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Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Wales => Radnorshire => Topic started by: skylark on Friday 30 September 16 14:31 BST (UK)

Title: Charles Wilson Rhayader 1881
Post by: skylark on Friday 30 September 16 14:31 BST (UK)
Help!!!

Charles Wilson, of full age and a bricklayer, married Mary Pritchard in Rhayader, 11 November 1876.  His father was Stephen Wilson a mason.

1881 - No Charles - but, Mary Wilson, wife, 29, and children (of Charles and Mary) David C 2 and John P 5 months.
1891 - Mary Wilson, Wid. 39 and children Charles 12, and John P 10.

On the marriage cert. of son David Charles, his father is named as David Charles Wilson, bricklayer, deceased.

I cannot find ANY record of Charles Wilson or David Charles Wilson or any combination of these names.  I cannot find a death, or a father, Stephen, who is a mason with a son David and/or Charles in ANY census, whether it be Wales, England, Scotland or Ireland.  In fact if it wasn't for the marriage certificate I would think that he didn't exist.  According to the 'full age' on the marriage certificate he must have been born before 1856 but WHERE and where is he!!!
Title: Re: Charles Wilson Rhayader 1881
Post by: Milliepede on Friday 30 September 16 15:04 BST (UK)
Who were the witnesses on the marriage - any called Wilson that may have been related?
Title: Re: Charles Wilson Rhayader 1881
Post by: Milliepede on Friday 30 September 16 15:10 BST (UK)
No more younger children with Mary in 1891 which might indicate an earlier death for Charles (nearer to 1881 than 1891)

Maybe he was bricklaying away from home and died there as don't seem to be any in Radnorshire :-\
Title: Re: Charles Wilson Rhayader 1881
Post by: skylark on Friday 30 September 16 15:20 BST (UK)
Hello Milliepede

Marriage witnesses were David Pritchard and James Ward - I can't find a James Ward, either!  and no other children.  The two that they have were baptised in Rhayader and Charles & Mary were their parents.  As for dying in Radnorshire, I can't find a death anywhere else, either.
Title: Re: Charles Wilson Rhayader 1881
Post by: Milliepede on Friday 30 September 16 15:25 BST (UK)
Not having any luck with census either  :(

I take it he was a bachelor in 1876.  Suppose there's a chance he was illegitimate and made up a father called Stephen or there was a surname change for some reason.   

Really tricky one.

PS there is a family tree with death for Charles circa 1886 Wales but no other info or why they plumped for 1886 - possibly because mid way between 1881-1891.
Title: Re: Charles Wilson Rhayader 1881
Post by: skylark on Friday 30 September 16 15:35 BST (UK)
Yes, he was a bachelor in 1876. .Stephen was not marked as deceased on the marriage cert. so he must be somewhere on the previous census, but I can't find him! It is entirely possible that he made up his fathers name, so I might have to concentrate on all of the illegitimate births.  Not knowing his age makes this job so involved!!
Title: Re: Charles Wilson Rhayader 1881
Post by: Milliepede on Friday 30 September 16 15:40 BST (UK)
Well there are a couple of elderly James Ward's about in 1871 who may have witnessed the marriage one in Radnorshire and one born there, one a servant one a visitor but doesn't really get us anywhere  :-\

Stephen may have been deceased by 1876 because it wasn't always marked on the certificate that they were deceased even if they were.  Bride or groom was just asked for fathers name not necessarily if they were alive or not. 
Have been tripped up on that one myself so always something to keep in mind!
Title: Re: Charles Wilson Rhayader 1881
Post by: Milliepede on Friday 30 September 16 15:42 BST (UK)
Trying a different tack - any clues with wife/widow Mary?  Did she marry again or die as Mary Wilson? 
Title: Re: Charles Wilson Rhayader 1881
Post by: lizdb on Friday 30 September 16 15:48 BST (UK)
Is he Charles or David on children's birth certs/baptism?
Title: Re: Charles Wilson Rhayader 1881
Post by: Milliepede on Friday 30 September 16 16:02 BST (UK)
Couple of David Charles Wilson deaths to try and rule out

Preston Jun 1897 age 45

Neath Sep 1904 age 53

Both of those would have been of full age in 1876.  I know Mary says she is a widow in 1891 but they may simply have split up and she called herself a widow.

I think the fact there are no more younger children with her is a clue to when something happened.
Title: Re: Charles Wilson Rhayader 1881
Post by: skylark on Friday 30 September 16 16:18 BST (UK)
Mary died 1900 Rhayader, she didn't remarry, and he was Charles at the baptism of both sons.  The eldest son was David Charles, perhaps he assumed his father was also a David Charles - the son's marriage took place after the death of his mother.
Title: Re: Charles Wilson Rhayader 1881
Post by: skylark on Saturday 01 October 16 09:16 BST (UK)
I'm clutching at straws here -
1881 Dist 43 SE Leeds  Ann Wilson wid. 52 b. Howden, Charles Wilson son 36 unm. Bricklayer b. Leeds.
1871 - Little Dean Gloucestershire (one of 10 lodgers) - Charles Wilson 25 unm. occupation blank - b. Leeds.

I'm trying to follow this through - just in case!
Title: Re: Charles Wilson Rhayader 1881
Post by: Milliepede on Saturday 01 October 16 11:20 BST (UK)
Not many straws to clutch are there, and he is a bricklayer!

Mother was very young when she had him though if the ages are correct.  I wonder who she was widow of.
 
Charles Wilson birth
Dec 1845 Leeds
Title: Re: Charles Wilson Rhayader 1881
Post by: Milliepede on Saturday 01 October 16 11:35 BST (UK)
Here's a different one

1851

Charles D Wilson 7 stepson born Great Driffield

James S Armstrong 32 tea dealer
Ann Armstrong 38
Emily Armstrong 5

Marriage Jun 1845 Driffield - 4 couples - 3 of the brides called Ann or Ann Elizabeth but one a Wilson
James Salkeld Armstrong
Ann Wilson
Title: Re: Charles Wilson Rhayader 1881
Post by: Milliepede on Saturday 01 October 16 11:52 BST (UK)
I was hoping the D was David but after much faffing about this could be him

Baptism 3 Aug 1843 Great Driffield
Charles Dickinson Wilson
parents Charles Wilson & Ann

another one to rule out
Title: Re: Charles Wilson Rhayader 1881
Post by: skylark on Saturday 01 October 16 15:24 BST (UK)
While trying to sort the families of these Charles Wilsons,  I have found another -
1881 - Charles Wilson boarder unm 33 Bricklayer b. Coatham Yorks. in London.