RootsChat.Com
Census Lookups General Lookups => Census and Resource Discussion => Topic started by: Parmesan on Thursday 21 January 16 18:15 GMT (UK)
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A friend of mine emailed Lost Cousins to say how pleased she was that Findmypast is adding 1939 Register to Annual Britain and World subscriptions. Me too!
In her email she said she thought FindMyPast had come to their senses at last and that she would have been quite willing to pay a £20 premium on her subscription for complete access to the register in the first place.
The reply she received was quite shocking. Here it is.
"If you, and people like you, had paid for information like the rest of us we might not all be faced
with a 20% increase in our subscriptions.
I can also see that in over 10 years of membership of my website you have only entered ONE
relative on your My Ancestors page.
I don't like selfish people - your LostCousins membership has been terminated.
Peter"
You'd think he was a little bit upset about the price hike but wait! In this month's newsletter he says this
"Whilst price increases are never welcome, the fact that Findmypast are adding the 1939 Register to existing subscriptions is really positive - and it's important to remember that even after the increase the cost of a Britain subscription will still be about 20% less than it was in October 2009 when the 1911 Census was added!"
I think he should realise that people aren't 'selfish', they are on budgets. The credits were expensive, too expensive and FindMyPast have realised that people can't afford to keep buying them.
Lost Cousins seem to be completely out of touch. Rude, just rude.
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LOST COUSINS - MORE LIKE LOST MANNERS.
His choice of language beggars belief - good manners cost nothing.
One can tell so much about a person by the way they treat people.
I find his manner very offensive and unacceptable,and to be quite honest his behaviour speaks for itself within the email he sent.
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I've been thinking for a few weeks of cancelling my membership to Lost Cousins as I don't like his tone sometimes. That has made up my mind for me.
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This doesn't surprise me. I have emailed Peter in the past with a well-reasoned dissenting opinion and got an earful. The newsletters used to be an interesting read, but of late have become very egocentric, especially with his affiliation with FindMyPast and "campaigning" for cheaper access to certificates.
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This doesn't surprise me. I have emailed Peter in the past with a well-reasoned dissenting opinion and got an earful. The newsletters used to be an interesting read, but of late have become very egocentric, especially with his affiliation with FindMyPast and "campaigning" for cheaper access to certificates.
I agree.
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Well in that case, thank you all the so called selfish people who complained about the cost of the 1939 Register and thank you also to Find My past who for whatever reason have changed their policy and included access in the annual subscription. The majority of people who complained about the costs said they would prefer a modest increase on the subscription rather than having to pay for expensive credits. Find My Past seem to have done that now and have retained the subscription for existing subscribers at current rates until after their next renewal.
I am surprised that a professional genealogy site would berate it's member in this way.
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I thought it might be an idea to use lost cousins to try to track down any Irish ancestors/cousins of my husbands. I was finding the site a little difficult to use and emailed Peter for help. Got a reply basically saying he didn't have time to assist people like me who couldn't see the obvious.
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I have to agree with vrvt too. The newsletter over the last 12 months or so has not been anywhere near as interesting and useful as previously. The fact he often has discount offers for FindMyPast which provide him with commission I think probably tends to colour his views about the site. That said, even he was critical of them at one stage following the role out of the new site. :o
Perhaps he'll respond as he would appear to loiter on RC occasionally or possibly one of the RCers who also frequents his beta Forum may draw his attention to the post. :-\ I occasionally have a look to see if the Forum has actually taken off but after two or three years in beta format (join by invitation only, but you can see much of it without an account) they still get very few posts and only from a small number of members.
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I thought it might be an idea to use lost cousins to try to track down any Irish ancestors/cousins of my husbands. I was finding the site a little difficult to use and emailed Peter for help. Got a reply basically saying he didn't have time to assist people like me who couldn't see the obvious.
:o Gosh, he has form then?
Not the best way to garner support for his site.
Be nice, be helpful and people will spread the word in a positive way. Tell folks to get lost and the opposite will happen. Not rocket science.
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I asked about the forum early last year. He told me I had to add a trillion other people to my 'lost cousins' before I was worthy.
I didn't bother. Glad I didn't now if no-one uses it ???
Massive thumbs up to rootschat forum! 8)
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I was one of those Forum members (I had just over 300 entries on the database) but fell out big-time with some of the posters , though I avoided a slanging match by walking away. I have never "pulled" my account but in the light of this topic I think I now will do so. It has never been of any use in practise as an idea anyway even though the principle was good.
It has to be remembered that it always was a commercial venture from the outset despite any protestations about "community". It has been increasingly so of late and that I feel is the problem.
alanmack
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I've never found the Lost Cousins site much use. Only ever had 1 year's subscription and that was free from Peter. Only made contact with the odd couple of people, one of them I'd already had contact with via GR and I only ever heard from the other once as disagreed politely (and it was polite) with something she claimed was correct which all the evidence suggested otherwise.
Out of curiousity I added a number of extra people to my LC account about a year ago which then provided me with a code to register with the Forum (I think I should have also been invited but he authorised the account anyway). I've posted a couple of times but to be honest I find it very cliquey and not much help. The forum has been beta for 2 or 3 years and the "research help" section has not been activated, yet you would think that would encourage people to join as its the most widely used aspect of RC. And as for the email sent to everyone last year asking for them to albut explain why they weren't using the forum, I did have to resist temptation to post what I really thought was the problem. After an increase in posts for a week or two, it went back to being its very limited norm.
What amused me was the comment at one point that his Forum was not going to be like others where there are numerous arguements and disagrements, yet, as alanmack has said, that isn't quite how it plays out if you disagree with one of the regulars. ::)
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Thank you smudwhisk. It isn't just me then that found it cliquey (and snobbish too). That doesn't go for all the Forum members it must be said, many of whom were identifiably RC members too.
alanmack
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I've been thinking for a few weeks of cancelling my membership to Lost Cousins as I don't like his tone sometimes. That has made up my mind for me.
Thanks for the information Parmesan. I totally agree with groom and have now cancelled my membership.
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What a nasty individual he is! He doesn't deserve any members, like others I don't find his newsletter useful as it contains info which all serious researchers are aware of. So, what's the point of his site?? Seems it's way past its sell by date.
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Thank you smudwhisk. It isn't just me then that found it cliquey (and snobbish too). That doesn't go for all the Forum members it must be said, many of whom were identifiably RC members too.
alanmack
I agree not all members are cliquey and I've noticed the odd frustrated RC member on there. The problem I think is the size of the membership. As its very restricted by Peter, the cliquey minority do appear to be the most vocal and I do think are putting off a lot of others, along with the fact that the most used feature on RC, research help, is disabled on there still. After two or three years, you do wonder why the forum hasn't just been closed down as it must be costing him money to be hosted. It was a nice idea, but I doubt was ever going to compete against such an established and helpful site as RC. Yes we do have our public disagreements and arguments at times, but, in light of the vast number of daily posts on here, they are a small minority and overall the majority are helping others or a genuine discussion (albeit sometimes heated).
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I thought it was only me: I have had just 2 occasions in the many years I've been receiving the newsletter where I have sent him a feedback comment via email. On both occasions his replies were terse and rather patronising. So I haven't sent anymore since.
I still read the newsletters as every so often you do get a useful nugget of information (the GRO certificate update is interesting me at the moment) but I've never had contact from anyone about the names I've put into his database.
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After two or three years, you do wonder why the forum hasn't just been closed down as it must be costing him money to be hosted.
I don't think cost comes into it as it looks to be part of a hosting business so it is 'in-house'.
alanmack
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Never used the site, but there are a couple of freebies and a few notifications in their 20th Jan 2016 newsletter including Friends Reunited closing down.
http://lostcousins.com/newsletters2/midjan16news.htm
Regards
Malky
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"(albeit sometimes heated)"
;D :o ::) ;D
That's an understatement!
Followed quickly by an old Jasper Carrot punchline expletive from the mid-70s . . . . .
"Yoogahumpftamov!"
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Good grief - I had to read it a few times to make sure I wasn't seeing things!!!
The hike in FindMyPast subs was always on the cards once they'd recovered from the disaster of the new search engine so I doubt the 1939 had an awful lot to do with it in truth. Wonder who he blames for the hike in Ancestry subs?
I've only just started entering names in the last couple of weeks, but that email has well & truly put me off.
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I've never paid any fee to Lost Cousins. I've had a few e-mail correspondences with Peter Calver and he can be abrupt but I just ignore that. He even pointed me in the direction of some forms I could print off and fill in manually which would help when putting names on the Lost Cousins site.
Perhaps I've just been lucky. ;D
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I made the mistake of querying something with him once - as far as he was concerned he was right, end of story. Since I was beginning to get fed up with increasingly frequent 'newsletters' which latterly all seemed to be 'me, me, me', his diehard devotion to FindMyPast over everything else, and his, as displayed here, downright rudeness when you contacted him, I told him to close my account.
My cousin is still a member and said to me just recently 'he's getting worse'. Clearly he is!
Annette
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The most useful thing I've ever found was the genealogy mystery books he recommended. Did n't go via his site when buying though! Fed up hearing about tesco bargains etc. Yes I can agree with some of the comments re manner. I have n't added to his site for ages and I would think it's of limited use. I may cancel my free membership.
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I have been rather unimpressed with Master Calver for quite a while. I am reminded of Dad's Army and the likening of Captain Mainwaring to Napolean. He must get through a lot of Teddies.
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I have a free membership the the site, and was collecting my info to post onto it, but in light of the treatment that seems to be handed down, I don't think I will. :-\
There is never an excuse for rudeness under any circumstances..... >:(
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I have been rather unimpressed with Master Calver for quite a while. I am reminded of Dad's Army and the likening of Captain Mainwaring to Napolean. He must get through a lot of Teddies.
;D ;D ;D
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I've been a free member from the site's early days and have conscientiously entered all my relatives, but have never had a single contact from any "lost cousins", so it's been of little use to me.
I too am getting a little tired of his Find My Past affinity, also his jam making and his shopping tips. The newsletter is beginning to look like a personality trip and I can't help thinking that he is earning commission from the sites and items he recommends.
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I've been a free member from the site's early days and have conscientiously entered all my relatives, but have never had a single contact from any "lost cousins", so it's been of little use to me.
I suppose like any other "family finding" site it only works if distant relations are also members. As I'm no longer subscribed I'll never find out. :)
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I've found most of the interested ones via Genes Reunited. :)
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My relatives don't appear on the census's that he lists on the site, so it will be of little use to me, but the foot note at the bottom of the latest newsletter was the clincher for me to have my account cancelled. The final sentance reads....
."............................... And if you're not researching your family tree, never have done, and have no aspiration to do so in the future, please let me know so that I can close your account."
It makes one wonder why he got started in the first place. I have found most genealogists to be a friendly bunch willing to help one another or are all the good ones on RC ;) :D
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Just to say on the other side - and everyone is perfectly entitled to their views - that I continue to enjoy the Lost Cousins Newsletter, from the genealogical point of view and also in terms of tips and recommendations.
My only communications with Peter were perfectly courteously responded to. I am a member of his Forum, but don't participate because RC is excellent and there's not enough time in the day for RC and research as it is.
It takes all sorts which is why life is so interesting. ;D
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I am a member of his Forum, but don't participate because RC is excellent and there's not enough time in the day for RC and research as it is.
I think Igor you have hit the nail on the head so to speak regarding the lack of success of the Lost Cousins Forum. Rootschat being an established forum with a large membership has meant that the LC Forum needed to play catch up from the start. Unfortunately, in restricting the ability of people to join the forum, something that still continues, it was always going to struggle to compete and, as both I and others have said, the apparently cliqueyness (don't think that's the correct spelling ;D) of the forum adds to its problems.
As to experience of communication with Peter, well I've experienced both sides of his character. I have emailed him in relation to help clarify a couple of things he mentioned in his newsletter and received a polite response, one of which he was grateful about because he wasn't aware of the change of terms in relation to usage of the particular service and updated the newsletter accordingly. However, I have also had a somewhat heated discussion with him when he insisted that ancestry had been hacked the other year when it suffered a DDoA attack because for me the use of the term hacking was somewhat inaccurate and could lead to anxiety amongst those who weren't entirely familiar with what had happened to the site (it wasn't hacked, just taken offline by too much internet traffic).
Whether a minority or not, people's views of Peter will be coloured by their experiences of communication with him and, to be frank, some do appear to be somewhat rude. That obviously applies to many situations and is not just restricted to LC, but for someone who is running a business (namely the LC site) a little more diplomacy when replying even if he is very frustrated with people wouldn't do any harm to limit negative feedback as has been seen on this thread.
As for the LC Newsletter, in the past I've always thought it was very informative and useful, however over the last 18 months I personally think it has become rather limited in what has been included and I've found out far more from other sources, much of which he hasn't included when his next letter was released. I suppose some of this may be down to him concentrating perhaps more on his forum and less on the newsletter. But again that is just my personal opinion.
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He's actually said in his newsletter today he gets commission from from findmypast, hence to link vis his site.
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He's actually said in his newsletter today he gets commission from from findmypast, hence to link vis his site.
Regardless of ones opinion of him, there would be no advantage to him in negotiating discounts for recipients of his news letter if he didn't get a commission, so I have no problem with that.
Jebber
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Just to say on the other side - and everyone is perfectly entitled to their views - that I continue to enjoy the Lost Cousins Newsletter, from the genealogical point of view and also in terms of tips and recommendations.
I still get the newsletter and pick up some good things from it.... I've just learned which bits to skim! ;D
There's no need to be rude to your members though. Unless you want to lose even more members and deter new ones from joining..... not a particularly good business plan.
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LOL, I thought I was alone in having had rude responses from Mr C!!
Now, did I imagine it, or was he, a little while back... asking people to donate towards buying him a drink? (Or was it a new kitchen?:-)
Romilly ;)
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Now, did I imagine it, or was he, a little while back... asking people to donate towards buying him a drink? (Or was it a new kitchen?:-)
;D A certain proportion of his newsletters are links to deals on various websites where he gets credit for recommending you. Or something like that.
I just skip those bits and read the relevant bits!
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Took ages in the beginnings to fill in details of the 1881.....One contact which aid already found and nothing since.A good idea .....Looked at the forum with no success.Give me Roots Chat any day.
Ringrose
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Fail to see how anyone can possibly compare Lost Cousins to RootsChat,TWO completely different sites.
Am a great supporter of Lost Cousins,Peter C draws attention to the very many different areas of family history with his arranged cost cutting deals,also especially where previously accessible family history information may have been removed,he asks questions and invariably gets answers.
As a lady of limited means,I always wait for his information as to when Ancestry is free sometimes at Bank Holidays.
Having been stung badly by them years ago for 50 quid by mistake.
Brionne.
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As a lady of limited means,I always wait for his information as to when Ancestry is free sometimes at Bank Holidays.
Invariably similar information is posted here as soon as someone has an email from one of the subscription sites. ;D
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As a lady of limited means,I always wait for his information as to when Ancestry is free sometimes at Bank Holidays.
Invariably similar information is posted here as soon as someone has an email from one of the subscription sites. ;D
I don't think there is any need for competition.
Peter's Lost Cousins newsletter is regularly published, and if you like it you can read it, and if you don't you needn't.
I've never had anything but a courteous response from him, but if you've experienced rudeness, then fair enough, I can understand you'd not want to be in touch with him again, or read his newsletter.
I think he is very clear about the benefits he gets from the things he advertises, and again - if you don't want to click on his Amazon link to a book to benefit him, then you don't need to do it.
Rootschat is a wonderful resource - thanks, Tristram and Sarah! - and its members are equally wonderful. But there are other resources which can on occasion be helpful, and there's no reason to not to use those, if you are happy to.
:D :D
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In an ideal world all governmental genealogical records should be free to access when the time limit on restricted access has expired. Then on expiry any organization who is willing to copy the records and offer them free to all should have the ability to do that. The only organization that would be willing to do that is probably familysearch.org.
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Several people have asked why the LostCousins forum is still in beta after 3 years. It's very simple....
As regular readers of my newsletter will know, I contracted dengue fever in December 2013. Because of this I had to reduce my workload - stopping work on the forum was the obvious solution since at that stage only a very small percentage of LostCousins members had been invited to join.
It IS expensive to keep the forum running, but hopefully one day I will be well enough to finish what I started (but don't expect it to become a clone of Rootschat - that's not the way I do things).
Until then I will focus my efforts on the main LostCousins site, and my primary goal, which is to connect researchers who are cousins so that they can share past discoveries and collaborate on future research. All who share my vision are welcome.
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Congratulations on your work, Peter. I like it :D
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I also enjoy Lost Cousins, along with RootsChat and endless other worldwide resources that can be utilised while you are doing genealogy.
Why does one always have to be better than the other?
Depending on what you are researching every site has value.
sami
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I don't think the OP was about one site being better than another. I think it was about the quite rude attitude of the founder of Lost Cousins. However, upon reading the entire thread, I am willing to overlook that since it appears the man has had some serious health issues. Perhaps he was having a bad day that day. Also, I have just registered on LC and entered 5 or 6 ancestors. No matches, but every avenue should be utilized in the never ending search for family.
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It seems the attitude of the LostCousins staff has not improved over the years - arrogance and rudeness abound. They really need some lessons in customer service!
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Everyone who uses a Free website must bear in mind that it is a labour of love for the hard-working provider of much relevant information ... it is not a massive commercial venture with 'staff' who must be aware of 'customer service'. I have used it successfully to find Cousins and although a subscriber I haven't paid for any subscription and find the regular newsletter provides invaluable information and discount links to findmypast and ancestry amongst others. I'm happy to donate whenever I get something for free, as I do to this site and wikipedia.
I was in business for 40 years and every now and then a rogue complaining 'customer' with little justification would tell me how to run my company and how bad my 'service attitude was'. When they crossed the line they got short shrift and asked the telling question, " What else do you want for FREE ?"
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Ian Nelson - I agree. I don't think Peter Calver is particularly rude, I think it's just his manner and as he says he and his wife have been shielding and cleaning everything in sight, I imagine he and/or his wife must have some health issues. I'm almost 80 and haven't been shielding particularly and my cleaning is the same as normal ::) ::)
I've contacted him via email and sometimes his replies are quite pleasing, other times if he disagrees with you they can come across as rather abrupt, but I think emails and other written contact can often be misunderstood, even on here, Rootschatters have had to explain that they didn't mean what the reader thought they meant. Thank goodness for the emojis on here. :)
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It seems the attitude of the LostCousins staff has not improved over the years - arrogance and rudeness abound. They really need some lessons in customer service!
You speak as if it's a large organisation with lots of employees?
It's one man, so far as I know, and it appears he does what he does for the love of family history research and in the spirit of helping people, rather than making loads of money.
I'm sorry if you've been upset by him, but I would only comment that my experience has been excellent with Lost Cousins and his newsletter is always interesting, helpful and engaging.
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I was impressed with lost cousins at first but I have seen it's decline, unfortunately. At first I thought that when I read about current subjects written about, such as covid, that it was me, and that I was being somewhat sensitive to how it came across. But it does come across as preaching and it you don't agree then you are reckless and stupid.
Recently, there were some very hard words concerning the story of the poor youngster A***** B********e. Disparaging assumptions and judgements were made that were shocking and upsetting to read, with no thought at all of the family. Further information of the family had been researched and included, which is totally inappropriate. The owner of the site is entitled to his opinion, but in this instance it went too far and should not have been subject of a family history newsletter. One premise that we abide by when asking for help is to NOT post living peoples names. This family is not his family. I found it wholly unsuitable material for discussing about in a newsletter.
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I'm not saying your concerns about the newsletter item were unjustified - far from it - but might it be a good idea to raise them on the Lost Cousins forum or with the site owner directly?
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I did consider doing so. From experience, the attitude that comes across when he's discussing members private messages and his response to them, written about in the newsletters is something that makes uncomfortable reading. I am considering this. It is likely that any message posted would be struck off as it would go against his views....or at least disparaged completely.
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I have to agree with bones5, it was totally inappropriate to post details in a 'newsletter' of the family of the young child who had so very recently passed away - it was insensitive & frankly outrageous when his family are still coming to terms with it. At a minimum, I expect to see a very humble apology front-and-centre of the next issue of the newsletter.
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Strangely he did a Zoom talk last year for an organisation I belong to and he was quite timid. I was surprised, given his on line persona.
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There have been two or three occasions over the years when something I have emailed Peter about has picqued his interest. He has always asked, very politely, whether I would mind if he used the exmple in one of his forthcoming newsletters.
Maybe that happened this time around.
Pheno
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Thank you for your replies and thoughts.
I would say that the zoom meeting is likely a different case where manners and a certain protocol is observed, whereas the LC newsletters are entirely his choice of content, whether given consent by others to include information or just his own views. Rather like using a ' telephone voice' when answering a call, being polite and 'proper'. Or not.
No matter what the life and circumstances, a child has died and the family are grieving. Respect should have been observed and any tittle tattle and assumptions should have been unspoken.
I do apologise for hijacking this thread, I thought the best place was to add my comments on this topic.
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No matter what the life and circumstances, a child has died and the family are grieving. Respect should have been observed and any tittle tattle and assumptions should have been unspoken.
I agree, there was no reason to use the poor boy as an example of name changes, there are plenty of others that could have been used. He also has jumped to a conclusion that hasn't been proved and won't be until after an inquest. Hopefully A's parents won't read it.
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Another aspect of the article was that it came across as judgemental. This is a family of now, not a genealogy project.
That was my thought too, that his parents would hopefully not read it.