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Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: bethanyyd96 on Saturday 03 December 16 12:32 GMT (UK)
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I need help finding out whether the old chapel in Old Chapel Yard (off Friargate in Preston) is still there. I know it was founded c. 1605 and abandoned in the 18th century. The actual name is Roman Catholic Church of St Mary.
Help is appreciated.
Beth
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From GenUKI:
http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/LAN/Preston/StMaryFriargate
St Mary, Friargate, Preston
It was founded in 1605 and closed in 1992.
St. Marys was on an elevated site on the south side of Friargate brow. The only access was by a flight of steps in a small tunnel through a row of shops. The church was demolished in the 1990s and the site is now a car park. A small shrine at the end of the tunnel marks the location of the church porch.
The link above, has a photograph of the tunnel and shrine.
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I was just going to post the same KGarrad. :)
http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/LAN/Preston/StMaryFriargate
car park ... oh dear - so sad.
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Thanks for the replies, so sad that it's now a car park. I will have a look at the link, so far it has made a very interesting read.
Beth
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Two sketches of the church. The first is the original 1605 and the second its 1761 replacement :
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01iza/
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01izb/
Mo
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Hello Bethany. I have a book: "Through Twenty Preston Guilds: The Catholic Congregation of St. Wilfred's Preston", published 1993. No author stated but it may have been Leo Warren . I got it this year in Preston.
It states "... Chapel then situated in a courtyard opposite the present Sun Hotel. This courtyard is known as Old Chapel Yard, off the western side off Friargate between Edward St. and Marsh Lane, formerly Bridge St."
Chapter 3 has the heading "In a certain street called the Fryergate". That chapter is about the "new" Catholic chapel, opened 1761.
Appendix includes: Friargate Chapel Subscriptions 1815.
The Parish Dead of WW1 & 2.
There are chapters on 19thC Preston's R.C. schools. Also extracts from SVP & other church organisations' records.
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I will see if I can find that book, seems to be an interesting read. Thanks for the replies.
Beth
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Hi Beth. Are you in England ? Lancashire County Libraries should have it. I think I bought my copy direct from St. Wilfred's Church in Preston.
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Yes, I'm in Preston actually, I'm actually going near there Tuesday, so I'll have a look.
edit - I have looked on the website, they have it at the Harris Museum, so I'll go there Tuesday.
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Re-Published 1993 by Berwyn Books, Buckley, UK.
Available on internet for £6.
https://www.abebooks.co.uk/Twenty-Preston-Guilds-Catholic-Congregation-Wilfrids/10134358334/bd
Or £10?
http://www.yesteryearbooks.co.uk/?page=shop/flypage&product_id=22784&keyword=Booklet,&searchby=keyword&offset=1000&fs=1
(Says publisher was Preston, Lancashire Sanctuary Bookshop 1993)
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Some very important people (King Richard II) have been dug up from beneath Car Parks, you know.
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Threlfall, It was Richard the Third. That's the problem with Roman numerals.
He's relevant to the current debate about descendants of Edward, Third of that name.
Just in case anyone doesn't know, the Wars of the Roses was not fought between Lancashire & Yorkshire.
Doubt there's any royals lying under the car-park in Preston.
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Ooops, sorry, and thanks for the correction. I did know that, just the fingers doing the typing seemed to have slipped up, what a twitty thing to do (blushes gently) - I may never live that down! I won't modify my original post, or your reply would look odd, just sit in the shame of a typing error.
Wonder if there are any still-missing royals to discover anywhere? Perhaps we ought to list 'em all, and see? That'd keep someone busy for a few years, wouldn't it?
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TY
It's called dyslexic fingers! :D ;D
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Ah, if only I could spell that.....
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The find of KR3 was followed by a search for King Alfred the Great. The only find was a bone which may have belonged to his son, another great king.
Richard's wife was his sister-in-law and his cousin's daughter by the way. His brother, King Edward went totally out on a limb and married someone to whom he wasn't related. He may have done it twice.
Should the royal bones search be a new thread? I'm a novice here so don't know the rules.
I also have dyslexic finger.
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Oh, we usually get down one or two sidetracks, as we move along. We'll get back to Proud Preston soon.
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Yorky, My mother often quoted the lines "Proud Preston, poor people, high churches, low steeple". Her mother was born there. Her dad's paternal ancestors lived in Preston too, not Scotland as my mother thought. There was a Scot among them, but further back than I'd expected. The pub on the street where he lived was called the Robert Burns Tavern. He was married at St. Ignatius Church which I've been told was the 1st in Preston to have a spire and one of the 1st Catholic churches built after the Reformation in England to have one. When R.C. churches became legal at the end of 18thC they weren't allowed spires, towers or bells. St. Ignatius was new when GGGGF married.
The old chapel in Old Chapel Yard was an illegal one and liable to be confiscated by the Crown. Its replacement, St. Mary, was also illegal when it was built. The ownership was held in trust by various people over many years in deliberate obfuscation.
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Yours sounds a totally fascinating history ... my folk all very boring, even when RC /Protstant troubles in Lancs, one half were one, and one half t'other, and somehow nothing really nasty seemed to happen to either ... did they hide each other under the bed???
Lancs Records Office at Preston could be very helpful to you, I'm sure. It'll be mid January at least before I get there again, but if there's any info you want that can wait so long......
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Hi,Yorky. Thanks for the offer. May take you up on it. I'm over 100 miles away. Relatives in Lancs , so I visit. Spent 2 days in Lancs Archives in July, reading wills. Went to a small archive too, run by a voluntary heritage group. Also day trip with Catholic FHS, NW branch; all v. informative & inspiring. :)
I didn't find a will of my yeoman ancestor (d.1790) . Later investigation of Lancs Archives catalogue discovered it among George 111 Court Rolls: Catholic Wills, with 2 earlier ones. I have will of son of aforesaid yeoman. Estate "amounted to less than £1000" . IMO that was a respectable sum 200 years ago. A Protestant neighbour & distant relative, with a much bigger property, died same era, possessed of £3,500. He was Churchwarden & Overseer of the Poor. Once I've "tidied up" 18thC I'm hoping to trace those families back. Their ancestor occupied the land in 1580. Leases and other documents are in County Archives. Yeoman's daughter moved to Preston in 19thC where 2 of her sons were corn dealers. Those were my grandmother's ancestors. grand
Scottish ancestor who married at St. Ignatius Church belongs to my grandfather. I suspect opposition to marriage. He & girlfriend had a baby 2 years earlier who died aged 7 months. They married at end of month in which she became 21. He was a shoemaker and active trade-unionist. 2 of his colleagues went to prison; his name featured in evidence. He was very active in Preston but his beginning & end are a mystery. He's a brick wall. St. Ignatius registers are in the Archives.
You may be right about hiding R.C. friends & relations "under the bed". A theory is that in strongly Catholic counties like Lancashire people didn't want to "finger" their neighbours. Even some of those responsible for drawing up lists of Recusants resented the prospect of Catholic landowners being replaced by "foreigners" from outside the county, with proceeds of sale going to Gov't. Some estates were bought by friends of former owner who then formed a trust for the heir. Catholic landowners, in turn, protected their Catholic tenants & servants. Lancashire is fortunately, a long way from London. :)
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I seriously think my recusant and other mob did hide each other, somehow. Most were firmly protestant, but some were "done" for being the "wrong" religion.
As I said, I've pencilled in mid January for Preston Records office, nearer the time, if you pm me with details about what you'd like me to try and sort through, I'll have a go. Furthest back I can get any of my lot really firmly is about 1580s, too. Before that it'd be educated guessing, - not firm fact.
TY
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Thanks Threlfall Yorky. I'll have a think. My priorities are the end of the Scottish GGGGF and the beginning of his namesake grandson which were both 19thC. I hope they are in St. Ignatius register.
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As I said - p.m. me in the early part of January, and we'll see if I can be of any help.
TY
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I love the history of friargate I lived at number 6 for 4 years in the 1960 now in Australia for 50 years
what a shame this had to go . you should not call yourself Proud Preston. its ok to progress but do not
wipe out all the past. wack up you government veggys