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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Antrim => Topic started by: frankie-d on Wednesday 06 January 16 21:35 GMT (UK)
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I've seen McKinney's stud book mentioned a number of times and had been under the impression that it only included details on the residents of Carnmoney. Recently I've heard that McKinney also included pedigrees from nearby parishes.
I live in Norfolk so the easiest way for me to access the stud book would be by ordering it for my nearest LDS Centre which is about 50 miles away. I'm interested in finding more info on my Ballynure ancestors, so am keen to know if anyone could confirm one way or another whether there are any Ballynure records included.
On a broader note if anyone has info on which other parishes are included maybe they could post it here with dates if possible, thereby creating a kind of mini index for anyone else who's interested in the contents.
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Hi,
I looked up McKinney’s stuff a few weeks ago at PRONI but was a bit disappointed – I think I probably had the wrong reference number.
The one I got out was D4255/1 which contained a dozen or so pages covering pretty much what the PRONI blurb describes:
Plastic-slip folder entitled 'William Fee McKinney: Family Trees and Notes'. Documents include amongst others: one photocopy of the passenger log of William McKinney, 1888; one photocopy of a passenger list of the S.S. Arawa, which was sailing from Lyttelton, New Zealand to London, 1887; genealogy of the Bigger family of Belfast; letter from William Fee McKinney to his son, Hugh Giffen McKinney, at Mornington, Western Australia, about family history and the Ulster Dialect, 1909; plan of a homestead at Yanko Station, New South Wales, Australia, the property of Messrs Wilson Brothers, c.1900; photocopy of the will of Joseph McGaw of Ballyvesey, Carnmoney, 1835; genealogical material relating to the McMordie family of Belfast; genealogical material relating to the Wilson family of Ballyvesey, Carnmoney; Belfast Telegraph obituary of engineer, Hugh Giffen McKinney; genealogical notes of the McKinney family of Carnmoney; auction account book of Martha Harvey of Carrickfergus, Co. Antrim, 1892; and a letter to Jane Creigh of Whitehouse, Co. Antrim, from her son, Thomas Creigh, in Carlisle, Pennsylvania, USA, 1788.
I also tried his diaries (T3234) but they weren’t very helpful either.
I’ve also heard talk about this stud book packed with information so I’m still quite keen to get a look when I’m next at PRONI if someone knows the correct reference...?
By the way, what names in the Ballynure area are you researching?
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Thanks for the reply.
The blurb you included is just the kind of thing I'm looking for, even though none of the names mentioned are relevant to me. Did you get this info when you were at PRONI? I can't find anything like it on the PRONI website, only the briefest details in the catalogue.
My main interest is my g-granddad William John Boyd, born Bruslee in 1845. His parents John Boyd and Jane Johnston were married 1835, their parents shown as John & Mary Boyd and James & Esther Johnston. This all came from Ballynure Presbyterian records, which I got when I visited PRONI a few years ago. I presume anything older would have been in the CoI records which were lost.
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My main interest is my g-granddad William John Boyd, born Bruslee in 1845. His parents John Boyd and Jane Johnston were married 1835, their parents shown as John & Mary Boyd and James & Esther Johnston. This all came from Ballynure Presbyterian records, which I got when I visited PRONI a few years ago. I presume anything older would have been in the CoI records which were lost.
Ballynure Presbyterian Church started before 1750s.
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Hi aghadowey, the church may have been open earlier but the baptisms and marriages held at PRONI start in 1819.
One area where I think my memory failed me was with the CoI records, which are available at PRONI and go back to 1803 for marriages and 1812 for baptisms. Didn't find any more on my ancestors in there. Maybe they came from another area.
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You haven't said what religion the family were. Were they Church of Ireland?
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As far back as I can trace they were Presbyterian. I also checked the Church of Ireland records because I've seen that as the Established church the CoI often included records for other denominations.
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If they were Presbyterian then it's much more likely that baptisms and marriages would have been in Presbyterian records. Many Presbyterians were buried in parish ground (Church of Ireland) which is why you might find records of them in a burial register (although not all rectors included those not belonging to his own congregation).
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Frankie – yea, I thought the blurb looked promising too. But when I had a flick through I couldn’t see much other than McKinney, Bigger and McMordie family information. I’ve heard he took notes on many more local families than that. It is possible I missed something, as I’m always in a bit of a rush when at PRONI – there’s only so many days in the year one can take off work to visit public records offices.
Bruslee is in the area I’m interested in (basically the Six Mile Water valley), though I don’t have anything on any Boyds of Bruslee. Do you know if they were associated with any other townlands. Have you come across any connections to the Dundee family? Where did your William John Boyd end up?
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The McKINNEY stud books were microfilmed by LDS.
Ref: British Film 0258610.
You can request your local LDS centre to get it in, for use (usually on limited loan) on their site.
You might also be able to order a copy for yourself, for use wherever/forever.
The original books are held within PRONI, under Reference T1013.
[Simply dial up "Search the Catalogue" and enter "T1013*" to see their descriptions.]
Think that T1013/2B is what you would want to call up first.
This will be the special "indexed, 200-families" version produced for his daughter Jane McKINNEY.
[She married and became Jane DUNDEE.]
Her daughter, his grand-daughter, Isabel CROZIER, wrote a book about her grandfather.
"William Fee McKINNEY of Sentry Hill: his family and friends"
1985, Impact Printing, Coleraine ISBN 0 948154 00 4
[Out of print now: I got the last "fousty" copy off the shelves!]
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P.45
The Sentry Hill Family Register Book was on loan to the Public Record Office in Belfast for one year and is known as "The Carnmoney Note Book". Both Family Register Books, the Sentry Hill and my mother's were known in the family as the 'Stud' Books, and still are to this day.
In W.F. McKinney's time and afterwards people came from America and Canada each summer to find out details of their ancestry.
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P.43
One of the most important tasks undertaken by W.F. McKinney was the building up of some hundred 'family trees' of Carnmoney people into a Family Register Book.
The main sources ...
Carnmoney Pb (Old Session Books, 1686-1831)
Carnmoney CoI (restricted to 500 names from marriages and births)
Templepatrick
Ballyeaston
Ballylinney
Hydepark
Ballycraigy Cg
... and information gleaned from his relations and friends and handed down from generation to generation.
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So, no mention of Ballynure.
[However, gentlemen from there may well have married ladies from the above congregations.
I've seen newspaper reports of the Minister of the Ballylinney congregation marrying folks at Ballynure meeting house.]
WFMcK's books were photographed at Sentry Hill by Ron Colemen in 1975.
RC also captured the early records from Templepatrick and from Ballyeaston.
Each was assembled in to separate gedcom trees, then enhanced over the years by info from family history researchers who contacted him.
All three were recently submitted on to the LDS "Family Search" online offering.
[So, in theory, if your ancestor ain't there, then he/she ain't in the stud books!
Sadly, no references to the studbook volumes/pages were included in the gedcoms.
The only 'hook' is Ron COLEMAN's name as submitter of the data.]
Ron is still with us, and will respond to all queries.
I'll PM his latest known EMail to you.
Alternatively, he frequents Ancestry regularly.
He also appears to have made a brief appearance on this conference in 2006 as Ballybentra.
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=149980.msg734782#msg734782
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Not aware of any definitive analysis (or overall investigation of the integrity) of the McKINNEY record collections/productions ...
IC says there were two books, one (at Sentry Hill) containing 100 families, and the indexed version produced for her mother containing 200 families. RC told me (JUL-2012) that his gedcom contains 1,300 marriages and 11,000 individuals!
Hope that this helps,
Capt Jock
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Jock, Thanks for all the detail, much appreciated. I looked at the tree on familysearch, found 11 Boyds but none in Ballynure. Not sure I found all the sources so I'll contact Ron C to see if he can add anything.
MFG, John and Jane Boyd had 5 children, the first 4 including William John between 1842 & 1851 in Bruslee, the last 1854 in Little Ballymena. There's a John Boyd in Little B in Griffith's (1861) but I can't find a Civil death record for either of them. Maybe they had both died before 1864, it doesn't help that they have common names.
William John married Hester Jane Crockett in 1880 and had 5 kids including my granny Annie. They ended up in Ballyclare, in 1901 he's a "Bleacher in the Bleach & Dye Works" aka The Green, in 1911 he's a Paper Storeman, presumably in the Paper Mill. Living in Wilson's Row, Le Ballyclare, both times. He died in 1924 aged 78, a labourer. My mum told me he came home from work, ate his dinner and slumped dead at the table. Not the worst way to go.
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Thanks very much Jock, I shall look that up next time I’m there. I tried looking at Ron’s tree but the site is telling me it has technical difficulties at the moment.
Frankie – thanks for the info. Would I be right in saying WJ Boyd married Hester in 1876 rather than 1880?
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That's right, 1880 was when my grandma was born.
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Hi Looking For the Marriage of David Mckeown to Matilda Coulter have seen a ref by R Coleman on the LDS site 1847 Ballyeaston . Four of there children were Baptised in the 1st Ballyeaston Presbyterian church
James 26/05/1848
David 30/071850
Jane 7/04/1853
Alissa 9/08/1855
Is it possible that they were married at the same church? as I am unlikely to get to Belfast,can you suggest a way off tacling this would be most grateful for any help
yours Truly
mcminor