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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Yorkshire (West Riding) => England => Yorkshire (West Riding) Lookup Requests => Topic started by: lillian66 on Friday 08 July 16 20:32 BST (UK)
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Evening All
After years of searching for my great grandfather Walter Smith born 3 November 1893 in Birstall, Batley I think I may have had a breakthrough on the 1939 register today.
I have found a record for a "Walker" Smith born 3/11/1893 living at 22 Old Bank Road, Dewsbury but when looking at the original document I am convinced it says Walter not Walker. It also gives his occupation as Motor Van/Ambulance Driver and when my gran was married in September 1939 he is on the marriage certificate as a chauffeur which is pretty close!!!
So my question, on the 1939 register he is living with a number of people all at the same address but one appears to be his wife/partner. She is transcribed as Susannah T Horre (Smith) but someone has written Hoare on the original document. Her date of birth is given as 8/2/1894.
As she would be aged 45 it is possible she was married before she met Walter. Family stories also suggest that Walter never divorced his first wife Clara (Porritt) whom he married in July 1915.
Any help identifying Susannah or any children greatfully appreciated.
Thanks
Helen
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Hi, to be honest, regarding the over written name, I have had instances where I know the history of the person on the register and it has been both the maiden name of one person, and also a previous married name of another, I'm not being much help I'm afraid but that's just my experience.
Frank :)
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Usually when a name is added in green, it means a later marriage, so did Susannah re-marry after your great grandfather died?
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Can we be sure this lady was his wife? The only Walter Smith/Ho* marriage I can see is to Selina Hoare in 1935.
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Susannah Hoare
Birth Date: 5 Feb 1894
Date of Registration: Dec 1983
Age at Death: 89
Registration district: Leeds
Inferred County: West Yorkshire
Volume: 05
Page: 0198
Same date of birth as on 1939.
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Usually when a name is added in green, it means a later marriage, so did Susannah re-marry after your great grandfather died?
That's just jogged my memory, I've just checked another entry and a second married name is shown in green ink (Thanks for that groom :) )
Frank.
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Her date of birth is given as 8/2/1894.
Possibly not her but death for a Susannah Hoare born 5/2/1894 in 1983 Leeds.
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Did they have a (now deceased) son Jack Smith born 12 Sep 1936 - possible birth reg Dec qtr 1936 Dewsbury, mother's maiden name Bradley?
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The date of birth in 1939 for Susannah Smith/Hoare is 5th February 1894, not the 8th, which is the same as that death in 1983. Bit of a coincidence - possibly Susannah Hoare didn't ever marry Walter Smith and had her name corrected later?
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An online tree (usual caveats apply) shows a Susannah Bradley born in Yorks on 5.2.1894. She is said to have died in Leeds in 1983 which matches the timing of the Susannah Hoare death.
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My take on it is:
Susannah Bradley was living with Walter Smith and took his name, but didn't marry him, as he was still married. They had a son born 1936 who was registered as Smith. She either married after Walter's death or she left him and took the name Hoare.
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Birth reg for Susannah Bradley, Mar qtr 1894 Tadcaster - covers Barwick in Elmet which seems to have been her birthplace.
Suggest you check the inhabitants of the 1939 entry you've found for her mother Catherine Bradley.
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According to the online tree, Susannah Bradley was the mother of Harry Desmond B Tolson born 1st March 1923 (birth reg Harry D B Tolson, mmn Bradley, Jun qtr 1923 Dewsbury).
Not sure where the Tolson surname comes from.
He died as Harry Desmond Tolson Smith in Pontefract district, Apr 2006.
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Susannah Bradley married Harry Heward, Jun qtr 1915 Dewsbury. He died in WW1, 21.09.1917.
Susannah Heward married Arthur Tolson, Mar qtr 1919 Dewsbury.
Susannah Tolson married Alec Hoare, Sep qtr 1969 Leeds.
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Susannah had a son from her first marriage: Thomas Arthur Heward, born 8 Nov 1915. He was married before the 1939 Register was taken, and appears to have died in Leeds in 1983.
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Wow....thanks for all your relpies guys.
Appears to solve the mystery of Susannah Hoare (Smith) but unfortunately means I am still no nearer tracing my great grandfather Walter Smith. I was hoping her death certificate may have given me some clues.
Back to searching... ???
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Is the Walter (Walker) Smith on the 1939 your Walter, or are you saying that you don't think he is now?
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I think it's my Walter as the date of birth fits but I'm no nearer finding his death or what happened to him after 1939.
Thanks
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I can see the problem - there are dozens of deaths of Walter Smiths born 1893 Yorkshire, even if you narrow it down to West Yorkshire there are still a lot.
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Looking at the post by avm228 Susannah Tolson married Alec Hoare, Sep qtr 1969 Leeds.
But I am confused as to how she was listed as Susannah Horre on the 1939 register. Particularly if she was living with Walter Smith and taking his name.
Any suggestions?
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Looking at the post by avm228 Susannah Tolson married Alec Hoare, Sep qtr 1969 Leeds.
But I am confused as to how she was listed as Susannah Horre on the 1939 register. Particularly if she was living with Walter Smith and taking his name.
Any suggestions?
The 1939 register was kept up to date until about 1991, so when someone changed their name e.g. a woman married, it was amended on the register, usually in a different colour. So in 1939 Susannah Tolson was living with Walter Smith and using his name, but wasn't married to him. Her name was originally entered on the register as Susannah Smith. She then either left Walter, or he died and in 1969 she married Alec Hoare. At that point her name would have been changed on the register to Hoare (the name you can see in green)
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The original handwritten entry says Susannah Horre (Smith) not Tolson.
Her mother Catherine Bradley is on the same page so think you have been on right track about Susannah but still confused how the handwritten entry says Horre.
Thanks
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It was added afterwards in 1969 anything in colour was added long after 1939.
Look at this post which explains the names.
Susannah Bradley married Harry Heward, Jun qtr 1915 Dewsbury. He died in WW1, 21.09.1917.
Susannah Heward married Arthur Tolson, Mar qtr 1919 Dewsbury.
Susannah Tolson married Alec Hoare, Sep qtr 1969 Leeds.
So we have Susannah Bradley who married Harry Heward and was widowed in 1917. She then married Arthur Tolson in 1919. He either died or she left him and lived with Walter Smith, took his name but didn't marry him. Then in 1969 she married Alec Hoare, her name would have been Tolsen on the marriage certificate as that was her legal name. As the 1939 register was used to inform things such as the NHS her name would then have been changed from Smith to Hoare.