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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Topic started by: jaffacakes83 on Monday 19 September 16 18:31 BST (UK)
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Hi, I am helping my husband with his family tree and am stuck on a Scottish line. His gran was a McMillan and we have traced his 5th great grandfather Daniel Donald McMillan born about 1796 back to Scotland but this is where it stops. His fourth great grandfather was Samuel William McMillan born 1830 in Newhaven, Oxford and his wife was Mary Kibble born 1825 Gloucestershire. Daniel McMillan's wife was called Ann (unsure of maiden name as there are a few it could be.) On the 1841 census he is living in Cheltenham Gloucester and later I believe they lived in Leckham. His occupation was a gardener and I think he died in 1861. It would be great if we could find out what part of Scotland he was from and perhaps his parents. Any suggestions would be appreciated! Laura
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Daniel and Donald are effectively used as equivalent names in Scotland, so it's not unusual to find someone originally baptised as Donald turning up in a later record as Daniel, or vice versa. So your Daniel Donald was probably plain Donald when he was baptised.
I see from the 1841 census that he had sons named Charles, William, John and Benjamin, and that John was born in Scotland. There is a five-year gap between John and Benjamin. Were there possibly other children who died young?
Have you found him in any censuses later than 1851? Do you have places of birth for Charles and William, who were not born in Gloucestershire?
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Hi, thank you for the reply!
I tried to find John McMillan but no joy. The only children I have found so far are Charles, William, John and Benjamin. The William mentioned in the 1841 census is our fourth great grandfather Samuel William. In 1851 only Samuel William is living with Daniel and Ann. I believe Daniel died in 1861 as his wife is a widow on the 1861 census and there is a death record for a Donald McMillan in 1861 in Leckhampton which is the last place he was living. Both Charles and Samuel William were born in Newhaven Oxfordshire.
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Hmmm. Not looking too promising. If they followed the Scottish naming tradition you would expect his father's name to be Charles, but in the absence of any daughters, and of the name of his parents-in-law, you can't rely on that. To be honest, without his father's name from his marriage record, it's going to be pretty difficult.
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Later census' sometimes tend to lend us a bit more info. with Counties mentioned so an 1861/71 may be good if Donald/Daniel was still alive.
Annie
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Later census' sometimes tend to lend us a bit more info. with Counties mentioned so an 1861/71 may be good if Donald/Daniel was still alive.
Sadly it seems that he died before 1861, when his wife appears as a widow.
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Thank you for your suggestions, although maybe this will be as far as we get on this line. I did find another child though an Elizabeth Ann McMillan born 1826 in Oxford (Newhaven) so this may narrow down the marriages before this date.
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Given Donald's approx yr of birth he would have been 34 yrs old when he married, on assumption that Samuel was the eldest son?
It was common for the name Donald (originating from where Gaelic was spoken) to become Daniel which seemed to be through dialect. Donald would sound like "Danal" i.e. it became Daniel.
On that basis I would say he was of "Highland" descent but with no other info. it's not going to help.
You don't have anything on wife Ann which is a pity as it would have been good to try & eliminate family names from her side as Samuel is not very Scottish.
Annie
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Death shows he just missed the 1861 census
Name: Donald Mc Millan
Birth Year: abt 1797
Death Year: 1861
Death Age: 64
Burial Date: 9 Apr 1861
Parish: Leckhampton, Gloucestershire, England
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Would her death record contain her maiden name or father's name?
Name: Ann McMillan
Estimated birth year: abt 1793
Registration Year: 1880
Registration Quarter: Jan-Feb-Mar
Age at Death: 87
Registration district: Cheltenham
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Acording to FreeBMD Death Certificates may contain some or all of the following:
District, Location, Date & Place of Death,
Forename & Surname, Sex, Maiden Name,
Date & Place of Birth, Occupation, Usual Address,
Informant's Forename & Surname,
Informant's Qualification, Informant's Address,
Cause of Death, Signature of Informant,
Registration Date, Registrar's Signature.
However the GRO web site says
The details contained on a death certificate include:
Name, date and place of death.
Date and place of birth (before 1969 a certificate only showed age of deceased).
Occupation and usual address.
Cause of death.
The person who gave information for the death registration.
The GRO's guide to death certificates says that the name on the certificate will be the name by which the person was known at the time of death, not the name they were given at birth.
So I think it is unlikely that Ann's death certificate will tell you the name of her father, and certainly not that of her mother.
I believe that you are allowed to ring or e-mail a local registrar and ask a question to which the answer will be yes or no. In this case you could contact the Gloucestershire Archives at Gloucestershire Archives, Clarence Row, Alvin Street, Gloucester GL1 3DW, telephone 01242 532455, fax 01242 254600 or e-mail cheltenham.ro@gloucestershire.gov.uk and ask them whether her name, or the name of the informant, on Ann's death certificate contains any information that might enable you to find out her maiden surname*. If the answer is yes, you can then order a copy of the certificate. Note that the local registrars do not use the same index as the GRO/FreeBMD. You can find out the reference used by the Gloucestershire registrars at http://ww3.gloucestershire.gov.uk/bmd/DeathSearch.aspx
*Don't just ask if it lists her maiden name. If you do, they will look at her name and probably reply no. If, however, the informant was, say, a niece or nephew, you may be able to use that to work out what her maiden surname was.
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Good explanation Forfarian,
Not that this will help OP but that's how I found extra info. for a daughter of my 3x g g/father who died 1873.
He was a widower when he died, the informant was a female with same forename as his daughter Johanna.
I knew her forename but she had married after 1871 & died prior to 1881 but with given forename with a different surname gave me a timeline for her marriage.
So yes, sometimes a death cert. can yield something of interest/importance.
Annie
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Hi just wondering if you have got any further with this? Iv stumbled across the Mcmillans in my own tree. Daniels wife was Ann Costins and they married in Oxfordshire in 1824.