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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Offaly (Kings) => Topic started by: dobyone on Saturday 11 June 16 20:52 BST (UK)
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Hello,
I look for more information about the Harte family of Birr Kings parish in the county Offaly
And mainly for Daniel Joseph HARTE because I cannot at all to find a document indicating his precise date of birth.
His father's name was Daniel and his mother Ellen (or maybe Ellan)
On his military record says:
. A brother John went to America
. Both Ellen and Agnes sisters living with their mother at 17 Bridge Street Birr Kings
On a previous post old 2009 it is noted information on the 1901 census
But as it is very old I would like to open this new post
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Re: Tullamore / Birr
«Reply # 16 on: Sunday 01 February 09 10:50 p.m. GMT (UK)»
Quote (with kind permission of Christmas Farrell)
Birr Roots 1901
Bridge St; (17)
Ellen Harte, Daniel, Agnes.
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On his military record dated 1901 indicated 18 years and 5 months so it would be born in April 1883.
GRO on its certificate first marriage to Elsie Cain July 24, 1919 in Salford UK indicated that it would have 33 years which fixes its birth to 1886
As against its certificate GRO second marriage to Constance Alice Montiefield February 05, 1906 in Portsmouth UK indicated that it would have 21 years which fixes its birth to 1885
GRO on his death certificate 11/19/1930 Fareham UK indicated aged 44 which would fix his birth in 1886
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A reader will there a document or he know the exact birth date of Daniel Joseph Harte and his mother's maiden name and information about his brothers and
sister
With my thanks
From Christian to France country
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http://registers.nli.ie/parishes/0763 if RC
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Hello,
thank you for your message
Unfortunately these microfilms only go up to 1881
Regards
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Birth results for Daniel Joseph Harte from 1880 to 1890
No results found.
http://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/civil-perform-search.jsp?namefm=Daniel+Joseph&namel=Harte&location=&yyfrom=1880&yyto=1890&type=B&submit=Search&sort=&pageSize=100¢ury=&decade=&exact=&ddBfrom=&ddMfrom=&ddDfrom=&ddPfrom=&mmBfrom=&mmMfrom=&mmDfrom=&mmPfrom=&yyBfrom=&yyMfrom=&yyDfrom=&yyPfrom=&ddBto=&ddMto=&ddDto=&ddPto=&mmBto=&mmMto=&mmDto=&mmPto=&yyBto=&yyMto=&yyDto=&yyPto=&locationB=&locationM=&locationD=&locationP=&keywordb=&keywordm=&keywordd=&keywordp=&event=&district=
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There is a birth for a Daniel Hart 1884 in registration district Parsonstown which would cover Birr
http://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/details-civil/d533bb3266998
A copy costs €4
http://www.irishgenealogy.ie/en/civil-records/help/i-want-to-get-a-copy-of-a-certificate-what-do-i-do
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http://www.rootschat.com/links/01hsi/
He may have taken Joseph name at confirmation??
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1901 Census transcribed as Hert
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/King_s_Co_/Birr_Urban/Bridge_Street/1461412/
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Looks like Agnes birth
http://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/details-civil/b118052535156
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I believe this is Ellen in 1911
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/King_s_Co_/Birr_Urban/John_s_Place/551543/
The signature compares well with 1901, the form appears to be filled in by the enumerator.
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A Daniel Harte son of John married Ellen dtr of Patrick Boylan in Birr 26th Oct 1868
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FGZC-W4R
right hand side
http://registers.nli.ie/registers/vtls000634659#page/34/mode/1up
children including a son John 1872
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01hsk/
also to note possible death of Daniel born 1876
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FRBP-C4H
possile death for Daniel the father
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FTZY-7W1
Agnes appears to have emmigrated to Manhattan and Married Edward J Kennedy in 1914
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:24Q3-T5T
possibly a Limerick man
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01hsl/
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Limerick/Mahoonagh/Castlemahon_Village/1510649/
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Limerick/Mahoonagh/Castlemahon_Town/639374/
Death of a daughter Helene in 1918
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:2WC1-9YZ
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What is the date in 1901 on his military record as the Census return for Bridge Street 1901 is dated April 5th
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/reels/nai000940412/
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Unuasual address posted by Sinann earlier
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/King_s_Co_/Birr_Urban/John_s_Place/551543/
house and building return describes it as Town Hall
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/reels/nai002645041/
http://www.buildingsofireland.ie/niah/search.jsp?type=record&county=OF®no=14819209
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marriage for brother John 1896
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:24CP-3VX
sister Catherine 1900
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:F6HV-6D2
death of brother Richard 1932
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:2WGD-BWT
possible wife and son
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:2WC2-J8B
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Hi,
Thank you for all those informations.
The UK military record number 16333 "short service" is dated September 30, 1901
And shows like Family:
The first name of the mother: Ellen,
The first name of brother John with note : in America
The names of the two sisters, Agnes and Ellen
All this seems correct with respect to the census that says: number 3 person (that is to say, the mother and two daughters Ellen and Agnes)
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Regarding Daniel Joseph Harte I realize that all documents indicate only one firstname (Daniel) instead of 2 first name (Daniel Joseph)
In view of your experience you know why: error, omission or old former use?
Regards
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Like I said.... He may have taken Joseph name at confirmation??
??
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We don't use second names much in Ireland, people seem to start using them when they go abroad to countries where they are used or when it is required of them to have one.
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Hi dathai, hallmark and sinann,
I just make a point about all of this information to reconstruct the family:
.. Father Daniel Harte
.. Mother: Ellen Boylan born ca 1855
Together married October 26, 1868 Birr, Co. Kings - Ireland
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Childrens:
.. Mary : born January 13, 1870
.. John : born March 23, 1872
.. Richard : born May 23, 1874
.. Daniel : born August 5, 1876
.. Agnes : born ca 1890
.. Ellen : date of birth unknown
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My observations.
Joseph David on his military record says only his brother John and his 2 sisters Ellen and Agnes.
But curiously it does not specify the names of all other children born before him : Mary, Richard,,
About the child named Daniel: From the documents that I have (military record and certificates GRO) the married person Daniel (02/05/1906 Portsmouth) with Constance Alice Montifield and then (07/24/1919 Salford ) with Elsie Cain was born around 1885 (between 1883 and 1886)
So it can not be the same Daniel who was born above him precisely in 1876.
Or may be two Daniel in this familly : One Daniel and one Daniel Joseph ??
Furthermore the military booklet Daniel Joseph Harte 18 years and 5 months and not 28 years.
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Also I think there is a problem about the search on the name of Harte and that, unless I am mistaken, we are not talking of the same family.
It is likely that Daniel, Daniel's father Joseph Harte was married to someone other than Ellen Doylan. But who ???
What do you think ?
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This is very mixed up.
The military record 30 Sept 1901 says 17 Bridge Street Mother Ellen, Sisters Ellen and Agnes.
Daniel Joseph age 18 years 5 months
1901 Census 17 Bridge Street 7 April 1901 says Mother Ellen, son Daniel, daughter Agnes. (No daughter Ellen)
Daniel age transcribed as 14 but may be 17, looking at the original.
You need a birth cert for one of the children to get Ellen's maiden name, than it will be possible to look for other children and marriage.
I think Agnes would be the best to get and perhaps the Daniel 1884 one to see if mother and father are the same.
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Hi,
I totally agree with you.
I'll order Daniel and Agnes birth certificates and later will advise you of the exact name of the mother
Thanks for all
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Daniel Hart was born on the 13th of August 1876. I can confirm that his parents were Daniel Hart and Ellen Boylan. His brother John worked in the U.S.A.. His wife died and he returned to his hometown of Birr, County Offaly where he got married for a second time. John Hart and his wife are dead for many years. I remember them both well. Thier daughter lives in Birr. Daniel Hart was attached to the British Army medical corp at Templemore, County Tipperary.
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Hello,
Thank you for that information indicating a date of birth August 13, 1876
Also I received a private message on Rootschat indicating a baptism date to February 24, 1884.
For parents it's OK
For dates I am annoyed with these 2 dates because it does not seem possible that the baptism had occurred after 8 long years after birth. Normally baptism occurs immediately after birth.
It may be he had two childrens born with the same first name?
Regards
Posted on behalf of dobyone who has sent the message to me in error, please click on the reply button via RootsChat ;)
Sarah
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Richard Hart (my grandfather) (born in 1874) was also the son of Daniel Hart and Ellen Boylan (as per his marriage certificate, which took place in New York in 1907). My father (Richard's son) always told me his family came from Birr, Offaly, Parsonstown. Richard came to the United States by himself around the turn of the century. I thought I was in the right place, but now I'm confused. Is this the right family? Are any of you related to this family?
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http://www.rootschat.com/links/01iiv/
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Daniel 1884
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1884/02701/1994743
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Richard 1874
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1874/03148/2154660
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death of Daniel Harte,shoemaker 1895 informant daughter Katie
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1895/05940/4687487
edited to add birth of Katie Feb 1879
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1879/02930/2073641
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possible death for mother Ellen in 1940 mental hosp or Offaly Co Home age 80
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1940/04725/4263227
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Thank you for all the links! I had no idea there was a Kate and it looks to me that the first son Daniel died the same year he was born and so they had another son and named him Daniel Joseph. That's why the baptism date doesn't seem right. Does anyone have any more info on the son named John or daughter Mary? Ellen's death record doesn't seem right. If she got married in 1868 and died in 1940, that would make her 8 when she got married. Maybe she was 90? Any record on her birth?