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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Yorkshire (West Riding) Lookup Requests => Yorkshire (West Riding) => England => Yorkshire (West Riding) Completed Requests => Topic started by: susan57 on Saturday 11 June 16 10:11 BST (UK)
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Hello, I would love to track down Alice Schofield for my 92 year old auntie. Alice was her mother although she and her sister were not brought up by her. Alice died in childbirth in her 40's, and as my auntie was the youngest it would be June 1924. She married John William Schofield in 1919 and had apparently had other children although I'm not sure if they were to John or a previous relationship.
My auntie believes her to be buried/cremated at Beckett St cemetery in Leeds. PLEASE can anyone help find Alice???
Thanks
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What was her maiden name
If it was Lane this could be her death as it tie in with a birth in the same quarter
Deaths Sep 1925
Schofield Alice 40 Leeds 9b 288
(Sorry added last bit after Dawnsh's post below)
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Hi
There's a death on www.freebmd.org.uk Sept 1925 in Leeds for Alice Schofield aged 40
There's a Schofield/Lane marriage in Leeds in 1919 and 3 children born Leeds 1920, 1922 and Sept 1925 which could tie up with the death.
(edited)
Beckett Road
Alice Schofield of 4 Halls Court, Hunslet, Leeds, wife of John, buried 13 August 1925, aged 39 yrs, grave number 21846
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The Friends of Beckett Road may be able to help you locate the plot
http://www.beckettstreetcemetery.org.uk/records_general.php
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Looking at the burial register online, she seems to be in common or public plot with other unrelated people so there most probably won't be a headstone.
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Well rosie99 and dawnsh that was quick THANKS!! Its a real puzzle. The details on my aunties birth certificate were for "Alice Schofield, late Lane, formerly Briggs", so the Lane connection fits. Trouble is my auntie and her sister were born 1923 and 1924 but they never lived with her and were brought up in "scattered houses " in Leeds???? Will have a look at freebsd.org.uk and see what I find. Might get back to you. Thanks again
Sue
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There are Schofield/Briggs children also born in Leeds for that time frame but you will know which ones are correct.
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the marriage certificate is on ancestry and gives the father of alice as Thomas palfreyman lane - engine driver and alice as 33 and a spinster.
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there is an alice briggs born leeds 1886
Alice Briggs
1886 jan-Feb-Mar
Leeds
Yorkshire West Riding Vol9b Page:436
no - think she marries someone else
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the marriage certificate is on ancestry and gives the father of alice as
Thomas palfreyman lane - engine driver and
alice as 33 and a spinster.
I wonder if this is the family
Thomas Palfreman BRIGGS
1856 Oct-Nov-Dec York Volume: 9d Page: 32
Thomas Palfreeman BRIGGS
1878 Oct-Nov-Dec Lichfield Volume: 6b Page: 635
Female name on page
Eliza FISHER
1881 RG11; Piece: 4692; Folio: 20; Page: 34
Thos P BRIGGS & Eliza
mother in law Mary A Fisher
1891 RG12; Piece: 2679; Folio: 58; Page: 10
29 Annes(b)y Terrace Colwick Nottinghamshire
Thomas P BRIGGS 34 York Railway engine driver
Eliza 32
Florence 8
ALICE 5 Colwick Notts
Tom 3
Harry 1
Alice BRIGGS
1886 Jan-Feb-Mar Basford Volume: 7b Page: 258
1901 RG13; Piece: 3355; Folio: 58; Page: 47
37 Ernest Street Cheshire
More children Charlie BRIGGS 8, Miriam 5, Eva M 3
Edited
Dau Miriam Briggs marries St Jude Preston Lancashire 2 Sep 1918 to Edward Thomas Parry
Her father named as Thomas Phalphreyman Briggs deceased Engine Driver
One witness E M Briggs
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Blimey this is all way too confusing now :(. Struggling with it all as nothing seems to tally.
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my aunties birth certificate were for
"Alice Schofield, late Lane, formerly Briggs"
the marriage certificate is on ancestry and gives the father of alice as
Thomas palfreyman lane - engine driver and alice as 33 and a spinster.
I can't find an Alice LANE born c 1886 with father Thomas P (Palreyman) LANE on the 1891 or 1901 census ???
Perhaps the Thomas Palfreyman Briggs & dau. Alice are a different family altogether :-\
but there are quite a few similarities, eg. his first names, his occupation, Alice's age/birth year
Was a mistake made on her 1919 m/c to John William Schofield perhaps
her father's surname should be Briggs and she should have been noted as a widow ???
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Hi dawnsh,
where did you find Schofield/Lane marriage with 3 births 1920, 1922 and 1923 please? Sounds like closest info but my aunt and her sister were born 1923 and 1924 and they never lived with there mother, not sure why??
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my aunties birth certificate were for "Alice Schofield, late Lane, formerly Briggs"
Not sure if there is any connection here
There’s this marriage entry Briggs/Lane but it's in Kent and I can't see a death of Reginald Lane between 1914 - 1919, other than a Reginald A Lane age 31 in Jun 1914 Yeovil Somerset on FreeBMD
Jun 1914 Elham vol 2a page 2505
Alice BRIGGS to Reginald LANE
for info.
I think Thomas died
1905 Nantwich
Thomas P BRIGGS age 48
And Eliza remarried
1906 Aston
John Richard Rees
There is a public tree on Ancestry for Thomas Palfreyman Briggs nothing more on Alice Briggs born c 1886 Colwick other than censuses 1891/1901
There is a picture of her sister Miriam Parry nee Briggs with her husband & dau
and birth entry for another sister Dorothy born 1902 Crewe Cheshire and remarriage entry for mother Eliza
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Thanks Ladyhawk, the Briggs/Lane marriage is a possibility. Will bear it in mind
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Thanks Ladyhawk, the Briggs/Lane marriage is a possibility. Will bear it in mind
I did a quick check on FreeBMD to see if there were any children born after 1914 - 1919
surname Lane mmn Briggs but couldn't see any in Elham - the only ones I could find were
1916 Oxford Gladys R Lane
1918 Leeds Alice Lane
Have you found Alice on 1911 census ?
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Hi Susan
I used www.freebmd.org.uk to find a marriage of John W Schofield to an Alice in 1919
and got this
June 1919
Lane, Alice, sp Schofield, Leeds, 9b 872
Schofield, John W, sp Lane, Leeds, 9b, 872
and then used freebmd again to do a birth search from 1919 where the surname is Schofield and the mother's maiden name is Lane
There are 3 results in Leeds but this may be wrong as you said Alice's maiden surname is Briggs
so you need to do a birth search whre the surname is Schofield and the mothers maiden surname is Briggs
You have a certificate so you know which entry is correct.
It's not possible to know if the thers are correct without buying more certificates.
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my aunt and her sister were born 1923 and 1924 and they never lived with there mother,
not sure why??
I used www.freebmd.org.uk to find a marriage of John W Schofield to an Alice in 1919
and got this
June 1919
Lane, Alice, sp Schofield, Leeds, 9b 872
Schofield, John W, sp Lane, Leeds, 9b, 872
and then used freebmd again to do a birth search from 1919 where the surname is Schofield and the mother's maiden name is Lane
There are 3 results in Leeds but this may be wrong as you said Alice's maiden surname is Briggs
so you need to do a birth search whre the surname is Schofield and the mothers maiden surname is Briggs
You have a certificate so you know which entry is correct.
It's not possible to know if the thers are correct without buying more certificates.
Hi Susan
If the two Schofield/Briggs births on FreeBMD Leeds 1923/1924 are your Aunt & her sister
Alice Briggs born 1886 Colwick her parents Thomas Palfreyman Briggs & Eliza have a daughter with the same first name as the 1924 Leeds birth entry - again may just be a coincidence :-\
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It would seem to me that for whatever reason Alice had changed her surname to Lane when she married or indeed she had married to a Lane previously and maybe not free to actually marry again. Certainly, whilst she marries Schofield as a spinster and gives her Briggs father the surname of Lane too, to all intents and purposes she appears to come clean on the birth certificate of your aunts birth certificate as she was then Alice Schofield, late Lane (either by changing her surname herself or by earlier marriage), formerly Briggs.
Thomas Palfreman(variants) Briggs was indeed an Engine Driver in 1901 and she herself states her maiden name as Briggs on your aunts birth certificate. So either by choice or a previous marriage she'd become a 'Lane' by 1919. Since the Reginald Lane/Alice Briggs 1914 marriage certificate details are not available online it's impossible to say if this was her or not. Since you believe she'd had previous children IF the 1914 at Elham marriage was correct, a Gladys R. Lane mmn Briggs birth June.qtr.1916 Oxford (i.e. still down South) and then there is an Alice born in Leeds 2 years later. It looks to me like Gladys R. Lane married in Leeds in 1937 to a Rowland Lucas. Deaths index show a Gladys Rees Lucas born 22/3/1916 died. Jan.1992 Northumberland (he died in Leeds 1980). There is only the one Gladys R. Lane born in 1916 Oxford.
There was also a Reginald Lane killed in WW1 on 4/10/1917 Devonshire Regt.??
Annette
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Thanks Ladyhawk, the Briggs/Lane marriage is a possibility. Will bear it in mind
I did a quick check on FreeBMD to see if there were any children born after 1914 - 1919
surname Lane mmn Briggs but couldn't see any in Elham - the only ones I could find were
1916 Oxford Gladys R Lane
1918 Leeds Alice Lane
Have you found Alice on 1911 census ?
After her remarriage Eliza and her family lived in Oxford
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The 1914 marriage to Reginald Lane looking more and more likely.
Annette
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Just realised that Eliza's 2nd husband was surname Rees - and this is the second name of Alice Brigg's possible daughter Gladys!!
Annette
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Hello, I would love to track down Alice Schofield for my 92 year old auntie. Alice was her mother although she and her sister were not brought up by her. Alice died in childbirth in her 40's, and as my auntie was the youngest it would be June 1924. She married John William Schofield in 1919 and had apparently had other children although I'm not sure if they were to John or a previous relationship.
My auntie believes her to be buried/cremated at Beckett St cemetery in Leeds. PLEASE can anyone help find Alice???
Thanks
Hello Susan
I not sure what you want to know about Alice Schofield nee Lane- Either 1) As much info of Alice's exact burial location in Beckett St cemetery in Leeds with scan copy map of the grave location of the common grave to show your 92 year old aunty
2) Alice Schofield who died 1925 wanting her family ancestry info
If its about Alice's grave info ? this link will give you details where and who to contact offline for more detailed information.
Enquiries about burials at Beckett Street Cemetery from people who cannot visit Leeds can be sent to the Chief Superintendent of Cemeteries & Crematoria, Lawnswood Cemetery, Otley Road, Leeds LS16 6AH
or
Leeds Library
See link
http://www.gravestonepix.com/contents1a/2010/09/beckett-street-cemetery-leeds/?doing_wp_cron=1465689137.1538689136505126953125
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At the moment it's looking like the children of Alice Schofield, late Lane, formerly Briggs could be as follows:
Gladys Rees Lane b.1916 Oxford )
Alice Lane b.1918 Leeds ) father Reginald Lane ?? died WW1 4/10/1917
Alice - as Lane -
married John W Schofield 1919 Leeds and possible children of this union are:
Lily Schofield - mmn Lane Mar.1920 Leeds - bur.15/4/1922 dau. of John W.
John W. Schofield - mmn Lane Jun.1922 Leeds - died 1922
Daughter Schofield - mmn Briggs Sept.1923 Leeds
Daughter Schofield - mmn Briggs Sept.1924 Leeds
Florrie Schofield - mmn Lane Sept.1925 Leeds - died Sept.1925 Leeds
Since Alice died Sept.qtr.1925 in childbirth, as your aunt was born in 1924 there must have been a further pregnancy after her and a birth/death in Sept.1925 for a Florrie Schofield - this time mmn Lane again - would fit the bill. It seem that infants who died at/soon after birth are not shown in the Cemetery Index.
So, if all this hypothesis is correct, Alice had 2 children with Mr. Lane, then 5 with Mr. Schofield - the first 2 of which died, then your aunt and her sister in 1923 and 1924, then a further daughter in Sept.1925 who also died the same period as Alice herself. Last 5 children in 5 years - poor woman!
Annette
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Hello all,
Thanks so much for all your responses. Thought I would update on what I have got so far.
We now have a burial for Alice in Leeds Sept 1925. I have a marriage certificate for Alice Lane and John w. Schofield for 1919 which states her father to be Thomas Palfreman Lane. I am wondering now if her Mother was Briggs and what happened re a marriage for them????
The family which makes most sense to us is
Edna b.1919 born Keighley mms Briggs
Geoffrey b.1920 born Bradford mms Briggs
Stanley b.1921 born Bradford mms Briggs
Joe b.//1923 born Leeds mms Briggs
Caroline b.1923 born Leeds mms Briggs (aunties living sister)
Eva b.1924 born Leeds mms Briggs (auntie)
and maybe another child ? died with Alice in childbirth 1925(aunty remembers being told she died in childbirth)
I have received info re another scenario for aunties siblings which I am currently trying to check out.
Thanks so far all
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Another piece of the jigsaw:
Alice Schofield buried 1925 at Leeds Becket Street, entry No 71819 grave No 21846 unconsecrated section. (Together with 15 others)
No headstone recorded but the plot should be relatively easy to find?
[Grave at head of row (21840) has headstone, with Alice buried 6 graves in off the 'Dissenters Walk'.]
Brian
Personal details:
Abode_Name 4
Abode_Street Halls Court
Abode_Place Hunslet, Leeds
Relationship Wife of
Rel_Male_Forenames J
Rel_Male_Surname SCHOFIELD
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There was also a Reginald Lane killed in WW1 on 4/10/1917 Devonshire Regt.??
Unfortunately no further info. given as to whether this Reginald Lane married 1914 Alice Briggs
http://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/835300/LANE,%20REGINALD
Found this info. but still doesn’t help but thought I’d post anyway
Details from UK, Army Registers of Soldiers' Effects, 1901-1929
Reginald Lane Death Date: 4 Oct 1917
Rank: Private Regiment: Devonshire Regiment
Regimental Number: 201851
Under these headings on the above form is following detail
credits & charges
date of authority, to whom authorised
27/5/18 father Jesse
17/11/19 fa. Jesse
1901 there is a father Jesse Lane, wife Bessie with a son Reginald born Beckenham living in KENT
RG13; Piece: 688; Folio: 38; Page: 16
and his ch.
Reginald Lane born 9 Apr 1890
Baptism Date: 4 Oct 1891 Beckenham, Kent, England
Father: Jesse Lane Mother: Bessie
Marriage
Sep 1884 Bromley
Jesse Lane name on same page Bessie Wheeler
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I have marriage certificate for Alice Lane and John w. Schofield for 1919 which states her father to be Thomas Palfreman Lane.
I am wondering now if her Mother was Briggs and what happened re a marriage for them????
E.. b.1924 born Leeds mms Briggs (auntie)
I'm still inclined to think the family below are Alice's - Speculation & I maybe totally wrong but
Alice named one of her daughters E.. possibly after her sister E.. Mary :-\
and Annette posted Florrie Schofield - mmn Lane Sept.1925 Leeds - died Sept.1925 Leeds
Alice Briggs also had a sister named Florence
I wonder if this is the family
Thomas Palfreman BRIGGS
1856 Oct-Nov-Dec York Volume: 9d Page: 32
Thomas Palfreeman BRIGGS
1878 Oct-Nov-Dec Lichfield Volume: 6b Page: 635
Female name on page
Eliza FISHER
1881 RG11; Piece: 4692; Folio: 20; Page: 34
Thos P BRIGGS & Eliza, mother in law Mary A Fisher
1891 RG12; Piece: 2679; Folio: 58; Page: 10
29 Annes(b)y Terrace Colwick Nottinghamshire
Thomas P BRIGGS 34 York Railway engine driver
Eliza 32
Florence 8
ALICE 5 Colwick Notts
Tom 3
Harry 1
Alice BRIGGS 1886 Jan-Feb-Mar Basford Volume: 7b Page: 258
1901 RG13; Piece: 3355; Folio: 58; Page: 47
37 Ernest Street Cheshire
Thomas & Eliza have more children Charlie BRIGGS 8, Miriam 5, Eva M 3
Edited
Dau Miriam Briggs marries St Jude Preston Lancashire 2 Sep 1918 to Edward Thomas Parry
Her father named as Thomas Phalphreyman Briggs deceased Engine Driver, One witness E M Briggs
What does anyone else think?
Finding Alice Brigg's first marriage to ? Lane may unravel the mystery of her father's name
was it Thomas Palfreyman Lane or Briggs ???
Or
perhaps ordering one of the birth certificates for Lane/Briggs to see if mother is Alice Lane formely Briggs and confirming the first name their father and that hopefully might help pinpoint her marriage
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Personal details for Florrie Schofield:
Cemetery Harehills Cemetery
Burial Entry 9890
Forename(s) Florrie
Surname SCHOFIELD
Abode
Description
Burial (Day) 17
Burial (Month) August
Burial (Year) 1925
Age (Years)
Age (Months)
Age (Other) 4 days
Year of Birth 1925
Grave Type Consecrated
Grave Section D1
Grave Number 275
Grave Type Consecrated
Together with 11 others!
NB No parents name listed/address.
Brian
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Since you believe she'd had previous children IF the 1914 at Elham marriage was correct,
Gladys R. Lane mmn Briggs birth June.qtr.1916 Oxford (i.e. still down South)
It looks to me like Gladys R. Lane married in Leeds in 1937 to a Rowland Lucas.
Deaths index show a
Gladys Rees Lucas born 22/3/1916 died. Jan.1992 Northumberland
(he died in Leeds 1980).
There is only the one Gladys R. Lane born in 1916 Oxford.
Good spot Annette re: death entry for Gladys showing her middle name Rees
1905 Nantwich death of Thomas P BRIGGS age 48
Eliza Briggs remarried 1906 Aston John Richard Rees
Just realised that Eliza's 2nd husband was surname Rees - and this is the second name of Alice Brigg's possible daughter Gladys!!
You could be onto something there - her birth certificate would confirm and may unravel they mystery of Alice's first husband.
As to why she was noted as a spinster on her m/c to John Scholfield we may never know - maybe just a simply mistake........ :-\
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I think the registrar on that marriage certificate to John Schofield either did not ask the right questions or made assumptions. There surely were not 2 men named Thomas Palrefman Lane and Thomas Palfreyman Briggs, both of them Railway engine drivers. You did say one birth certificate said mmn late Lane formerly Briggs which usually means she was born Alice Briggs and her 1st marriage was to a man named Lane.
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There is a birth and death Sept 1/4 1925 for Florrie Schofield mmn Lane but why would she be buried in a different cemetery to her mother?
my reply #2 and Brians reply # 28
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Beckett Street cemetery
Lily Schofield, of 19 Henry Street Leeds, daughter of John W, April 15 1922, aged 2 years, in public grave 22316
Her 1920 birth is registered with mmn Lane
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there is only one birth of a Thomas Palfre(y)man in an approriate timescale
Births Dec 1856 (>99%)
Briggs Thomas Palfreman York 9d 32
Schofield children with mmn Lane and Briggs
It could be who registered the birth giving just a former name especially if the question was phrased 'former name of mother' rather than ' maiden name of mother'
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Well, It seems what I thought was the right family is now clearly not :'(. Don't honestly know where to turn now. Disappointed.
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Well, It seems what I thought was the right family is now clearly not :'(.
Don't honestly know where to turn now. Disappointed.
Hi Susan
Can we just recap and confirm that
Surname C & E Schofield mmn Briggs births on FreeBMD
Leeds 1923/1924 your Aunt & her sister
You have one of the b/c confirming Alice Schofield, late Lane, formely Briggs
Can you confirm the father’s name is John William Schofield?
What was his occupation?
Who was the informant on b/c?
You might want to think about obtaining the other b/c to see if that confirms the same info.
Are you certain that the 1919 marriage of Alice Lane & John William Schofield is the correct
one?
The only other suggestion I can give is perhaps taking a gamble and purchase the birth certificate
for Gladys R Lane, and fingers crossed that her mother is Alice formely Briggs
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The trouble with speed genealogy is that you can get all sorts of results, but you have to take time and work through all the scenarios.
Your initial request was to find Alice Schofield's burial place, that was established very early on.
You suggested the 1919 marriage and we found a possible entry for you. And then the confusion started.
I would sit back and take stock and see if you can get a budget together so that you can purchase a couple more certificates. They cost £9.25 direct from the GRO and can eat your money very quickly.
Do you have any historic family certificates tucked away at home that might help? ie your parents?
It doesn't help that John William Schofield is not a unique name and that your auntie had a troubled start to her life.
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If burial records needed for Leeds just shout!
Name and a year needed will get back to you.
[Access to municipal burial records]
Brian
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Thanks for your responses guys, sorry for the despondency but its a really tricky one and my auntie aint getting any younger ;). Will get back to you all if I need any help xx
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Hi Calverley Lad,
Please can I take you up on you offer?
Could you check whether the following children of Alice Schofield are buried at Beckett St cemetery Leeds?
Lily Schofield b.1920 d.1922
John William Schofield b.and d. 1922
Alice was buried there Sept 1925 in plot 21846
Thank you
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Forename(s) Lily
Surname SCHOFIELD
Abode
Description
Burial (Day)
Burial (Month)
Burial (Year) 1922
Age (Years)
Age (Months)
Age (Other)
Page
Grave Type Unconsecrated
Grave Section
Grave Number 22316
Cemetery Harehills Cemetery
Burial Entry 7424
Forename(s) John William
Surname SCHOFIELD
Abode
Description
Burial (Day) 28
Burial (Month) April
Burial (Year) 1922
Age (Years)
Age (Months) 1
Age (Other)
Year of Birth 1922
Grave Type Consecrated
Grave Section D1
Grave Number 588
Burial Entry 71819
Grave Type Unconsecrated
Grave Number 21846
Forename(s) Alice
Surname SCHOFIELD
Abode_Name 4
Abode_Street Halls Court
Abode_Place Hunslet, Leeds
Status
Description
Relationship Wife of
Rel_Male_Forenames J
Rel_Male_Surname SCHOFIELD
Rel_Male_Trade
Rel_Female_Forenames
Rel_Female_Surname
Rel_Female_Trade
Burial (Day) 13
Burial (Month) August
Burial (Year) 1925
Age (Years) 39
All entries buried at Beckett St unless otherwise stated.
Brian
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Thanks Calverley Lad,
Can I verify Lily was buried at Beckett St plz?
Also puzzled as to why poor lil Johns at Harehills, any idea who else is in that grave?
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John William buried with 10 others.
Lily confirmed buried at Becket Street with 14 others.
Brian
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Thank you Calverley Lad
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Good night, off to bed. :)
Brian
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A little more detail just in case it helps:
15 Apr 1822 Lily Schofield aged 2 of 19 Henry Street, Leeds, daughter of John W Schofield
Unfortunately there is no further detail on John William's burial at Harehill's two weeks later.
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Lily Schofield died June qtr 1922 age 2 as likely walking infant (not a baby as such)
Alice Schofield died Sept qtr 1925 aged 40 (buried 13 August 1825 aged 39 ?)
It would suggest they likely both died in St James Hospital address Beckett Street Leeds and buried automatically in the municipal cemetery (any religion)across the road in Beckett street cemetery for poor people.
John William Schofield buried 1922 aged one month old buried Harehills Cemetery section D1 Grave number 588
Florrie Schofied died aged 4 days old buried 17 August 1925 Harehills Cemetery section D1 Grave number 275
It would suggest Florrie and John William both likely died at home, going by the grave numbers, John William grave 588 in 1922 and Florie in grave 275 in 1925 being a earlier grave than John William's being 588, 3 years earlier - it would seem both baby infants likely buried as babies at the foot of an adult grave being a Schofield or a relative or any adult graves in Harehills Cemetery.
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Did you mean 1922 Jomot?
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As we don't do much 20th century ancestry on rootchat as the 100 year rule , its a common typo putting 1800's instead of 1900's ;D
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Henry St, Leeds city centre 1922 (now pulled down or long gone), John William Schofield husband of Alice (nee Lane) probably moved to High Court, Hunslet area of Leeds by 1925
http://www.leodis.net/searchResults.aspx?LOCID=9999&DECADE=0&YEAR=&KEYWORDS=Henry%20Street&KEYWORDS2=&KEYWORDS3=&ANDOR2=&ANDOR3=&RECSPAGE=5&VIEW=1&CURRPAGE=1
click on 1 or 2 in link for photo of Henry Street
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Susan
I don't want to add too much to your confusion, but there are still queries as to whether these burials are your relatives.
I can't rationalise why the Florrie we have found, if she was her child, was not buried with her mother but in another cemetery.
I'm also confused (doesn't take much these days) as to why there are burials in consecrated and unconsecrated ground. If this was the same family, wouldn't they be one or the other?
I understand how they possibly ended up in separate places if the authorities took care of things.
I'm going to suggest that you contact Leeds Bereavement Services, I rang on your behalf
http://www.leeds.gov.uk/residents/Pages/Find-cemeteries-and-crematoria.aspx
email cems.crems@leeds.gov.uk
If you give them the names, dates, cemeteries and plot numbers they may be willing and able to look in the cemetery registers and look for other informtation that hasn't been transcribed. The council should have ledgers with name and address information as to who paid for the burial plots, although they are in a public or common grave, someone still had to pay but not for the exclusive rights to that plot. What has been transcribed and put online appears to be daily lists of burials not ledgers.
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This is going to be the death of me and I'll need a plot soon :P!!! I also wondered why Florrie was not buried with her mother (there were no names either on burial record so where was her father?). They were buried on the same day!!!. Why were 2 children buried at Harehills and first at Beckett St where her mother is buried.
Was the number for Bereavement services 3957446?? I rang there twice but the response is very slow ::).
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Chief Superintendent of Cemeteries & Crematoria, Lawnswood Cemetery, Otley Road, Leeds LS16 6AH (tel. 0113 267 4623 or 0113 267 3188). If you live outside the UK tel. 44 113 267 4623 or 44 113 267 3188
Lawswood cemetery admin office - holds all the records for Leeds Council cemeteries
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Susan
I don't want to add too much to your confusion, but there are still queries as to whether these burials are your relatives.
I can't rationalise why the Florrie we have found, if she was her child, was not buried with her mother but in another cemetery.
I'm also confused (doesn't take much these days) as to why there are burials in consecrated and unconsecrated ground. If this was the same family, wouldn't they be one or the other?
I understand how they possibly ended up in separate places if the authorities took care of things.
I'm going to suggest that you contact Leeds Bereavement Services, I rang on your behalf
http://www.leeds.gov.uk/residents/Pages/Find-cemeteries-and-crematoria.aspx
email cems.crems@leeds.gov.uk
If you give them the names, dates, cemeteries and plot numbers they may be willing and able to look in the cemetery registers and look for other informtation that hasn't been transcribed. The council should have ledgers with name and address information as to who paid for the burial plots, although they are in a public or common grave, someone still had to pay but not for the exclusive rights to that plot. What has been transcribed and put online appears to be daily lists of burials not ledgers.
Hi dawnsh
The council municipal pauper sections of a cemetery just buried people as the died, filling one grave , then onto the next in chronological order as they died, being Leeds was a large city, they would fill many graves a day one would think and I not sure if the had consecrated and none consecrated sections. It was common practice to bury babies at the foot of an existing adult grave and sometimes that deceased adult was not aways related too the parents of the baby in cases of poverty of the parent or parents .
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Tried those numbers for Lawnswood dobfarm. They're not recognised?
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For your info dobfarm the number for Leeds Cemeteries is now 3957446.
Cheers
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Tried those numbers for Lawnswood dobfarm. They're not recognised?
Sue : try this link telephone number
https://www.remembranceonline.co.uk/directory/burial-and-cremation/crematoria/lawns-wood-crematorium
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Have rung them dobfarm and left info of graves that need checking. The lady said it might be "a while" and that due to data protection she won't be able to tell me anything, but that she would get back to me :(.
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Your urgency about your 92 year old aunty (auntie), is she in poor health with her age ! that could be terminal in the near distant future that make time a factor being important in finding info on these burials for her.
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My aunt lives by herself at 92 although her family are very close by, daughter next door. Her health is reasonable for her age but the memory is beginning to cause problems. Thanks for enquiring, you see why I need to know asap!!
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We'll see what Calverley Lad comes up with first also your enquires with the Leeds cemeteries admin, then I'll come on board and visit Leeds myself to see what I can find out.
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Whilst free do you want anymore look ups doing?
[The boss going to the theatre]
Brian
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Thats really kind !!! This family moved all over the place though and at the mo I don't have any deaths or dates for Leeds. Unless you want to find my dads brother!!!! He was William McConnell and died inLeeds in May 2000. he was born 1935.
Lived at Queenswood Drive, wife Jean. Wouldn't want you getting up to mischief while the cat's away haha!!
Cheers, appreciate the offer
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Sorry too recent for me, records till 1990.
[Are they a catholic family by any chance, plenty of McConnell buried at Killingbeck]
Brian
I would suggest you contact Leeds Bereavement Service, Farnley Hall, Hall Lane, Farnley, LS12 5HA. Tel: 0113 3957446.
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No brian, but thanks anyway. Behave yourself haha!!
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Football on/lager next to me!
Brian
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Enjoy mate!!!
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Did you mean 1922 Jomot?
Oops, yes :-[
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Hi dawnsh,
where did you find Schofield/Lane marriage with 3 births 1920, 1922 and 1923 please? Sounds like closest info but my aunt and her sister were born 1923 and 1924 and they never lived with there mother, not sure why??
Hi Susan
When your funds allow ?- you could purchase the Reginald Lane/Alice Briggs 1914 marriage certificate for this Alice Brigg's fathers name either for a positive answer or elimination to go forward on other routes of investigation.
You have given some details from your auntie 1924 birth certificate with her mother Alice Schofield, late Lane, formally Briggs
Have you ever obtained her known sister's birth certificate born 1923 to compare details of mother Alice Schofield about Alice's maiden name- Lane or Briggs
Reason I ask is ? - There is a possibility Alice (married name Schofield) was born illegitimate bringing into Alice's documents/certificates using both her mother and father surnames being used into the equation. See **
If Alice married John William Schofield as a spinster -then the only time when the fathers surname is different from the bride's birth surname is illegitimacy and if widowed then her surname would be formally a married surname on a marriage certificate
** another possibility - Alice also could have been adopted - using Lane but was adopted name Briggs surname if a spinster at marriage to John W Schoffield or visa versa
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Hi,
I wonder if anyone had come across any information on Alice Schofields second daughter Alice with Reginald Lane please? She was born in 1918 in Leeds, am wondering if she died?
Thanks
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Found a burial of Reginald Lane aged 67yrs at Holbeck formerly of Easterly Road Leeds 1973.
Brian
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Thanks for your time Calverley Lad. Thought Reggie had died in the war though :P
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Hi Susan,
Has Leeds Bereavement Service got back to you with any info.
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No. They said it would take "a while" despite me telling them the situation. Is that days, weeks or months I wonder......
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Finding out the surnames of the adult deceased burials in the graves where your Schofield baby burials are in Harehills cemetery Leeds, maybe throw some light on your quest, if its a private burial site and if its a pauper municipal burial site then there will be nothing only random surnames.
Thomas Palfreman--Lane or Briggs seems the best hope to tract down Alice's origins
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That's what I'm waiting for dobfarm. Am going to discuss purchasing some certificates to verify the information I have. Thanks
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I don't want to confuse matters further as there maybe no relevance with your family
Divorce records are available to view on Ancestry but only go up to 1910.
'Edited' info. have now sent the link by pm and as noted by Ruskie you can order online
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WHAT DOES THIS MEAN????? John Rees was her mothers second husband. I have info for a Reginald Lane being killed in1917 in the war??
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WHAT DOES THIS MEAN????? John Rees was her mothers second husband. I have info for a Reginald Lane being killed in1917 in the war??
A family "fib" to cover up the scandal perhaps? ;) ;D
It looks like you can order a copy rather than visit in person.
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WHAT DOES THIS MEAN?????
John Rees was her mothers second husband.
I have info for a Reginald Lane being killed in1917 in the war??
No certainty that they are the same people and looking back at the census he had a middle name.
There may be no connection it may just be a coincidence that they all have the same names
without seeing the document no way to tell
Unfortunately no further info. given as to whether this Reginald Lane married 1914 Alice Briggs
http://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/835300/LANE,%20REGINALD
Details from UK, Army Registers of Soldiers' Effects, 1901-1929
Reginald Lane Death Date: 4 Oct 1917
Rank: Private Regiment: Devonshire Regiment
Regimental Number: 201851
Under these headings on the above form is following detail
credits & charges
date of authority, to whom authorised
27/5/18 father Jesse
17/11/19 fa. Jesse
This was the info. posted for Reginald (death entry found by Annette), but we don't know if
this is the Reginald Lane that married your Alice Briggs
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Without upsetting what is currently being discussed, would it help any if I put up all instances of a given surname that have been buried in Leeds municipal cemeteries?
I could start with say Harehills cemetery and give info for a given surname just giving bare info like age/year of burial and grave location.
Once done the christian name would be looked at more closely to give more info.
[Plenty of spare time to do, waiting for the football Thursday!]
Brian
NB Would prefer the info go via pm susan57 as some could be a sensitive issue.
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The 3 way match up of names is making me think it can't be a coincidence guys but am happy to take anyones advice.Hoping to discuss later with my cousin re purchasing certificates.
Thanks Calverley Lad.If you think something may turn up please give it a go. Pm a good idea.
I thought Alices mum married John Richard Rees in Oxford, and Alice met Reginald Lane there ?? having Gladys Rees Lane and moving back to Leeds to ?? have Alice Lane. None of this proven of course as the goalposts keep moving!!!
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As has already been said, in the absence of certificates anything we suggest is merely that - a possibility (in some cases extremely strong possibilities). Things need to be backed up with certificates as this scenario is slightly odd in that Alice gave incorrect information when she married John as has already been discussed.
The divorce details certainly sound like this is your Alice. The Reginald Lane killed in WW1 was only suggested by me as this was the only likely Reginald Lane who'd died before 1919 when it was assumed that Alice Lane was a widow (not the spinster she claimed to be).
We all want to help you but in a situation like this copies of the various certificates are the only way to actually confirm things and I appreciate that there is cost involved in this.
Please share with us the details you discover from any certificates you may purchase. It's an interesting story.
Annette
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The 3 way match up of names is making me think it can't be a coincidence guys but am happy to take anyones advice.
Hoping to discuss later with my cousin re purchasing certificates.
I thought Alices mum married John Richard Rees in Oxford, and Alice met Reginald Lane there ??
Having Gladys Rees Lane and moving back to Leeds to ?? have Alice Lane.
None of this proven of course as the goalposts keep moving!!!
John & Eliza married 1906 Aston
The district Aston is in the county of Warwickshire they were in Oxford by 1911.
A recap
Jun 1914 Elham (Kent)
Reginald Lane to Alice Briggs
Jun 1916 Oxford
Gladys R Lane mmn Briggs
Added possible marriage (taken from Annette's post)
Gladys R. Lane married in Leeds in 1937 to a Rowland Lucas
Gladys Rees Lucas born 22/3/1916 died. Jan.1992 Northumberland
(he died in Leeds 1980).
and
Dec 1918 Leeds
A Lane mmn Briggs
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That's what I'm waiting for dobfarm. Am going to discuss purchasing some certificates to verify the information I have. Thanks
Only the cost of one GRO wedding certificate will 1914 Kent for the that Alice Briggs/Lane ? fathers name will resolve the issue as Reginald Lane marriage.
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Marriages Dec 1919
Alice Lane X James ? Rees Newport M 11a 652
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National archives- put 'Reginald Lane' in search link -refine search 1900 to 1924
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/
Appellant for Divorce 1919 - Reginald Lane. ~ Respondent: Alice Lane. Co-respondent: John ? Rees
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There could be another Lane x Briggs family traveling (Railway workers ?) the country 1916 to 1925 with 2 to 5 years gaps between having children
Births Jun 1916
Lane Gladys R - Briggs ~ Oxford 3a 2077
Births Dec 1918
Lane Alice - Briggs ~ Leeds 9b 398
Births Sep 1923
Lane Frederick E - Briggs ~ Potterspury 3b 27
Births Mar 1925
Lane John - Briggs ~ Middlesbro' 9d 857
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********STOP PRESS*******
Alice Briggs/Reginald Lane marriage certificate has been ordered!!!
Dispatch date 22/06/2016 estimated.
Going on hols for a week 25/06/2016
AAAAGGGHHH!!! Hope it comes before we go away.
Watch this space ;)
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Well either way! whatever the certificate info comes back with - elimination is as important as confirmation of past theory guessing - to move on with your research to find truth for your auntie and family.
Enjoy your Hols :D
Dobby :)
Edited: An after thought - Married John W. Schofield as a spinster----I wonder if Alice had a hyphenated surname Briggs-Lane or Lane-Briggs to confuse matters sometimes using the full or short version -Briggs-Lane or Lane-Briggs using the first part of surname as superior main part of her surname
Ie Alice (2nd fore name Lane) Briggs ------Part middle name first -- or hyphenated with surname but dropped to a middle forename
Born Alice. L. Briggs or Alice. B. Lane
or
Born Alice. Briggs-Lane or Alice. Lane-Briggs
Sometimes happens when child is born legitimate with unmarried parents using both parents surnames as hyphenated.
Sometimes fathers surname is hyphenated of married parents of the new born child.
Sometimes given a middle name of a mothers maiden name or grandparents surname.
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susan57: See if the map I have posted is any good?
If not send me a pm to include a e mail address, will post by return.
Brian
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To view the attached map large, drag the map across to your desktop.
No additional information found.
Sorry Brian
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Thanks Brian,
It's loads better than the one I had.
Sue
P.S. Enjoy the game ;)
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THE RESULTS ARE IN!!! Alice Briggs married Reginald Lane on 11th April 1914 in Folkestone.Hoping to find out now whether Reginald died in the war in 1917 or whether he and Alice divorced in 1919??? Have had suggestions re both. I have details of their first child Gladys Rees Lane but nothing on their daughter Alice Lane born in 1918 and would like to find her whereabouts if possible.
Cheers
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what were the details given on marriage cert . was fathers surname briggs or lane on it?
witnesses?
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Alice father named as Thomas Polframan Briggs, Enginedriver in Folkestone
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What is Reginald Lane's age and occupation on the marriage certificate? Just trying to find out if he's still around in 1939
Sandra
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Reginald Lane died in 1943 in Birmingham, so he should be on the1939 register somewhere
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There's a Reginald Lane at 115 Glastonbury Road, Birmingham with wife Daisy and son Albert. Reginald is an electrical battery assembler and he was born in 1888.
Sandra
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Hi, after a discussion with my cousin we have decided that we have the information we need for my Auntie( and a lot more besides!!). We would like to thank everyone for their help and advice.
Cheers