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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Cornwall => Topic started by: fisherj on Sunday 02 October 16 23:04 BST (UK)
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Elizabeth Mabley (before marriage Davey) married Thomas Mably/Mabley on 10 july 1858 in Stoke Damerel. She was aged 30 and he was aged 27 on their marriage certificate.
Thomas Mabley was born in St Endellion, Cornwall.
Their son William Henry Mabley was born on 13 January 1859 at "Farmhouse Synwell Anthony".
In 1861, William Henry Mabley is with his paternal grandparents Richard and Phillipa Mably without his parents in St Endellion.
I can't find his parents Thomas and Elizabeth in 1861.
In 1861, there is a Thomas Mably, widower at Trevanson aged 27 which I think may be William Henry's father.
The problem is that I can't find a death for Elizabeth between 1859 and 1861.
I think Thomas may have died in 1868 in St Columb but can't be sure.
I'd really appreciate some help on this.
Many thanks
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the Thomas on the 1861 census & the death registered at St Columb could refer to the Thomas Mabley born in St Columb Major son of William & Mary born 18 April 1834 & registered in Bodmin Wesleyan circuit 7 May 1834,
http://www.cornwall-opc-database.org/search-database/more-info/?t=baptisms_nc&id=186153
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:JW8S-443
The family is in Bank Street in St Columb Major in 1841, but I can't see them after that.
OK, think you can discount this Thomas. I've found him in the US, first in Michigan, then in Ohio so at least he's out of the picture. His death in 1905
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:F6ZT-8W1
And I 'visited' some family as 2 of my greatgrandfather's uncles were a few houses away from this Mabley family in St Columb Major in 1841.
;)
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I'm wondering if this is Elizabeth's death entry:
Elizabeth Maibrey Mar.qtr.1861 St. Germans
Cornwall Monumental Inscriptions also have:
Elizabeth Maibrey aged 33, died 20/1/1861 - Place is just given as St. John!
I first wondered whether the GRO has mistranscribed it when entering to the index but the M.I. has the same spelling. Right timeframe, right age for Elizabeth Mabley.
Annette
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Thank you Osprey and Annette for your replies. Sorry it has taken me so long to respond. I have just found out that some Rootschat emails are going directly to my spam folder and I am afraid that I may have missed these it is only now I am replying.
Yes - it is good to eliminate a "wrong" Thomas Mabley/Mably.
And I was interested to see the Elizabeth MAIBREY entry. Well done!
"Maibrey" must surely be some other name incorrectly spelt! I can't find any other on Family Search though there are Mawbreys... I couldn't find a marriage of a Mr Maibrey to an Elizabeth in Devon/Cornwall.
St John's parish I understand is in the St Germans Registration District. I am not sure where this is in relation to the farms/places mentioned in my first post. If only people HAD to fill in census forms honestly and every year!
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I would really appreciate it if someone was able to check the St Johns (St Germans) parish records to check the original spelling and details of the death/burial entry for Elizabeth Maibrey died 20 Jan 1861.
As you can see from my earlier post, I am really looking for Elizabeth Mabley/Mably who may have died between 1859 and 1861. Born Elizabeth Davey abt 1828.
Checking the Elizabeth Maibrey entry will at least help in the process of elimination!
Many thanks
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you can check the registers via FamilySearch. I'd say it's Maibrey abode Sunwell in Antony tying in with the birth cert. Age looks like 23 though.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01jgo/
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just checked GRO index and age on death reg is given as 32 which makes more sense, numbers wrong way around on burial register.
::)
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Many thanks Osprey. I am wondering however whether the surname is more like "Mayberry" than "Mably" and I have been trying to find an Elizabeth Mayberry that would fit so I can eliminate this record. Or otherwise...
I was impressed to see that you had a link to the Cornish parish records on Family Search. How can I access that for other counties? Elizabeth Mably/Davey was born in Devon. I could not see how to access it without using the link you provided.
Cheers
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it's not available for all counties. You can access Cornwall here, but not all registers available for every parish
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01h80/
If you look at the historical registers on FamilySearch, the ones with the camera icon have images, click on the record set you want & then on browse images to see what is available.
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Thanks again Osprey. It's such a gift to have free access to the ones that are available.
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indeed it is. Feels like sitting in the record office in the comfort of your own home!
;D
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As you can see from my previous posts below, I have been trying to find the death of Elizabeth Mabley/Mably but just can't find one.
She was born 1828 (according to her marriage certificate). And I think I have her date of birth 04.08.1828, christened at the Bible Christian Church, St Neot.
Her surname before her marriage in 1858 to Thomas Mabley was Davey. Her father John Davey's occupation was a hind. I think I have located him on the 1851 census at St John's, Cornwall.
In 1859 she gave birth to William Henry Mably (also known as Harry) who I think was their only child. His birth certificate gives his place of birth as Farmhouse Synwell Antony.
In 1861 census I think I have Thomas Mably as a widower in his employer's household at Trevanson with no other of his family members. William Henry Mabley aged 2 is with his grandparents.
I think too that I have Thomas's death in St Columb in 1868.
Over a year ago I got a lot of help from Rootswebbers when trying to find her death. I was pointed to Elizabeth Maibrey's burial on 23.01.1861 and monumental inscription as a possibility. The dates of birth and death fits. The parish records state that she was at Sunwell, Antony when she died. So a connection there. But my concern is that the monumental inscription is "Maibrey" and not Mabley or Mably. I can accept that the parish clerk may have misspelt her name but I'm not so sure about the headstone being wrong.
So in order to make some progress I would be very pleased to hear from anyone who
(1) knows of the surname Maibrey in Cornwall or Devon. It does not seem to be a common name in the UK at all. So could it be that the monumental mason misspelt it, copying it from the Parish Register where it was initially recorded incorrectly.
(2) knows of Sunwell (Synwell) Antony. I am wondering whether Sunwell/Synwell referred to a particular estate, and just approx how many people might have lived there in the mid 1800s.
(3) has access to the monumental inscriptions for Cornwall. Is Elizabeth Maibrey's burial at the parish church?
(4) knows about the Bible Christian church in St Neot. I have no idea whether Elizabeth Mably continued to follow the faith into which she was christened but if she did, where would she be likely to be buried?
Many thanks for reading my very long email!
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as the burial was recorded in the parish registers, she was buried in the churchyard. You could contact the church warden to see if there is a stone.
http://stjohnincornwall.org.uk/st-john-church/
1861 census Sunwell, Antony RG9/1523 folio 126 pg 30
John Davey head mar 54 ag lab b. St Cleer
Christianna wife 50 b. St Ive
George son 13 ag lab b. St Neot
From checking on the Cornwall record office site, Sunwell was part of the manor of Antony.
http://crocat.cornwall.gov.uk/DServe/searchpage.htm
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Thank you Osprey.
I did not see that 1861 census entry. Probably because I was looking for John Davey still married to Ann (Bunkum). Thanks to your help I have found a marriage in December 1860 in St Germans of John Davey and Christiana Ingram which I am thinking might be him/them. There is a death in 1855 St Germans for an Ann Davey. Maybe that was her.
I have also contacted St John's as you suggested to see if there is any info about Elizabeth M's headstone.
Sunwell Farmhouse sounds a bit grand for an ag lab to be living in.... as head of the household, don't you think? Sorry to be a bit slow, but do you think that Sunwell farmhouse was part of the Antony estate now owned by the National Trust?
Many many thanks for your help.
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it seems to be part of Antony manor from an early period, but there is a reference to a separate lease for Sunwell in the 1930s.
Found a notice for Sunwell from 1842 when it was to be let "consisting of a good Farmhouse, Barn, other suitable Farm Offices, and about 64 acres of orchard, Arable and Meadow Land. Three fields called Broadlands, are situate in the Parish of St. John, and the remainder of the Premises in the Parish of St Antony...The Term will be Ten Years from Ladyday next..."
Notice was from Aug 1842, so term would have started therefore 25 March 1843. At the time of the notice the land was in the occupation of Mr. John Bennett. I've just checked the 1841 census for him and haven't found him as yet, so perhaps the person leasing the farm didn't live in the farmhouse.
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ok, found him in 1841 ref HO107/135/2 folio 25 pg 11 at what looks like Kingdon Sanwell between Higher and Lower Tregantle.
1851 it appears to be Kingdon with Robert Blackmore, ag lab, & family living there.
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on second thoughts, I think in 1841 Kingdon may be unoccupied & the 2 farm names appear on the same line. So possibly no-one there in 1851 and then in 1871Rg10/2229 folio 80 pg 12 there is John Gilbert farmer of 95 acres. As there is no mention of acres after John Davey's name in 1861, he is not the one leasing the land.
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Thanks Osprey.
I think I have the correct John and Ann Davey in 1841 in Liskeard. With 7 children, the last aged 0 has no name. Elizabeth Davey is aged 10 included. I wish they had occupations on the forms then so I could be sure!
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The occupation is given for John with Ann and 7 children on original page of the 1841 census. He was an Ag. Lab. (Agricultural Labourer).
Annette
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Thanks Annette7 - I don't know how I missed that.
Just to add for anyone else researching Mableys - I found out about an on-line Mabley family tree through Rootschat but was unable to access it. I have just found this link though - and am including it here in case someone else is having the same problems I did!
http://studylib.net/doc/7386987/maberley-family-tree---maberly-family-home-page
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I am still trying to find the death/burial of Elizabeth Mably and would be interested in ideas that might help.
So... Elizabeth Davey was born to Wesleyan Methodist parents, John Davey and Ann Bunkum and baptised in St Neot in 1828.
Elizabeth married Thomas Mably from St Endellion. Their son, William Henry Mably, was born at Sunwell Farmhouse, Antony in 1859 where her father worked.
Thomas Mably is listed as a widower in the 1861 census.
The St Johns parish records show that a Elizabeth Maibrey died at Sunwell aged 23 yrs in January 1861. I was told that the Cornwall M I stated that she was aged 32 yrs not 23 yrs but that it is not correct. A very kind person has sent me a photo of the headstone and it clearly says 23 yrs - and Maibrey, not Mably.
But the headstone states that Elizabeth Maibrey's brother, George Davey is buried with her. He died in 1871 aged 23 yrs.
Elizabeth Mably also had a brother George Davey who was born in 1848, in St Neot. I know it's a 20 yr gap between siblings. Her mother Ann was 41 at the time of his birth.
I can't find a baptism for George Davey with John Davey as father. The other children in the family were baptised.
I can't find a baptism of a George Davey and an Elizabeth Davey to the same parent/s but know Elizabeth Davey/Mably had a brother George from the 1851 census.
Presumably Elizabeth Maibrey (b. abt 1837) started life as Elizabeth Davey but I am unable to find record of a marriage of her to a Mr Maibrey.
I am also curious that in St Johns in 1851, John Davey (Hind) 44 yrs, wife Ann 44yrs and son John 19yrs seem to be in one household. In another are their children Mary 12yrs, Richard 9 yrs, Joseph 7 yrs, George 3 yrs on their own.
Any comments would be very gratefully received.
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according to the 1851 census, George was born in Liskeard as were brothers Richard & Joseph so this baptism 20 Feb 1848
http://www.cornwall-opc-database.org/search-database/more-info/?t=baptisms_nc&id=63697
birth reg George Davey march qtr 1848 Liskeard vol 9 pg 177 mother's maiden name Bunkum
Joseph's baptism in the same place
http://www.cornwall-opc-database.org/search-database/more-info/?t=baptisms_nc&id=107697
and Richard's
http://www.cornwall-opc-database.org/search-database/more-info/?t=baptisms_nc&id=107609
George was buried 28 May 1871 aged 23, seaman of HMS Cambridge.
The family are all in one household if you look at the census return, they just happen to be at the bottom of one page & the top of the next.
I thought you already had the marriage for Elizabeth Davey & Thomas Mabley 18 July 1858 in Stoke Damerel. In linguistic terms, r & l are both liquids, so Mabley/Maibrey is not much of a difference.
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Thanks Osprey for the link to George Davey's baptism. I thought it would be strange if they did not have him baptised too.
I reckon he's the George Davey in Ontario aged 12 in the 1861 census. Then in Stoke Damerel in 1871.
The headstone at St Johns makes it clear that the Elizabeth buried there had a brother called George Davey. In the process of trying to work out whether these could or could not be my relatives, I have been looking for an Elizabeth Davey who married a Mr Maibrey, so as to rule them out if necessary.
But I have found no such marriage. The surname Maibrey is not at all common. So could this grave be Elizabeth Mably', I wonder.
Thomas Mably could not write his name when they married (though Elizabeth Davey signed) so there could have been an error in how the death was recorded by the parish clerk. And the GRO. Just one thing... our family has always pronounced Mably with a short "a" rather than a long "a" which would be how I would pronounce Maibrey.
And I am surprised that the headstone spelling is wrong. And her age is clearly written as 23 yrs. Elizabeth Mably would have been 32 yrs in January 1861. She was born on 4 August 1828.
And given that John and Ann Davey were Wesleyan Methodists, is it likely that their children would be buried at the Parish Church?
So many questions, as ever!
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non-conformist churches didn't always have burial grounds so burials could be in the parish churchyard.
https://darlingtonhistoricalsociety.wordpress.com/general-information/the-historic-development-of-cemeteries-in-england/
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Thank you Osprey. I didn't know that.
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Do you have the 1861 Death Cert?
Who registered the Death may be enlightening.
GRO Index has her as age 32
MAIBREY, ELIZABETH, age 32
GRO Reference: 1861 M Quarter in ST GERMANS Volume 05C Page 26
FreeREG has 23 as you stated Headstone has.
Trish :)