transcripts available?
-only birth of a James Drain I can find is 1864 in Belfast - doesn't feel right in that father and mothers names have not been used for his children's names - can anyone spot a better birth match?
If their Mother was Leech then Hugh was registered in 1929 as Michael H Drain.
[/quote The recently deceased Hugh was 82 when he died - so 1933 DOB. Don't know yet who his father Hugh was married to]
Rose H
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Civil registration of births in Ireland started in 1864 so there will be no birth certificate for James or Matilda.
The 1891 census for Ireland doesn't survive so there's no way to see which family members were here at that time.
You can view the marriage certificate for James & Matilda via GRONI's site (you'll need to purchase some credits but only a few pounds to see the scanned image to get the full details- which will not be nearly as informative as Scottish certificate). This will get you the name and occupation of their fathers (hopefully) and then the Dunloy registers can be searched.
Added- had a look at Dunloy register and seems perfectly clear to me
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Thanks again. Will do the search at GRONI for that marriage as it might give me a bit more information. Rose H
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Possible marriage:
Hugh Drain (16 Aug.1922 Ballymoney district) to Catherine Donnelly
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Some more details to keep in mind but since Drain is a common name in the Ballymoney area you need to be careful about tracing the correct family.
Drain James of Galdanagh Dunloy county Antrim farmer died 17 June 1942 Probate Belfast 25 August to Hugh F. Drain farmer. Effects £290 5s.
The Will of Hugh Drain late of Dunloy County Antrim Farmer who died 30 July 1890 at same place was proved at Belfast by Mary Ann Drain Widow and William Templeton Farmer both of Dunloy the Executors. Will mentions daughters Tilda & Catherine, daughter Jane, son James, daughter Mary, daughter Margaret, beloved wife Mary Ann, son Daniel.
Drain Daniel of Dunloy county Antrim farmer died 11 December 1927 Probate Belfast 23 January to James Drain farmer. Effects £93.
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/Dunloy/Dunloy/946092 (as posted earlier)
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Dunloy/Dunloy/129810
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Found the family in Scotland in 1891 but some questions:
-Mary, age 6 is not with them (she is on 1901 census age 16) - has she been left in Antrim?
The 1901 census does not say that Mary is James' daughter, only that she is niece to head of household (Daniel). Since Daniel is unmarried she could be a daughter of either a brother or sister of Daniel's.
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/Dunloy/Dunloy/946092
Can probably find a bit more if you want to trace this family further.
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Hi,
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-Mary, age 6 is not with them (she is on 1901 census age 16) - has she been left in Antrim?
Yes she is with the grandparents in house 6 in Dundalk Road (Crossmaglen, Armagh)
Their name is Martin.
I have been away to do the lunch, I thought I had sent this, sorry
Maggsie
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Mary Drain, age 16 in 1901-
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/Dunloy/Dunloy/946092
is NOT the Mary Drain age 6 in 1901-
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Armagh/Crossmaglen/Dundalk_Road/1022434
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Possible marriage:
Hugh Drain (16 Aug.1922 Ballymoney district) to Catherine Donnelly
. The family e-mailed me this name this afternoon - so this is the correct marriage.
Have registered with GRONI but got problems. When I do the free search it tells me that there are records for the people I'm looking for. When I then go into the search records and put in the same info it says that there are 0 records. It's done this for everything I've searched for. What am I doing wrong? Rose H
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Are you sure that you are logged in and have credit in your account?
Before you search the records you need to register for an account and buy some credits. A credit costs £0.40. You can hold up to a maximum of 200 credits.
http://www.nidirect.gov.uk/gro-info
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have to go out now but will log on again this afternoon and try my GRONI account again. Thanks
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Let us know how you get on with GRONI later. Have more information which I can type up and post if you're interested.
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It helps if you do buy credits first!!
have seen m/cert of Hugh Drain and Catherine Donnelly in 1922. She was born 1904 and father was Charles - a farmer. Found it difficult to see where she was from - looked like Mayteraboy.
Although I had credits left couldn't seem to be able to access m/cert in 1883 of James Drain. Can anyone see a specific date so that I can try again? Thanks Rose H
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Glad you got Hugh's certificate. Could the townland be Magheraboy (near Rasharkin)?
Added- think this is her as Kathleen Donnelly-
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Killoquin/Magheraboy/130095
Date of James' marriage was posted earlier- 5 Nov.1883- am wondering if it was Registry Office.
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THANK YOU!!! Will dash off now to look at the census for her. The family thought that James married 'out' of his religion and that Mathilda might have been Protestant. That might explain a register Office wedding. Would I still be able to use my credits to view that marriage?
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Yes, Registry Office marriages come under civil registration. There's a good reason that I thought it might be R.O. as Matilda's family most likely were Presbyterian- but more on that later when you are ready for LOTS of new details on the Drain connection.
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Probate of the Will of Charles Donnelly, Magheraboy, Co. Antrim, Farmer who died 27 December 1920 granted at Belfast 7 September 1921 to James McLernon & John McLernon, Farmers. Effects £39.
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/Killoquin_North/Dreen/946545/
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I have done many family trees using English records but this is the first time that I've used GRONI and I don't like it!!
One of the witnesses to Hugh and Catherine's marriage was a Mary McSheffrery. This surname was given to me by the family as being the maiden name of Catherines mother. From 1911 census Charles and Maggie were married about 1894 but will GRONI find me the marriage record? -NO it won't and I still have some unused credit. Is there a secret to finding the right record on this system?
Your hint of 'lots of new detail' about the Drains has really brightened me up.
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Suspect our Irish tendency to keep using different version of the same names is causing part of the problem for you but I'm got the advantage of local knowledge and resources (my children were all born in Ballymoney and lots of mother-in-law's family were around Dunloy).
Charles Donnelly married 13 May 1894 Ballymoney district to Margaret McSheefrey.
Added- possibly no father listed for Charles or Margaret.
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It's been a grey, depressing foggy day here in Lancashire and I'm feeling grey and depressed here in my work room trying to access the GRONI records! I used the correct date of marriage for the James Drain and Charles Donnelly marriages and it keeps saying ' returned 0 records'. What am I doing wrong? - you've obviously found the records as you've given me the dates so they exist.
Anyway must go and feed the family first before I get too involved in the Drains and Connelly's. Will be back later for the next installment.
Rose H
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2 hours away from the keyboard clears the head. Found the records - it helped putting in the right registration district! Was using Antrim rather than Ballymoney.
James Drain did marry Mathilda in an RC Church Cloughmills, Castlemartin in Ballymoney. Her father was William John Caves -farmer
Charles Donnelly age 28 from Rusharkin with father Charles Donnelly (dealer); Maggie McSheefry, age 25 from Tullaghans with father William McSheefry (farmer).
So far so good. Any more info on any members of this family tree would be welcome.
Rose H
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If Matilda was Protestant but married James in a Catholic church then there's quite likely to be a baptism for her shortly before the marriage (possibly the same day).
'Rusharkin' should be Rasharkin. In the census Charles Donnelly was a fowl dealer.
Now back to Drains family...
Hugh Drain (c1810-30 July 1890), Dunloy, m. Mary Ann Miller (alive 1890)
Death: https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FTH2-KPX
The Will of Hugh Drain late of Dunloy County Antrim Farmer who died 30 July 1890 at same place was proved at Belfast by Mary Ann Drain Widow and William Templeton Farmer both of Dunloy the Executors. Will mentions daughters Tilda & Catherine, daughter Jane, son James, daughter Mary, daughter Margaret, beloved wife Mary Ann, son Daniel.
1. Daniel Drain (c1857-1927) m.(1902) Mary (c1872). Ch.: Hugh (1905), John (c1907), James (c1909), child (d.bef.1911)
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/Dunloy/Dunloy/946092
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Dunloy/Dunloy/129810
Drain Daniel of Dunloy county Antrim farmer died 11 December 1927 Probate Belfast 23 January to James Drain farmer. Effects £93.
2. Mary Drain
? Dunloy register, p.31: bapt. 6 June 1878 Agnes Lizzie, Anticorbog, parents- Daniel McMullan & Mary Drain
Birth: Agnes 7 July 1880 Rasharkin https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FGK7-SXW
3. Margaret Drain
? Dunloy register, p.33: 22 Aug.1878 Michol? McAlister, The Craigs, to Margaret Drain, Dunloy
4. Jane Drain (c1861)
Bapt. 3 Aug.1861 http://registers.nli.ie/registers/vtls000633137#page/4/mode/1up
5. JAMES DRAIN (1864-1942)
6. Matilda/Tilda Drain (15 Jan.1867-16 May 1901 Dirraw sub-district)
Birth (Tilda Drean): https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:F55J-52T
1901- unmarried, with brother Daniel
4. Bridget/Breagh Drain
Bapt. 25 Mar.1868 (twice on page) http://registers.nli.ie/registers/vtls000633137#page/9/mode/1up
?birth Bridget, Jan/Mar 1879 Ballymoney https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FBQ8-D49
8. Catherine Drain (1 Jan.1874-1951 Ohio) m. ___ Edris
Bapt. 10 Dec.1873 http://registers.nli.ie/registers/vtls000633137#page/14/mode/1up
Birth (1 Jan.1874): https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FPBT-MDH
Death: https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XXMD-R92
more to come...
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JAMES DRAIN (14 July 1864-1942) m.(5 Nov.1883 Ballymoney dist.) Matilda Caves (c1861)
Bapt. 3 May 1864: http://registers.nli.ie/registers/vtls000633137#page/8/mode/1up
Birth (James Drane 14 July 1864): https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FG1N-PM8
1891- Scotland
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/Dunloy/Dunloy/946092
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Dunloy/Caldanagh/129789
Drain James of Galdanagh Dunloy county Antrim farmer died 17 June 1942 Probate Belfast 25 August to Hugh F. Drain farmer. Effects £290 5s.
1. James Drain (c1889 Glasgow)
2. Margaret Drain (1890 Glasgow)
3. HUGH F. DRAIN (c1893 Glasgow)
Hugh Drain- http://dunloygac.ie/history/ (might be worth contacting them through the site)
Misc.- from church register:
? Dunloy register, p.33: 20 Jan.1878, John Reid & Fanny Drain
Dunloy register- Deaths, p.35:
5 Nov.1877 Margaret (Mrs.) Drain, 96, Glenone, buried Calderagh
17 Nov.1877 Mrs. Drain, 86, Dunloy, buried Calderagh
Just posting this so you don't get him confused with your Hugh Drain-
Hugh Drain c1835-29/28 Aug.1899 Ballymoney sub-district), Ballymoney, single, Protestant, siblings Jane, William, Robert, Mary, buried old churchyard
CAVES family were Presbyterian?
Dunloy register, p.34: 29 Mar.1880 Thomas Keogh to Eliza Caves
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/Dunloy/Dunloy/946109/
Letters of Administration of the personal estate of William John Caves late of Dunloy County Antrim Farmer who died 20 November 1889 at same place were granted at Belfast to Catherine Caves of Dunloy the Widow.
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Dunloy/Dunloy/129811/
Caves William John of Dunloy county Antrim farmer died 22 March 1934 Probate Belfast 15 December to Robert Shaw farmer and James Shaw merchant and farmer. Effects £79 10s.
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Aghadowey - How do you have so much information about the Drains? Are they part of your family tree? Rose H
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No, not related at all but I live not that far away and mother-in-law's mother was from County Antrim.
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Thanks anyway for the information. I'll pass it onto the family (living in Lancashire) - when they visit Ireland next year they can try and track down some of the locations given in the records. Rose H
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Since they don't know the area these sites might help-
Catholic Graveyards in Co, Antrim-
http://www.historyfromheadstones.com/index.php?antrim&denomination=RC
Dunloy townland- http://www.townlands.ie/antrim/finvoy/dunloy/
You can check neighbouring townlands, etc. on the site
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Charles Donnelly age 28 from Rusharkin with father Charles Donnelly (dealer); Maggie McSheefry, age 25 from Tullaghans with father William McSheefry (farmer).
There's a widow Margaret McSheffry in 1901- if you go to search for others in the census just put shef* into surname box (to catch all the spellings) and select Antrim.
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/Dirraw/Tullaghans/945960
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Dirraw/Tullaghans/129675
This looks like Margaret's daughter Betty Ann-
McSheffry Eliza Ann of Tullaghans county Antrim spinster died 13 April 1933 Probate Belfast 7 November to John McSheffry farmer. Effects £10 10s.
Living not far away-
McSheffrey William of Caldanagh county Antrim farmer died 30 November 1928 Probate Belfast 15 May to Daniel McCambridge farmer and John Kemp auctioneer. Effects £27 10s.
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Thanks - with the different ways to spell the surname I was struggling to trace them. Rose H
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Message sent to the moderators by dermot donnelly
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;area=summary;u=279618
drains still living in finvoy,related to donnellys and mc. sheffreys
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I am Drain from Dunloy.Hugh Drain was my grandfather,and yes he was born in Glasgow.The family are all originally from Dunloy.When his father and mother married they moved to Glasgow but returned to Dunloy some years later.They are all buried in the old graveyard ( Caldanagh) in Dunloy.
Hugh had one brother,James,who died a young man,and two sisters who moved to Ohio around 1912 as far as I know.