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Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: Emeraldeyes on Monday 11 July 16 13:38 BST (UK)

Title: A birthplace or maiden name for eleanor Margaret winstanley
Post by: Emeraldeyes on Monday 11 July 16 13:38 BST (UK)
Hello all I'm a beginner with family history and working from what material I've been handed down I'm trying to find the parentage of either Thomas Augustus Wallis born 1778 no birthplace but he was a royal navy ships purser or his wife Eleanor Margaret Winstanley born in 1785 there seems to be some Irish origins for Winstanley but I need her mother's maiden name as well to trace her as I think Winstanleys are related to troops that went to Ireland with Cromwell any light on this anyone?
Title: Re: A birthplace or maiden name for eleanor Margaret winstanley
Post by: ScouseBoy on Monday 11 July 16 13:43 BST (UK)
You could do a surname distribution search. On Winstanley

I have a feeling  there will be a lot of them in Lancashire
Title: Re: A birthplace or maiden name for eleanor Margaret winstanley
Post by: Emeraldeyes on Monday 11 July 16 13:56 BST (UK)
Hello Scouse boy I think your right and I also see connection with Liverpool I suppose they went to and fro over the Irish sea
Title: Re: A birthplace or maiden name for eleanor Margaret winstanley
Post by: ScouseBoy on Monday 11 July 16 14:01 BST (UK)
There is a village called Winstanley, I think?

Lot of Winstanleys in Wigan
Title: Re: A birthplace or maiden name for eleanor Margaret winstanley
Post by: SmallTownGirl on Monday 11 July 16 14:09 BST (UK)
Assuming you've worked your own way back to Thomas and Eleanor, rather than just taking someone else's research as gospel, you might already have this - baptism of a son for the couple in 1826

https://familysearch.org/search/record/results?count=20&query=%2Bgivenname%3A%22thomas%20augustus%22~%20%2Bsurname%3Awallis~

STG
Title: Re: A birthplace or maiden name for eleanor Margaret winstanley
Post by: Emeraldeyes on Monday 11 July 16 14:14 BST (UK)
Thank you small town girl and no I haven't got the birth record for their son or any other children as I was concentrating on their birthplaces but that record would be found where CV on ancestry? Do you think I should send off for copies of these records too as I uncover them?
Title: Re: A birthplace or maiden name for eleanor Margaret winstanley
Post by: Ruskie on Monday 11 July 16 14:15 BST (UK)
Welcome to rootschat Emeraldeyes.

How did you get to Thomas and Eleanor?

Whereabouts in the world did they live? Thanks STG for answering this.  ;)

Saying that you think there may be Irish origins isn't enough really - we need some concrete evidence (documentation), before we start the search. To even think about a connection with Cromwell (unless you have something to prove this) is really jumping the gun.  :)

Finding a place called Winstanley or people called Winstanley is meaningless unless you can prove a connection with your Winstanleys via the usual methods.

My first thought is that they may appear in the 1841 census if they lived in England, Scotland or Wales.

Title: Re: A birthplace or maiden name for eleanor Margaret winstanley
Post by: SmallTownGirl on Monday 11 July 16 14:20 BST (UK)
...  but that record would be found where CV on ancestry?

Not entirely sure I understand what you mean.

The image for the baptism is available for FREE from the FamilySearch website - if you follow the link I posted in my previous message.  You will need to set up a FREE login to view the actual image, but it's straightforward to do.

STG



Title: Re: A birthplace or maiden name for eleanor Margaret winstanley
Post by: SmallTownGirl on Monday 11 July 16 14:30 BST (UK)
On the 1851 census in Highweek, Devon there's ....

Eleanor M Wallis, 66, widow, pensioner, b. Ireland
and
George F Wallis, 25, son, [something] Trinity College Dublin, b. Plymouth, Devon

On the 1861 census, George is a Curate at Holywell with Needleworth, Huntingdonshire, listed as Nephew in the household of the Rector, R J McGee, age 71, b. Ireland.  Could that be Eleanor's brother, perhaps?

STG
Title: Re: A birthplace or maiden name for eleanor Margaret winstanley
Post by: jim1 on Monday 11 July 16 14:52 BST (UK)
Quote
George F Wallis, 25, son, [something] Trinity College Dublin,
B.A. (degree)
Can't see the family in 1841 but may be outside of England/Wales. Possibly in Ireland.
Title: Re: A birthplace or maiden name for eleanor Margaret winstanley
Post by: jim1 on Monday 11 July 16 14:56 BST (UK)
FindMyPast has a Naval record for him but it's listed as Naval Personnel so might not tell you much. Dated 1831. You will have to buy a few credits.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01hzd/ 
Title: Re: A birthplace or maiden name for eleanor Margaret winstanley
Post by: Annette7 on Monday 11 July 16 14:58 BST (UK)
Rector R J McGee can't be Eleanor's brother if her maiden name Winstanley??

Annette
Title: Re: A birthplace or maiden name for eleanor Margaret winstanley
Post by: SmallTownGirl on Monday 11 July 16 15:01 BST (UK)
Rector R J McGee can't be Eleanor's brother if her maiden name Winstanley??

Annette

Good point!  :-[

But he could be her sister's husband, couldn't he?

STG
Title: Re: A birthplace or maiden name for eleanor Margaret winstanley
Post by: Annette7 on Monday 11 July 16 15:16 BST (UK)
Thomas Augustus Willis bc.1776 bur.2/5/1846 Wolborough, Devon

Eleanor Margaret Willis bc.1786 bur.13/2/1852 Wolborough, Devon

They married by licence in Dublin in 1810.

Annette
Title: Re: A birthplace or maiden name for eleanor Margaret winstanley
Post by: Christine53 on Monday 11 July 16 15:50 BST (UK)
A bit more information on the marriage , gleaned from TNA :

Thomas Augustus Wallis, Paymaster & Purser , date of death 27 Apr 1846;
Date and place of marriage 1 Jan 1811 St George's , Dublin. Husband's age at marriage 34, Wife's age at marriage 26 ; wife's address Highwick, Newton Bushel ( this is her address in 1846 ).

http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C14859186
Title: Re: A birthplace or maiden name for eleanor Margaret winstanley
Post by: Christine53 on Monday 11 July 16 16:46 BST (UK)
Rector R J McGee can't be Eleanor's brother if her maiden name Winstanley??

Annette

Good point!  :-[

But he could be her sister's husband, couldn't he?

STG

Reverend Robert  McGhee married Mary Andrews Winstanley by licence 1812  Dublin.
Title: Re: A birthplace or maiden name for eleanor Margaret winstanley
Post by: SmallTownGirl on Monday 11 July 16 16:47 BST (UK)
Rector R J McGee can't be Eleanor's brother if her maiden name Winstanley??

Annette

Good point!  :-[

But he could be her sister's husband, couldn't he?

STG

Reverend Robert  McGhee married Mary Andrews Winstanley by licence 1812  Dublin.

Excellent!
Title: Re: A birthplace or maiden name for eleanor Margaret winstanley
Post by: Emeraldeyes on Monday 11 July 16 20:39 BST (UK)
Thanks so much for some brilliant leads can't understand why they all married in Dublin though.
Title: Re: A birthplace or maiden name for eleanor Margaret winstanley
Post by: jim1 on Monday 11 July 16 21:20 BST (UK)
Thomas Wallis was probably posted there & married a local girl. There may be other children that were born there. They were back in Devon by 1826 but he may have posted somewhere else by 1841.
Title: Re: A birthplace or maiden name for eleanor Margaret winstanley
Post by: Christine53 on Monday 11 July 16 21:39 BST (UK)
Thomas Augustus Wallis is listed in Dublin Directories of 1835 , 1843 and 1845 in Pembroke Street, Dublin as Assistant Secretary to the Scripture Readers' Society.  His death in Torquay in 1846 is  reported in the Statesman and Dublin Christian Record of 15 May 1846and the notice refers to his association with the Scripture Readers' Society. It appears that he must have been in Dublin for a number of years. As he was married for over 30 years it seems likely that there would have been other children.
Title: Re: A birthplace or maiden name for eleanor Margaret winstanley
Post by: Emeraldeyes on Monday 11 July 16 23:12 BST (UK)
Fascinating to think he died in Torquary after living in Dublin for so long. I now have to trace his parents as I think I can complete that part of the tree for now
Title: Re: A birthplace or maiden name for eleanor Margaret winstanley
Post by: garstonite on Tuesday 12 July 16 05:16 BST (UK)
Napoleanic Wars 1799-1815 .....1808 - 1815 a lot of British troops and Naval personnel were posted in Dublin for training purposes and also Irish men and women enlisted to Wellingtons troops . So no big surprise to see English men and women marrying in Dublin - there were Thousands there at the time .
Title: Re: A birthplace or maiden name for eleanor Margaret winstanley
Post by: Christine53 on Tuesday 12 July 16 12:30 BST (UK)
I have come across a George Frederick Winstanley , a Dublin barrister , who appears in The Post Office Directory of 1843 , residing at Philipsburgh Strand.  I have also found in Landed Estates Court Rentals particulars of property , including a house in Philipsburgh,  which mention  George Frederick Winstanley Wallis , Mary Lititia McGhee and Charles Sommerville M'Alester. I googled George Frederick Winstanley and among the results found this page:
 http://www.rootschat.com/links/01hzk/ 
" Charles M'Alester married 1828 Mary Barbazon ,only child of Edward Lyon Lieut RN by Anna Catherine, eldest daughter and co heiress of George Frederick Winstanley of Philipsburgh , Co Dublin."
I think it is likely that Anna Catherine, Mary Andrews and Eleanor Margaret Winstanley  are sisters and daughters of George Frederick Winstanley but more research would be needed to confirm.

Edit : Maybe someone on the Ireland board who knows more about Irish records than I do could help . You could ask to have your topic moved if wish.

Edit : George Frederick Winstanley ,aged 61, of Dublin died 10 Mar 1850 , see irishgenealogy.ie  , and I think it must be he in the 1843 directory. An earlier George Frederick Winstanley is listed in the Will Index with a date of 1801.