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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Lanarkshire => Topic started by: daval57 on Thursday 12 November 15 04:23 GMT (UK)
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This is a general query for future reference on how/where to trace older Scottish records (18thC and earlier).
I'm a bit rusty and would appreciate some advice / reminders.
After checking BMDs, census records and MIs, where else can I check? Online would be a bonus because I'm unable to get to the Mitchell or Edinburgh easily, if at all.
I've tried NRS online catalogue and just simply Google searches.
I'm thinking possibly Poor Law records, Kirk Sessions and Sasines and perhaps trade diectories?
Anything else I should be thinking about?
Specifically at the moment I'm looking at a FORREST family for a friend (no relation to my Forrest line that I've found).
I've traced this particular line back to Samuel Forrest of Bothwell (1814-1895).
I have his BMDs and census records (excl 1861)
I know his parents were William Forrest and Jean/Jane Law and have 7 of his siblings born 1799 - 1811 (Samuel was the youngest b1814). All born "Bothwell" (Uddingston / Bellshill / Bothwellhaugh occur in the various census records).
There I'm stuck. The parents, William Forrest and Jean Law seem to have died prior to 1841 so I have no census info to go on.
I can't definitively identify their deaths or locate MIs.
BDM's for the children give no clues to the parents other than the fact that William was an inn keeper / change keeper / publican "in Uddingston" at the time of each of his childrens birth.
Thanks for reading.
Dave
(added "Kirk Sessions")
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All scottish records are avaiable on line for a small fee.
http://www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk/
Colin
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Thanks Colin.
I've exhausted that. I'm beyond what help the OPR's can give me.
Not all records are online on SP. Mainly BMDs.
I think I need to be looking at records such as Poor Law and Sasines in the Mitchell or Edinburgh.
Wondering whether folk had suggestions beyond that.
Dave
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There is a Will & Testament for a William Forrest in 1815 at Uddingston, on ScotlandsPeople, any help?
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I have no idea how I missed that! I definitely recall looking for a will. Strong chance that's him. I'll get a copy of both records and hopefiully there will be something in there that will help me confirm it's him.
Thanks so much for pointing it out, even if it's not the right person.
Dave
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That was the correct William. :)
There is enough info within the docs for me to be sure it's the correct person.
It gives me his date of death and also confirms he was residing in Uddingston. No specific address but until now I only had info indicating that was his place of business.
Regretably there is nothing, such as his age at death, that helps me take the line further back with any certaintly.
Still, very useful to have.
Thanks again Pari Passu for pointing it out.
I'm still left with the question, where do I go from here.....
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Hi Daval,
I noted you have an interest in "other" Forrest's.
The earlist I have for now is....
George Forrest b c 1816 = Isabella Wilson b c 1818 married 1838 Carmichael, Lanark
Children all born Carluke:
George c 1841 = Elizabeth Bertram Logan b 1848 Lanark married 1873 High St, Lanark
Alexander & John 1845 (Twins)
John 1847
I have a line running from George c 1841 & Elizabeth B Logan down to present day if you are interested?
Annie
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Dave, "Poor Law" didn't exist before 1845. Up until then, poor relief was dispensed by the church.
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Cheers Lodger, I realised that after I typed my initial post, hence my amending it to include Kirk Session records. I've a bad habit of referring to all poor relief as "Poor Law". I knew what I meant. :D
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Annie, I've just noticed your comment and appreciate the details. I'll have a closer look at it when I have a wee bit more time. I've diaried it to remind me to come back to you.
Dave
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All scottish records are avaiable on line for a small fee.
No, that is absolutely not the case.
Scotland's People is one of the great wonders of the genealogical world - a treasure trove of original information (unlike several web sites I could but will not name that contain nuggets of genuine information swamped in oceans of irrelevant, plain wrong and multiply duplicated misinformation).
However SP includes only certain parts of the information formerly held by the Registrar General for Scotland and National Archives of Scotland, and now held by the National Records of Scotland.
There are vast repositories of information out there in various archives that are not available online:
Kirk Session records
Parochial Board (Poor Law) records
School records
Estate records (there is one estate archive that I know of which is said to consist of 2½ tons of documents
Registers of deeds
Registers of Episcopalian churches
Registers of Free and dissenting churches
Court records (civil and criminal)
Hospital and asylum records
Registers of sasines
Services of heirs
Burial records
to name but a few that I have used over the years.
However they are not as easy to access as the Scotland's People ones. Generally you have to find out that they exist (sometimes but not always possible online), go to wherever they are, and then read through what can be many pages of difficult handwriting to pick out the item that interests you.
If you strike lucky you can find real gems - I found (in the 2½ tons) a letter written in his own hand by one of my umpteenth-great-grandfathers in 1771, and a sasine taking another branch of the family back to an even-further-back-great-grandfather who died in 1642. If you don't, you can spend a day reading fruitlessly through an unindexed book of deeds, knowing that you still have three dozen more books to check.
But as Dave says it isn't easy for him to get to Glasgow or Edinburgh, none of this is readily accessible to him, unfortunately, or to anyone else in the same predicament.
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Elegantly put Forfarian and like you have stated not only do you manually trawl through some unreadable stuff but how many times are you side tracked and veer into a cul de sac and forget what you were looking for plus the many visits to the Mitchell when the PCs go down or when home you can not decipher your own hand writing ah the bliss of the family tree.
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i'm a bit late to the party on this but if you've exhasted all the people info - try address info.
In my own search where relatives lived in what was once tiny villages, even when they've been gobbled up to form towns and cities now, i've been able to find local groups who share records for the specific village online. These are tiny local groups that google ignores.
In one case I had a month by month breakdown of what happened, a mine accident, a divorce, a nasty case of adultery (in detail!) it was such a tiny village and i knew he lived there from census records it gave me a great insight into what his life would have been like, what was happening around him.
In another case, my relative wasn't mentioned but the landowner for his address was, and in checking that out further i was able to get records relating to my tree.
If you're really stuck with names/people i'd look into the places in more detail.
It may be that an innocuous address was actually a hospital etc and you'll then be able to seek their records.
If people seem to disappear completely - check English records to see if they pop up - many of mine do.
Good luck
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Dave, is Samuel Forrest a shoemaker living in Lesmahagow on 1851 and 1871 census?
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This looks like him on 1861 census ::) ;D
I wonder if there was a demand for Master Shewskers in Lesmahagow at that time ;D
Name: Sanuel Jonest
Age: 46
Est birth year: abt 1815
Spouse's name : Jane G Jonest
Born: Bothwell, Lanarkshire
Reg dist: Lesmahagow
Address: Lower Main St
Occupation: Shewsker (master Employ 14 Man 5 Boys)
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Thanks for all previous replies.
Excellent find Sancti - that's definitely him.
I always knew I was related to the San Jonest family! ;)
Dave