RootsChat.Com
Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Fermanagh => Topic started by: Colleen Archbold on Wednesday 11 January 17 18:26 GMT (UK)
-
All i know about my G Gmother is her name, Jane HENDERSON, born 1843.
Her marriage certificate shows her father as William HENDERSON.
From her obituary I think she came to South Australia In about 1866.
Her brother Thomas, born 1841 was in Adelaide SA too. In papers he left in our city library his son said he was an Ulster Scot from Enniskillen.
She named her children Emily Jane, Marion Bishop, Helen Crozier, Bessie Olive and Allen Thomas.
Her husband was Thomas Allen WHITING.
I listed the names because I'm wondering if these hold clues to her mother and father's names. Maybe her mother was a CROZIER as that seems like a surname.
She met and married her husband in Aust and as far as i know she never went back to Ireland.
In her obituary there's mention of 2 sisters in Ireland and 1 in America.
Among her photos there's one of a young woman who looks identical to her and written on the back is a message "from Jane Annie to Auntie Jane. The photo has Mercer Enniskillen stamped on it.
I'm stuck and stumped. There are a lot of Hendersons in Northern Ireland and although I've found many families i don't know how to work out which is hers. Any help is appreciated.
-
Among her photos there's one of a young woman who looks identical to her and written on the back is a message "from Jane Annie to Auntie Jane. The photo has Mercer Enniskillen stamped on it.
Might be worth posting the photo (front and back) on the Deciphering board for the experts there to help with dating. If we can find details of Jane Annie in Ireland then we might have a better chance of finding the correct Henderson family in Fermanagh.
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/handwriting-deciphering-recognition/
-
Thank you.
I've done that but i think i may have posted to the wrong board. ...
-
Thank you.
I've done that but i think i may have posted to the wrong board. ...
Are you sure you posted the photo? you've only two posts (which are on this topic)
-
http://childrenofmoorfield.blogspot.ie/p/basic-family-history.html
Joseph Crozier, married Catherine Donald of Cabra, Kilskeery, Co Tyrone.
Her mother, was Jane Henderson of Cabra.
Her father, was Hugh Donald.
James Donald and a sister Jane emigrated to Australia in 1845. Both had family near Melbourne.
John went to America.
Mary Donald married Andrew Armstrong of Laughterush, a farmer.
Isabelle Donald married Thomas Boyd, a farmer of Corlave, near Pettigo.
-
other stuff here..... http://www.classypages.com/FranksGenealogyPage/timeline.htm
-
Thanks for the Crozier info. At first look it doesn't seem to fit for dates and places. I'll go through it again though.
-
No, it doesn't seem to fit with the details in your first post.
Have a try at posting on Deciphering board as it should help with dates for Jane Annie.
-
Yes i will. Thanks
-
Just posting a link here for the photo-
www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=762868.msg6143831#msg6143831
-
Thanks for the Crozier info. At first look it doesn't seem to fit for dates and places. I'll go through it again though.
i know... it was just an example of what can be found on the site!
-
"..Her brother Thomas, born 1841 was in Adelaide SA too. In papers he left in our city library his son said he was an Ulster Scot from Enniskillen."
Who left the papers in the library....Thomas, or his son?
Can you give some more detail about this please. Brother Thomas was in Adelaide.....did not live there?....was visiting?.......why are there papers in the library....what was his line of work......how have you identified him to be a brother to your Jane?
Who is the son (of Thomas, the brother of your Jane). Did this son live in SA?.
On the marriage certificate for Jane HENDERSON and Thomas WHITING....what church please, and who are the witnesses?
-
Research into a number of Irish families, containing abstracts of prerogative wills, genealogies, etc., made by H. A. Richey, 1900.
Format: Manuscript
Subjects:
Baird, family of
Breakey, family of
Brown, family of
Bullingbrook, family of
Clarke, family of
Crozier, family of
.........
Dublin: National Library of Ireland, Ms. 8316
-
Two pages of Fermanagh based Jane Annie or Annie Jane females around their late teens/early 20s in 1911, just in case they are of help at some point.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01j9k/
-
Thomas, Jane's brother settled in Adelaide and married. Had 2 children. Wife died. Married again had more children.
Thomas wrote his family tree ( down from him, not back to ancestors) and had his paperwork for the purchase and leases of land in Adelaide. His daughter added to those papers when he died and put them in the Adelaide library. I think there was a push at the time to do that to record SA's pioneers.
One of Thomas's sons was a politician and involved with Mawson's expeditions. He was a colourful character , not much liked. He was the first misister for foreign affairs and spent much of his life overseas. So there is much info about him in historical files. He had no children.
The other children of Jane's brother Thomas are recorded . Two had children and I've traced them but not to living people. That's something I will do.
I have personal letters from lady who confirmed Thomas's children but she has now died.
The marriage certificate of Jane to my g gf Thomas WHITING shows them being married at the residence of Thomas's father as was the custom then for many people. I have the WHITING genealogy back many generations.
The witnesses to Jane and Thomas wedding were her brother Thomas and his brother Richard. I've met a descendant of Richard and we've confirmed the genealogy .
-
I found a Jane Annie BRIEN in the area in the 1911 census living with her mother. Landlord is Thos CROZIER.
Jane Brien age 20 in 1911-
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Fermanagh/Rockfield_or_Killaclean/Drumsluice/521738
Drumsluice townland-
https://www.townlands.ie/fermanagh/lurg/derryvullan-and-islands/drumsluice/
Family in 1901- surname Breen (quite common in Fermanagh)
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Fermanagh/Newparton/Drumcullion/1353224
Several townlands in Fermanagh called Drumcullion but based on 1911 location this one is most likely- both Drumcullion & Drumsluice are in Irvinestown Poor Law Union/Registration district- now called Irvinestown)-
https://www.townlands.ie/fermanagh/tirkennedy/magheracross/drumcullion/
Birth of Jane Breen gives mother as Catherine McCaffery-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1887/02560/1946811.pdf
-
Next candidates-
Jane Ann Bell, age 13 in 1901-
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Fermanagh/Enniskillen_Rural/Drumclay/1364138
Birth gives mother as Mitchel-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1887/02571/1950535.pdf
Jane Ann Lawder, 13 in 1901-
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Fermanagh/Aghyoule/Gortmullan/1357189
Sister Selina's birth gives mother as Luney-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1885/02645/1975479.pdf
Jane Anne Coalter, 14 in 1901-
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Fermanagh/Newparton/Cooltrain/1353191
Birth for brother Henry gives mother as Elliott-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1882/02760/2013680.pdf
-
In your other ('Deciphering') topic you said 'I'm assuming this Jane Annie was her sibling's daughter.'
A reasonable primary assumption, but given the estimated birthyears involved, just putting out the secondary possibility that Jane Annie could have been addressing a Great Aunt.
-
In your other ('Deciphering') topic you said 'I'm assuming this Jane Annie was her sibling's daughter.'
A reasonable primary assumption, but given the estimated birthyears involved, just putting out the secondary possibility that Jane Annie could have been addressing a Great Aunt.
I had the same thought, gaffy, when I was looking at the photo. etc.
If it helps to choose suitable candidates, the hairstyle was slowly going our of fashion by 1911 as it originally been developed/created to balance the broad brimmed hats that were in fashion in the early part of the date range we gave.
Gadget
-
Yes i wrote up a sort of chart to see whether "aunt" or "great aunt " would be more likely. If it's great aunt i don't like my chances of filling in the gaps.
I did find a Catherine Henderson born 1845 (2 years after my Jane) with a daughter born in 1889. ..which fits.
I would need to subscribe to the website to get details.
-
[quote author=Colleen
Jane Brien age 20 in 1911-
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Fermanagh/Rockfield_or_Killaclean/Drumsluice/521738
Drumsluice townland-
https://www.townlands.ie/fermanagh/lurg/derryvullan-and-islands/drumsluice/
Family in 1901- surname Breen (quite common in Fermanagh)
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Fermanagh/Newparton/Drumcullion/1353224
Several townlands in Fermanagh called Drumcullion but based on 1911 location this one is most likely- both Drumcullion & Drumsluice are in Irvinestown Poor Law Union/Registration district- now called Irvinestown)-
https://www.townlands.ie/fermanagh/tirkennedy/magheracross/drumcullion/
Birth of Jane Breen gives mother as Catherine McCaffery-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1887/02560/1946811.pdf
Thank you. That's a lot to take in!
-
My g gm Jane HENDERSON married Thomas WHITING and bought land at Balaklava South Australia.
They called their property RIVERSDALE.
I'm wondering if that could give any clues to where her family lived in Northern Ireland from about 1840 - 1870.
I've found ARCHDALL (Archdale) family who owned an estate that at that time built a house Riversdale.
Would there be records of the families who rented house and land from this estate?
-
The Archdales may have estate papers in PRONI Belfast- you can search their e-catalogue but perhaps nothing in the way of tenants.
Photo of Riversdale House near Ballycassidy-
http://lordbelmontinnorthernireland.blogspot.co.uk/2014/01/riversdale-house.html
Going back to the possible Jane Annies mentioned earlier (and still pure speculation) based on proximity then Drumcullion (replies #15 & #16) is in the area, Drumclay would have been north of Enniskillen but is now part of it. Gortmullan borders Co. Cavan and Cooltrain is east of Enniskillen Airport.
-
Thanks for the info about places . I'm struggling with townlands, county, diocese, etc. They seem to change names over time. I'm sure i need to understand where places are before i can get my answers. So thanks for those notes.
I need to print out a map i think and write the names on it.
Was Riversdale house near any of the places that come up in a search for Jane Annie?
-
Riversdale House-
http://www.parksandgardens.org/places-and-people/site/2813
-
Colleen—are you still active on Henderson? My gg grandmother was Margaret Henderson b 1843 in Ireland. Father was listed as Wm Henderson of Ireland. Do you or others researching this have DNA done on Ancestry? My dad and I match a descendant of a John Henderson b 1833 in Fermanagh who moved to Australia. The match is quite high. Would love to know if all our puzzle pieces match up. Jenny
(*) Moderator Comment: e-mail removed in accordance with RootsChat policy,
to avoid spamming and other abuses.
Please use the Personal Message (PM) system for exchanging personal data.
-
Yes i am still searching for my Jane Henderson's parents or any other info.
Yes i had my DNA tested ( family tree, basic one) i ran it through Gedmatch but so far I've had no clue regarding the Henderson connection.
The Margaret you mention may be a cousin to Jane. Looks like they were both born 1843...but both have father William .
I have seen references to a John Henderson in Aust but took only a cursory look because i couldn't see a connection.
Maybe we could run our dna results through gedmatch .
-
Wonderful! My Margaret’s birth year is an estimate or calculation from her census records and obituary. She married Francis Burket in Detroit, MI—but we’ve never known more of her history. My reasonably close DNA match with the descendant of John was a first glimmer! I am on GEDmatch T494199.
I was searching for Enniskillen Henderson’s since John’s info does state he came from there. He would be about 10 years older than Margaret. See if we pick up anything at all in GEDmatch.
-
The descendant of John is in GEDmatch too. If she messages me, I’ll ask if ok to share her name and number😊
-
I'll look up my gedmatch number.
Im a bit slow lately. ...both wrists/hands not working. So if there's a delay with me answering it's not because I'm ignoring you.
I have a feeling there was a John Henderson on a ship with Jane in 1866 from plymouth to Adelaide. That's the only reference I've found to a John. There's also reference to a William .
There seems to be another Henderson family with mames Thpmss, john, jane and William. They were orphaned and their grandmother sailed with them to America where they were split up between their Henderson and Bain relatives. Their mother was Jane Bain and their father Thomss Henderson.
I thought they were my ancestors but the birth dates did not fit. I wonder if they were relatives though, since the names are similar.
Unfortunately another person wrote my Jane's details into his tree on wiki tree and Geni. I haven't been able to get him to take them down. So it can be confusing.
.
-
Hi Colleen, I am also on Family Tree DNA with a kit of N63916. I haven’t seen your name matching me on either site—but perhaps you have it under initials or a different title.
I had found a ship passage from Ireland to NY in 1853 that I wondered if it was my Margaret’s family. But it did contain a William aged 40 and Margaret aged 45 as parents (I assume). I cannot find them anywhere in census data. So, I am unsure if linked to me or not.