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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Topic started by: david54 on Friday 04 November 16 13:02 GMT (UK)

Title: Bluecoat schools
Post by: david54 on Friday 04 November 16 13:02 GMT (UK)

Good evening,

Can anyone please tell me how you can search for people who entered the Bluecoat schools in the early 1800s.

I am trying to find my GG grandfather family prior to him coming to Australia. James Bennett Gibbs. The only family info I have on him is that on his marriage certificate here in Aust he lists a Alfred L Gibbs as father .... not sure if fact or fiction as cannot find an Alfred L anywhere.

I know from family that he went to one of these schools..... and there it ends. Is becoming a quest and a little frustrating at times.

Thanking you in advance.
Title: Re: Bluecoat schools
Post by: Maggsie on Friday 04 November 16 13:15 GMT (UK)
Hi,
Year of marriage in Australia?
Maggsie
Title: Re: Bluecoat schools
Post by: Maggsie on Friday 04 November 16 13:18 GMT (UK)
is it 1909 married to Matilda Petts?
Maggsie
Title: Re: Bluecoat schools
Post by: Kay99 on Friday 04 November 16 14:04 GMT (UK)
Hello David

To help establish the age of James was his marriage to  Ellen Fisher Cotter on  13 Dec 1864 at Nuccaleena, Frome, South Australia - Father  Alfred L Gibbs?   Does the cert list his father's occupation and James's age /occupation?

Kay

Edit - There were quite a few Bluecoat Schools - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charity_school

Title: Re: Bluecoat schools
Post by: david54 on Friday 04 November 16 14:21 GMT (UK)

Hi kay,

Thanks and yes, you are correct. James would have been 29 ish.... and no the marriage cert does not list any other details of his father.

I have not heard my family talk of his father, except to say no one knew of him.... so a mystery.

When he married into Cotter family they were respected family in SA, first surgeon to the state and to the governor .... Ellen being first white girl born in the new state.

Too many questions and no answers.

Thanks for the link to the bluecoat schools, more research,

thanks for the help

david
Title: Re: Bluecoat schools
Post by: ribbo39 on Saturday 05 November 16 09:12 GMT (UK)
Hi David,
Have a look at this site about Reading, Berks Blue Coat School;

http://www.rbcs.org.uk/about-reading-blue-coat-school/

One of my uncles went there in the 1920/30s and they wore from memory a black cape, white shirt and a yellow ?tie.

May not be the school your after but am sure they would have records of past students.

Alan
Title: Re: Bluecoat schools
Post by: Ruskie on Saturday 05 November 16 10:31 GMT (UK)
Trying to trace him via school records from the 1800s is probably going to be difficult or impossible. Records may not have been kept at the time, and may not survive today. Best to go via the usual route of censuses, etc.

Do you have his immigration record? What date did he arrive in Australia?

It is not unusual that parents of someone who immigrated were not known. Noticable by blanks on and sometimes incorrect names on death certificates. :)
Title: Re: Bluecoat schools
Post by: david54 on Saturday 05 November 16 11:11 GMT (UK)

Good evening,
Thanks to all for the replies and so my quest continues

Immigration records into Australia at that time were dubious at best and the access to them now seems to record only those who came with government assistance, not those who paid their own way.

I know he came to Adelaide so maybe now a trip to the Immigration Records here might be one avenue to pursue.

Thanks again, and find the whole concept of these schools sad, and same opinion of workhouses (found both my grandmother and her mother spent time in them)

Thanks again.
Title: Re: Bluecoat schools
Post by: Kay99 on Saturday 05 November 16 11:20 GMT (UK)
You have probably already considered this, but just in case thought I would mention it 

There is  a baptism on Anc of a James Bennett Gibbs at Cheltenham on 5 Oct 1834 however the parents were James and Jane Gibbs with James listed as a gardener.  Although it is the wrong father's name I can't see the family in any census at the moment or a marriage/any other baptisms  for the couple :-\   

Kay
Title: Re: Bluecoat schools
Post by: Maggsie on Saturday 05 November 16 11:34 GMT (UK)
Hi,
Ship records.....2 x Jas and James Gibbs.
The one aged 30 was with a Thomas Gibbs aged 35.
Maggsie


Name:   Jas Gibbs
Estimated birth year:   abt 1826
Age:   28
Arrival Date:   Jul 1854
Arrival Port:   Melbourne, Australia
Departure Port:   Liverpool
Ship:   Miles Barton
Nationality:   English

Name:   James Gibbs
Estimated birth year:   abt 1833
Age:   30
Arrival Date:   27 Jul 1863
Arrival Port:   Melbourne, Australia
Departure Port:   London
Ship:   Monarch
Nationality:   English
Title: Re: Bluecoat schools
Post by: david54 on Saturday 05 November 16 14:00 GMT (UK)
Evening all,

Thanks for the information.

First Kay, I looked at that and did wonder. I am not sure if the Albert L is correct as Dad says nothing was every mentioned of his parents etc .... now this is several generation "heresay" so who knows.

My biggest challenge is places in England as I will admit that I am geographically challenge when it comes to England (read no damn idea where places area)

Maybe worth looking at this family again.

Thank you
Title: Re: Bluecoat schools
Post by: david54 on Saturday 05 November 16 14:05 GMT (UK)

Hi Maggsie,

Thanks for that and will look closer at those two. I am not sure why they would have gone to Melbourne and not Adelaide but maybe it was closest they could get a ship to, if it is who I am looking for.

I am not sure what the link is between families but he is integral part of my family and seems my GGgrandfather kept family close. They were originally from Kent (Chatham area) ... too many questions.

Thank you for help it is much appreciated.
Title: Re: Bluecoat schools
Post by: GillyJ on Saturday 05 November 16 23:09 GMT (UK)
There was a bluecoat school in Chester and Liverpool would be the nearest port. Chester archives may have information.
Title: Re: Bluecoat schools
Post by: david54 on Sunday 20 November 16 06:35 GMT (UK)
Afternoon Kay,

Thanks for the reply and am at sea so getting back here sometimes depends on internet coverage.

I have come to the same people as you and the birth year is correct. I did put to dad that maybe the name on his marriage certificate was false .... that comment gives me chills so maybe on the right track. I have not found much about James and Jane, except thought I had seen a marriage cert for them but passed it over because was not who i was looking for, now, cant find it again.

I do know he arrived in Australia as a 14 year old alone as far as I can see.

Maybe time to search for Schools close to Cheltenham, .. Dad says someone paid for him to be educated.

Thanks for your help, as always is appreciated.   David
Title: Re: Bluecoat schools
Post by: Kay99 on Sunday 20 November 16 07:04 GMT (UK)
Have you no idea where you could have seen it???      I searched and didn't find a marriage for James and Jane and wondered whether the couple were actually married?

Will continue to have a fiddle

Kay
Title: Re: Bluecoat schools
Post by: Brentor boy on Sunday 20 November 16 09:24 GMT (UK)
Powell's Blue Coat School, Cirencester, founded 1714. Cirencester-Cheltenham 15 miles.
Title: Re: Bluecoat schools
Post by: david54 on Sunday 20 November 16 10:56 GMT (UK)
Good evening Kay and "Brentorboy"

Thanks for the replies. I have learnt that I need to either learn where counties/cities are around the UK or find an atlas or decent map .... must admit geographically challenged about UK.

Brentor, thanks for the idea, do you know if it still exists and if they would have records back far enough.

Kay, the record I saw was for a marriage at about 60yo which is why I did not give it another thought. I have come to much the same thought as you, not married at the time.

Sure I saw in Ancestry Uk ..... so heading back there again.

Thanks to you both.

david
Title: Re: Bluecoat schools
Post by: Brentor boy on Sunday 20 November 16 11:40 GMT (UK)
Powell's C of E primary school, Gloucester Street, Cirencester, Gloucestershire, still fully functional.

I''m afraid I cannot help as far as records go. Sorry.
Title: Re: Bluecoat schools
Post by: david54 on Sunday 20 November 16 12:16 GMT (UK)

Thanks ... will send them email and ask, you never know

Title: Re: Bluecoat schools
Post by: Br1gau on Sunday 20 November 16 13:21 GMT (UK)
Hi David,

Records show James Bennett Gibbs arriving SA 1850 per ship Bengal, no other Gibbs on board
http://www.familyhistorysa.info/shipping/passengerlists.html

Also many newspaper articles on TROVE in Vic & SA in 1860 trying to trace James, similar to the one attached, did he inherit something, I wonder?
Title: Re: Bluecoat schools
Post by: david54 on Sunday 20 November 16 13:47 GMT (UK)

Good evening,

Thanks and yes have that, family had talked about that advertisement since I was small.... still not sure what it was all about. Whatever it was , was important as the lawyers carried that advertisement in every state's paper.

He arrived SA by himself as a 14y/o .... could not imagine today's kids doing that.

The stuff before leaving England is my problem... seems the bluecoat schools still have walls around them.

Thanks for the help

David
Title: Re: Bluecoat schools
Post by: david54 on Monday 11 June 18 14:22 BST (UK)

Good evening and back to the hunt for James Bennett GIBBS

I have found that a James Gibbs was apprenticed to the "Bengal" and then a James Gibbs left the Bengal in Port Adelaide, South Australia, 4 years later.

Not a believer in co-incidences it would appear that he joined as a apprentice to the Bengal and left on completion, that being on arrival to SA.

I now have 2 issues, who signed him to his apprencticeship (that may guide me backwards there) , second being where was he and what was he doing in SA up to when he married

Any help appreciated.

Thanks in advance

David 
Title: Re: Bluecoat schools
Post by: lancsann on Friday 15 June 18 17:23 BST (UK)
co-incidence??

1841

James Gibbs age 6 living with a couple of other Gibbs children in a household of other names. In the same street there is an Edward Bennett - attorney
Title: Re: Bluecoat schools
Post by: david54 on Saturday 16 June 18 09:10 BST (UK)
Good evening lancsann,

Ok, please more information ..... please as this has me intrigued and may close gaps as age is close to right. Location ??

As far as I know he ended up in a Bluecoat school .... but anything else is vague at best.

The lawyer being in same street cannot be co-incidence.

Thank you very much for your help

David