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Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: Cormack123 on Tuesday 07 June 16 12:17 BST (UK)

Title: New to rootschat - tracing James Waters who married Jemima Dunbar in 1845
Post by: Cormack123 on Tuesday 07 June 16 12:17 BST (UK)
Hi
I am new to this forum. I have researched quite a bit of my family tree, but have got stuck with tracing James Waters who married Jemima Dunbar in 1845. James was born about 1824 in Caithness, Scotland and had a daughter Jemima Dunbar Waters who married David Cormack.
Any help greatly appreciated.
KC
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: rosie17 on Tuesday 07 June 16 12:37 BST (UK)
Hi and welcome to Rootschat what is it you are stuck with is it his parents you are looking for do you have the family in the census forms ?  ..Have you tried for a death on Scotlands People for James Waters assuming they remained in Scotland
Rosie
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: Cormack123 on Tuesday 07 June 16 12:49 BST (UK)
Thanks for replying. I have tried all that stuff. I am really looking for his parents, exactly where and when he was born. I have him in the Scottish censuses
KC
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: avm228 on Tuesday 07 June 16 13:04 BST (UK)
Rosie mentioned death registrations on ScotlandsPeople - you say you've tried everything she suggested but if he did stay in Scotland the death registration is your best bet and first port of call for finding out his parents' names.

Did you succeed in tracing a death?
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: rosie17 on Tuesday 07 June 16 13:11 BST (UK)
I can see the family in the 1891 census in Portobello Midlothian have you tried for a death there ..A tree has a death for him 1897 ?
Rosie
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: rosie17 on Tuesday 07 June 16 13:15 BST (UK)
1 match comes up on Scotlands People 1897 Portobello James Waters age range 1822-1827
Rosie
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: larkspur on Tuesday 07 June 16 14:06 BST (UK)
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XY9D-T38
Free Site to search Cormack.

Welcome to Rootschat

Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: Millmoor on Tuesday 07 June 16 15:55 BST (UK)
Welcome from me too. The Edinburgh Evening News 15 May 1897 has his death notice "At No 6 Rosefield Place on the 14th inst James Waters (late of HM Customs ) in his 76th year". As Rosie has stated his death cert. should give his parent's names.

William
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: Cormack123 on Tuesday 07 June 16 15:57 BST (UK)
Not sure if that's the right one. I have him dieing earlier and his wife Jemima went to live with her daughter. There seems to be another James Waters born in the area in 1822. Will continue checking
Thanks for the help
KC
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: Cormack123 on Tuesday 07 June 16 16:07 BST (UK)
I'm pretty sure that's not my James Waters. Mine married in 1845 aged 21 and was born 1824. I think he and Jemima (jimmima) Dunbar had 2 daughters, Jemima Dunbar Waters and Isobel(?) I have not traced any other siblings and not sure that Isobel is correct name.
Thanks for all your help though. This is a great site.
KC
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: avm228 on Tuesday 07 June 16 16:13 BST (UK)
You've got the Scottish censuses, so you'll have seen that in 1881 James Waters (married to Jemima Dunbar Waters) is a superintendent of HM Customs.

The 1897 newspaper report, referencing HM Customs, therefore looks a good match, unless you've established it's really not your man ???
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: Christine53 on Tuesday 07 June 16 16:16 BST (UK)
1891 Scotland census

James Waters 49 Supt of Customs Retired
Jemima Waters 64 wife
Isabella Waters 28
Jane Eliza Waters 27
address 6 Rosefield Place , Duddingston , Portobello

James's age may be a transcription error - you would need to check the original on ScotlandsPeople. I think it's unlikely that there are 2 retired Customs Superintendents called James Waters and with a wife called Jemima?? I can see the family in the earlier censuses and the occupation checks out - there are lots of siblings for Jemima junior.
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: avm228 on Tuesday 07 June 16 16:18 BST (UK)
You will also have seen that they had several more children than you've mentioned:

1871: Rosanna 22, Jemima 21, Isabella 14, Jane 13, Alexander 9
1881: Isabella 24. Jane Eliza 23, Alexander McLeod Waters 19
1891: Isabella 28, Jane Eliza 27 (!!!)

By 1901 Jemima snr is widowed and living with married daughter Jemima Cormack.  Youngest daughter Jane E Waters ("38") is there too.
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: Cormack123 on Tuesday 07 June 16 16:21 BST (UK)
I'm happy with the 1881 census data, but could not track him in 1891. My grandfather born in 1880 said he never knew him, but Jemima was living with them. The discrepancy in birth year is also an issue, although these things are often wrong. I won't discount this one entirely, but there were a lot of Customs officials in Wick at the time and I have been going down the wrong line with Master Mariners with identical names on the Cormack side. James Waters does not seem to be an uncommon name.
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: Millmoor on Tuesday 07 June 16 16:28 BST (UK)
The transcription on another site to the one quoted for the 1891 census does give James Waters age as 69. There would appear to me to be an awful lot of coincidences if this  is not your man.

William
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: avm228 on Tuesday 07 June 16 16:33 BST (UK)
The man who died in 1897 is incontrovertibly yours - see his death registration on ScotlandsPeople as Rosie first suggested.

His death registration shows he was married to Jemima Dunbar.

As we already knew from the newspaper notice, he died at 6 Rosefield Place, Portobello - the same address where he and his family were in 1891.

The informant of his death was his daughter Jane E Waters.

Parents (both deceased) are recorded as:

James Waters, Collector of HM Customs & Janet Waters, maiden surname Jackson.
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: Christine53 on Tuesday 07 June 16 16:41 BST (UK)
Here is his christening record :

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XYD4-V68

James Waters b 26 May 1821 & christened 20 Jul 1821 at Thurso, Caithness , parents James Waters and Janet Jackson
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: Cormack123 on Tuesday 07 June 16 16:50 BST (UK)
I think you have convinced me!
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: rosie17 on Tuesday 07 June 16 19:04 BST (UK)
The man who died in 1897 is incontrovertibly yours - see his death registration on ScotlandsPeople as Rosie first suggested.

His death registration shows he was married to Jemima Dunbar.

As we already knew from the newspaper notice, he died at 6 Rosefield Place, Portobello - the same address where he and his family were in 1891.

The informant of his death was his daughter Jane E Waters.

Parents (both deceased) are recorded as:

James Waters, Collector of HM Customs & Janet Waters, maiden surname Jackson.

Very kind of you avm to take the time to find His  death
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: Duck on Tuesday 07 June 16 19:14 BST (UK)
Well done everyone, great lookups, it's folk like you who make RootsChat the No.1 genealogy forum it is
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: Annette7 on Tuesday 07 June 16 19:18 BST (UK)
Something else to bear in mind regarding Scottish records, is that it was perfectly acceptable for an illegitimate child to have the surname of his father.

One of the 3 baptisms for James' baptism on familysearch says 'James Waters or Jackson' which would suggest to me that his parents were not married.    There are no other children shown born to a James Waters/Janet Jackson.   The 1851 Census shows a James Waters bc.1788 born Thurso, Caithness as a lodger in Inverness - he is unmarried and occupation is 'Collector of Customs'.   This could well be your James' father.

Just looked at James' baptism at Thurso on SP - born 26 May, bp.20 July 1821 'son of James Waters, Esq. Collector of Customs, Wick by Janet Jackson, Thurso - this again would indicate the parents weren't married - however, at least you can confirm James jnr. father who from census appears to have never married.

Annette
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: Millmoor on Tuesday 07 June 16 19:31 BST (UK)
The James Waters identified by Annette 7 may have left a will as there is an entry in the wills index on Scotland's People for James Waters collector of customs Inverness with a date of 12 04 1853.

William
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: Cormack123 on Wednesday 08 June 16 00:17 BST (UK)
You guys are really good. Makes me a real novice at this. Thanks so much for all your help. Ages are obviously not very accurate, especially in the 1991 census and in James marriage record.
KC
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: Millmoor on Wednesday 08 June 16 08:57 BST (UK)
I think half the battle is being aware of all the different resources out there. Just one or two further observations.

A really useful free resource is Freecen for census transcriptions Caithness is particularly well covered. I note that there is a Janet Jackson in Thurso in the 1841  and 1851 census (in the latter she is showing as a widow). There is also a possible birth for her in 1797 coming up on Family Search as well as a possible marriage to a Gilbert Gordon in 1824(the 1841 census has two girls with the surname transcribed as Gordin in her household). There is a death for a Janet Gordon, other surname Jackson, mother's surname Bain in Thurso in 1858. Might be worth following up. (It was not uncommon for widows to be recorded by their maiden name in the census).

I also think you would find a search in the British Newspaper Archive of value. Doing a search for James Waters in Caithness and Inverness newspapers produces a lot of hits. There is, for example, a report of the death of James  Waters in the Inverness Courier Sept 23 1852.

Hope this helps

William
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: jaybelnz on Wednesday 08 June 16 09:37 BST (UK)
Remember that in Scotland married women may still legally use their maiden name!
Title: Re: New to rootschat
Post by: larkspur on Wednesday 08 June 16 10:29 BST (UK)
Here is his christening record :

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XYD4-V68

James Waters b 26 May 1821 & christened 20 Jul 1821 at Thurso, Caithness , parents James Waters and Janet Jackson

Given by me on reply number 6.......I do wonder why I bother sometimes 8)