RootsChat.Com
General => The Common Room => Topic started by: Andrew Tarr on Tuesday 17 January 17 12:53 GMT (UK)
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How would you interpret the comment attached to Lydia's entry below? Will it mean a deaf-mute?
Note her mother died a couple of weeks later ....
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possibly a Quaker?
try google for quaker silent funeral
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Could it say 'infant' rather than 'silent'?
Just a thought,
Melbell
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How old was she?
Look at this link, if I'm reading it correctly, it seems to mean that it was a burial without bells etc and was connected to suicide, especially female suicides.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01jav/
You need to scroll down for the whole article.
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A Silent Burial probably means there was no religious service.
Before the 1880 Burial Laws Amendment Act no body could be buried in consecrated ground except with the service of the Church, which the incumbent of the parish or a person authorized by him was bound to perform; but the canons and prayer-book refused the use of the office for excommunicated persons, for some grievous and notorious crime, and no person able to testify of his repentance, unbaptized persons, and persons against whom a verdict of felo de se had been found.
Stan
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Lydia was 5 years and two months old, mum must have been a recent widow as there was a three year old born to her also.
Mike
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She might have been unbaptized
Stan
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Lydia was 5 years and two months old, mum must have been a recent widow as there was a three year old born to her also.
Thanks to all for interesting replies. Yes, Samuel Gaskill was buried in the previous November, so maybe Lydia died as a consequence; though if she was only 5 that seems unlikely.
This is the only example of a Silent burial I have found in about 600. One or two have been annotated as 'Romon' who presumably were buried grudgingly according to statute.
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Before the 1880 Burial Laws Amendment Act no body could be buried in consecrated ground except with the service of the Church, which the incumbent of the parish or a person authorized by him was bound to perform; but the canons and prayer-book refused the use of the office for excommunicated persons, for some grievous and notorious crime, and no person able to testify of his repentance, unbaptized persons, and persons against whom a verdict of felo de se had been found.
How very unChristian these church people used to be - or was it down to the government if the 1880 Act was an Amendment? How can it possibly be a child's fault that it's not been baptised and to then bar them from having a burial in consecrated ground is unthinkable.
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I've seen ones which had " No ceremony " or " No ceremony requested" written after. They were usually Catholic.
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Just a thought.
If Lydia's father had only died the previous November could "silent" mean a burial without the usual bell ringing, hymn singing and so on as the family were still in mourning ?
Dorrie
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Do we know what a normal burial or funeral of an ordinary person would have been like at this time?
Might the family have belonged to a religious denomination which disapproved of music or even singing in church? e.g. strict Presbyterian.
I've heard tales of burials of Catholics at this time. Some bereaved Catholic families used strategies to ensure their deceased relative was buried in consecrated ground, whilst avoiding taking part in what they would have believed to be a heretical religious service. These included:
Requesting " no ceremony" or not requesting a funeral service. Not sure of the procedure.
Mourners talking loudly throughout the burial, thereby drowning out the clergyman's prayers.
Bringing the corpse to the churchyard, placing it beside the grave, then walking away before the burial service began.
Burying the corpse secretly in the churchyard at night.
Another course of action may have been to attend the burial but turn their backs on the clergyman.
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I have seen transcript burials of children of silent birth. Presumably still birth or dying just after birth. Except for the earlier birth you have found this, to me, would seem an explanation. Do you think it possible that the older Lydia also died? and this child was to be named after her sister.?
I believe the CofE allowed unbaptised child burials before the 1880 act.
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Wred, "Silent" as in Baby never cried or made a sound at birth.
Sounds logical explanation.
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Wasn't Lydia older as stated by Mazi, so not a baby?
Lydia was 5 years and two months old, mum must have been a recent widow as there was a three year old born to her also.
Mike
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yes groom I noted that but thought maybe the older Lydia had died and this child was given her sisters name before unfortunately also dying.
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yes groom I noted that but thought maybe the older Lydia had died and this child was given her sisters name before unfortunately also dying.
It gives her age on burial though as 5yrs 2 months, so it wasn't the burial of a baby.
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It gives her age on burial though as 5yrs 2 months, so it wasn't the burial of a baby.
What does? I have transcribed (what purports to be) the original parish register, which doesn't give Lydia an age at all. Or most of the other burials for that matter, in 1782 ?
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Sorry Andrew, I assumed, perhaps incorrectly, that as Mazi had given her exact age that it must have come from records somewhere.
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Familysearch has Lydia gasgill christened 27 april 1777 cathedral Manchester, parents Samuel and ann. burial 4 June 1782 st Thomas ardwick, seemed a good match to me
Mike
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http://www.rootschat.com/links/01jb8/
Here is the link
It could have been a late christening, but my original post was to suggest it was not a burial of an infant
Mike
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Familysearch has Lydia gasgill christened 27 april 1777 cathedral Manchester, parents Samuel and Ann. burial 4 June 1782 st Thomas ardwick, seemed a good match to me.
Absolutely. I had not found Lydia in the Ardwick baptisms, but hadn't looked further. Doesn't answer the question of why the burial was Silent; interesting, that.
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The possibility occurred to me that with father dead, mother dying and possibly not aware, that the incumbent was being asked to bury a child who may not be baptised, with no mourners so took the easy way out.
Mike
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I've just seen a mention of "silent funerals" in connection with All Saints Parish Church, Hindley, Lancashire. It's in a sentence near the end of the page about the history of All Saints Parish on Lancashire OPC. A Silent Funeral was one which no Anglican minister attended.