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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => London and Middlesex => England => London & Middlesex Lookup Requests => Topic started by: BassinghamTerrier on Wednesday 28 December 16 16:26 GMT (UK)
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Following on from my Ann Stanfield & John Meilllear request, here's another for down in the smoke!
Charles Walter Duprez Ross was born in Ipswich, Suffolk in the March Quarter of 1873 to William Swanson Ross and his second wife Ann Eliza McDonald (nee Gray) and I have the following information about him:-
- 3 Apr 1881 • Newson Street, Ipswich St Matthew, Suffolk, England - he is a child aged 8 (correct)
- 5 Apr 1891 • Woodstock House, Hendon, Middlesex, England - he is a butler aged 18 (correct)
- 15 Jun 1897 • St Andrew, Lambeth, England - marriage to ELLEN PRICE (born c1874, daughter of James Price, labourer) - he is a public house manager aged 24 (correct)
- 02 Apr 1911 • Cock Tavern, 58 Old Street, St Luke Glasshouse Yard, London, England - he is a barman aged 31 (should be 38!)
- Mar Q 1927 • Lambeth, London - death aged 54 (correct)
But where is he/they in 1901?
And why is he "single" in 1911? Has Ellen died? If so, why is he not "widowed"? Are they divorced?
I cannot answer any of these questions and as I cannot find Ellen in any census I am not sure where she was born.
I also don't know whether there are any children.
To further complicate matters, there is Charles Dupré Ross (born Haddington, Scotland c1874) floating about and he is NOT connected whatsoever!
Thanks in advance for anything that you might be able to turn up.
MT ;)
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Hi there is a Charles RASS 26 Occ Barman b Ipswich in Wilmot Street. Bethnal Green?
Census ref RG13/291/30/52
Keyboard86
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That sounds very like him! Thanks!!
Right age too.
Any family?
MT ;)
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That sounds very like him! Thanks!!
Right age?
Any family?
MT ;)
He's Single working at a pub!
Keyboard86
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this looks like Ellen
1901 Whittlesey St Lambeth
Ellen Ross Head M 26 Norton Suffolk
May Ross daughter 3 Norton Suffolk
RG13 401 67 18
on marriage they both gave address as Whittlesey St Ellen was age23 her father was James Price occ labourer and one of the witnesses was Charles Price
Suz
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this looks like Ellen
1901 Whittlesey St Lambeth
Ellen Ross Head M 26 Norton Suffolk
May Ross daughter 3 Norton Suffolk
RG13 401 67 18
on marriage they both gave address as Whittlesey St Ellen was age23 her father was James Price occ labourer and one of the witnesses was Charles Price
Suz
Thats correct, Suz - they did.
Perhaps I should have mentioned it ...
So why is he "single" in 1901 as well as 1911? I can only guess that for whatever reason, Charles did not want it known at work that he was married. Either that or perhaps his landlord gave the infornation and simply got it wrong, but that seems strange given that all of the other details are correct.
Where is Ellen (and May) in 1911?
Thanks again,
MT ;)
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the other witness at the marriage was Eliza Miller -do you know who she was - it seems to me she was the child Ellen May 's aunt.
1911 look ups are not allowed
It may be worth searching the free index to see if Ellen may is with a relative
Suz
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Righto, Suz - I'll give it a whirl.
Now that I know where Ellen was born, and with a child in tow, I might well be able to locate her in 1911 myself.
As to the possible sister, Eliza, I don't know; I only discovered this line today so I don't know a lot at all about the Prices.
Cheers!
MT ;)
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Righto, Suz - I'll give it a whirl.
Now that I know where Ellen was born, and with a child in tow, I might well be able to locate her in 1911 myself.
As to the possible sister, Eliza, I don't know; I only discovered this line today so I don't know a lot at all about the Prices.
Cheers!
MT ;)
you might try searching free index for Helen Ross
Eliza was definately described Ellen May's aunt -will dig around a little
Suz
Suz
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Here are the two witnesses at the marriage -under the same roof in Whittlesey St
19-01
30 Whittlesey St Lambeth
Harry Miller Head M 38 Brewer's cellarman Ixworth Suffolk
ELIZA MILLER wife M 35 Norton Suffolk
Violet E Miller daughter 10 Lambeth
Herbert F Miller son 7 Lambeth
CHARLES PRICE brother in law single 29 Norton Suffolk
RG13 401 70 23
Suz
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Lovely!
Thanks very much - I'll crack on tomorrow with the 1911 census.
MT ;)
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Just to confirm matters
ROSS, ELLEN MAY mmn PRICE
Q4 1897 MILDENHALL Volume 04A Page 831
Comparing with the marriage date this suggests Ellen May was already on her way. I suspect the marriage didn't last long
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a bit more info on Ellen
1891 she is in Woodstock House Hendon with Walter Ross!! Walter is the Butler and she is a General Servant
1881
Stanton St Norton Suffolk
James Price Head M 44 labourer
Harriet wife M 44
William son S 22 labourer
Harry son S 20 Groom
Herbert son 18 Groom
ELIZA daughter 15 scholar
James son 12 scholar
CHARLES son 9 scholar
ELLEN daughter 7 scholar
Annie daughter 2
all b Norton
RG11 1847 87 19
and Ellen's parents in 1891
Stanton Rd Norton Suffolk
Jas Price Head M 53 ag lab
Harriet wife M 53
Charles son 19 ag lab
Arthur Smith lodger 18 Miller
William Smith lodger 16
all Prices b Norton Smiths b Debenham
RG12 1454 92 9
Suz
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Ellen May Ross
Baptism 31 Oct 1897, Lambeth St Andrew
Father Charles Walter Ross, public house manager
Mother Ellen Ross
Address: 11 Whittlesay St
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Just to confirm matters
ROSS, ELLEN MAY mmn PRICE
Q4 1897 MILDENHALL Volume 04A Page 831
Comparing with the marriage date this suggests Ellen May was already on her way. I suspect the marriage didn't last long
Baptism Lambeth St Andrews
31 Oct 1897
Ellen May Ross
parents Charles Walter & Ellen Ross
address 11 Whittlesey St
father's occupation Public House Manager
Suz
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1891 she is in Woodstock House Hendon with Walter Ross!!
Suz
Do you know, I THOUGHT that I'd seen her name somewhere earlier, and you're dead right!
Thanks again,
MT ;)
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Just to confirm matters
ROSS, ELLEN MAY mmn PRICE
Q4 1897 MILDENHALL Volume 04A Page 831
Comparing with the marriage date this suggests Ellen May was already on her way. I suspect the marriage didn't last long
Should I be looking for a divorce then?
Remember that in both 1901 and 1911 Charles declares that he is single, whilst in 1901 Ellen maintains that she is married.
I've already tried deaths, divorces and probate with no joy (on Ancestry)
MT ;)
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To be honest, divorce was so expensive and difficult in those days more often than not most people just split up and later on either remarried bigamously or pretended to be married.
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I've found Ellen May Ross in 1911.
She's with her uncle Harry Miller, a name mentioned earlier in the thread.
Now to find her mother ...
MT ;)
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try searching for Helen Ross!
Suz
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Got her, Suz! ;)
But that's bizarre - she's changed her first name unless the head of the house filled it all in -as he should have done - and simply presumed that was her name and had been calling her that for some time!
Hey ho. It's clearly her.
Thanks!
MT ;)
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It often happens Ellen is entered as Helen - as Anne is often Annie or even Hannah !
Glad you found her
Suz
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Thanks for all the help with this - much appreciated.
I think that we can now consider it 'Case Closed'
MT ;)