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General => Armed Forces => Topic started by: Carmelo Galea on Wednesday 08 February 17 11:54 GMT (UK)
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I had the unfortunate misfortune of asking Forces War Records to look into my paternal and maternal grandfathers' WW1 service, and from the outcome of their search of one of them, that relating to Royal Navy service, I can say that they extracted the money from me for information that has absolutely nothing to do with my ancestor. I have enclosed an attachment, noting briefly what happened from 12 Jan 2017 to yesterday (07 Feb 2017).
From what transpired, I can say that this company is not to be trusted, as they only seem to be interested in getting the money and then run.
I urge you to look through the attachment, and decide for yourself whether I am right or wrong.
Thank you for your attention.
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forces war records do not have many records that are not available elsewhere. I think you should have asked for advice on a suitable forum before you parted with any money.
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They're not a Company that enjoy a good reputation on here.
There's nothing they can offer that you can't get yourself with a bit of groundwork.
Around 70% of WW1 service records were destroyed in the blitz & WW2 service records are still with the MOD & closed to commercial sites but their "shop window" doesn't reflect this.
As a counter there are sites like this one & others that give information FOC & if we/they don't have the answer will usually be able to tell you where to find it if it still exists.
So I wouldn't disagree with you in that there are people out there who have latched on to the rise in interest in military history & see it as a way of making easy money.
http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=4332219
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If you look at the dark bar at the top of the page and select SEARCH, click on it, then enter "forces war records" into the search box, you will see several other threads about this company - none of them are complimentary I'm afraid.
By the way, welcome to rootschat. :)
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Hi, welcome to Rootschat :)
To be honest I have to agree with what has been said, they do not have a very good reputation and perhaps the best course would have been to ask on Forums (especially this one) where there are many people who, if they can, will offer advice etc for nothing.
To be honest with you, and I have to stress that I mean absolutely no offence, I would not have gone down that route again after being relieved of £295 in 2012 and getting nothing for my money.
Best regards
Frank.
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RootsChat has many experts who could probably have found any information - at no cost!
Many of us on RootsChat enjoy researching (me included!).
So just ask on RootsChat, and see what turns up.
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Welcome from me too.
If you are looking for Royal Navy records for WW1, put the name into the search engine of the National Archives, if the records are there they can be downloaded for £3-50.
As has already been said, WW2 records are still with the MOD, as are the records of anyone in the services after 1920.
There are plenty of people on here who will willingly help you if needed.
Jebber
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For the record, a quick search on Carmelo Galea on the National Archives site brings up twelve RN records for the Great War, none of them however with an 1893 birth date so the answer you should have received is "nothing to be found".
maxD
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Had a bit of a problem working out my way around this website, but thanks to Sarah this seem to be over and done with. I do not think there is a way that I can answer you individually, so I will try and show my gratitude to you all in one reply.
Before I do so, I only happened to land on this site by accident, when I googled Forces War Records reviews (or something to that effect), though I have a vague memory that I might have caught a glimpse of this site at some other time.
To: gortonboy
You are right when you said I should have asked for advice before; the only problem I did not know where to do this - looks like I know now. Thanks gortonboy for taking the time to respond.
To: jim1
Unfortunately I learned the hard way about Forces War Records, and I did hear about a lot of WW1 records having been destroyed during the German blitz during WW2. You mention MOD - I think this is Ministry of Defence I would think ? It is really nice to know that I can rely on some kind people on this site than offer their services free of charge, or perhaps can suggest other places to ask questions. I have now cancelled one other commission that I gave to Forces War Records, and asked for a refund of almost 90pds on the other one, mentioned in my original posting.
To: Ruskie
Yes, as I mentioned above, when I google about Forces War Records reviews, it came up with a 2014 issue that someone had, which was then posted on this site, as I did with mine.
To: jess5athome
Now that I know about this time, I know where I can post my questions and queries. I suppose we all learn from our own mistakes, at times quite expensive ones, like mine. You are right about I should not have perhaps gone the same path, but Forces War Records said 10pds deposit and nothing else if no records found, and so I thought OK I will risk loosing 10pds, but they of course turned around and took the rest of the money, although nothing relating to my relative was found. What a bunch of greedy people they are - that's what I think about them now. I trusted them with 10pds, and they took away another 90pds for nothing !
To: KGarrad
It is great to hear that I can now rely on experts on this site for information, perhaps even at no charge to me. What a great relief - pity I did not know about this before, however, better late than never.
To: Jebber
I will try what you said about looking on the National Archives website. 3.50pds is much much more cheaper than the 10pds+90pds those people at Forces War Records extracted from me, without giving me one single bit of information that relate to my relative in question.
To: MaxD
Forces War Records told me that I am paying for a researcher that spent many hours looking for information I was after. I have told them (not mentioning names of course) that they should have told me "nothing to be found", and then I asked for a refund of the 90pds - so far they have not responded, though it was only yesterday that I did.
To: all of the above good people
Thank you all for your interest in my post, and I now look forward to a happy future on this site, which seems to me to be an honest site (very rare in these days where money seem to blind a lot of people).
Thank you all.
Carm.
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Carm
Nice words - thank you. Put all that behind you and try us for size with specific requests (usually best in an individual thread for each name, giving as much back ground as you have).
Here's the route for WW2 records https://www.gov.uk/get-copy-military-service-records/apply-for-someone-elses-records.
You will find when you go to the National Archives site, that some records are only available through subscription sites, which they name. Example guide http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/help-with-your-research/research-guides/first-world-war-soldiers-pension-records/ . These are trustworthy web sites with many Great War and earlier records (the "wrong" RN records came up on one of them). You could consider a subscription.
Good luck and ask away!
maxD
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CG
Do post an enquiry naming the people in whom you are interested. I think you will have your answers in minutes.
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Thank you MaxD and Birkbeck, and I will see what I can find from the sources of information given to me through this posting, and then I will ask, on this site, if I am unsuccessful. Working on some old family photos at the moment, which I need to finalise, before getting back on my paternal and maternal grandfather's service information during WW1.
In the meantime, my sincere thanks to you both, and the rest who took time to respond to my original posting.
Kindest regards from Victoria, Australia.
Carm.
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Don't rush away without telling us whose service records you are ultimately hoping to find, Carmelo!
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Hi Birkbeck,
It will eventually be my paternal grandfather Carmelo [also could show as Carmel] Galea (1893-1977) Royal Navy service during WW1 - he was released from his civil service job (in Malta) to serve, then return back to his job without loss of service. He only served for a few years, but eventually I would like to know what medals he got (his children [only one survives now] repeatedly confirmed that they saw his medals, but somehow the same medals eventually disappeared). I do not know which years he served, and what was his service number. This is the same ancestor that I had an issue about with Forces War Records (refer my first original posting) here.
Then there will be my maternal grandfather Vincenzo [also could show as Vincent] Brincat (1889-1930) Army service during WW1 - he served with the King's Own Malta Regiment of Militia. I have got a copy of his army records (not sure whether complete) that I got from Malta, and they show 'Campaigns Expeditionary Force Malta'. A historian friend of mine in Malta told me that this was a term for all Maltese who volunteered for overseas service, and that he must have been sent overseas. My mum (long since passed away) had told me that he was in France (but I am not sure whether during his army service or just on business [he was a carpenter by trade], perhaps ?). The copy of his service that I have does not show anything about overseas service, so I am thinking that perhaps, if he did serve overseas, he might have been assigned to a British Regiment. He enlisted in Malta on 17 March 1915 and his Army No was 10523, and discharged by purchase on 11 October 1919.
I will eventually come back with more details, but these are my two ancestors that I am very interested to find out about their service during WW1.
Thank you for now.
Carm.
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I can see Carmelo listed as being awarded the Star, British War Medal and Victory Medal when having a quick look.
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I think that's this trio.
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Having said that, there is also a listing for a gentleman of that name showing him being awarded the Royal Navy's Long Service and Good Conduct Medal at a later date too.
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I can see a V Brincat serving at Salonika.
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I think that's this trio.
Hi Birkbeck, yes that would be the trio mentioned :)
Frank.
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My paternal grandfather Carmelo Galea was born on 26 September 1893, and my maternal grandfather Vincenzo Brincat was born on 17 September 1889.
If I try out the sources suggested to me here, and fail in getting any information, I will then post a separate thread on each of my grandfathers mentioned above. Carmelo navy years were short, so he could not have been awarded the long service medal you mentioned I would think.
Thanks for now Birkbeck and jess5athome - would eventually get replicas of medals once I get to know exactly which ones are applicable.
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Carmelo
I can confirm my earlier post that none of the eight Carmelo Galea names in the RN records at the National Archives (also reproduced and cross checked on Ancestry and Findmypast) have an 1893 birth date.
The only army records are medal records for a V Brincat (no first name given) number 3862 in the Maltese Labour Corps, no further detail and for Vincenzo Brincat service number 9449 who served in Cyprus from Jan 1915 with the King's Own Malta Regiment of Militia, again no further detail. I can't see any Salonika reference as posted by Birkbeck.
As far as service records are concerned, I believe there is no more to be found in UK records at any rate so I am not sure what posting about them again would achieve.
maxD
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Thanks MaxD. I remember someone or somewhere I heard or read that there are a lot of Maltese records in Kew. Do you think this is untrue or perhaps something that I might have misunderstood?
Carm.
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Max
I saw the V Brincat/Salonika reference on the WW1 Service Medals and Award Rolls on Ancestry.
It may not have been the right gentleman, though.
http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/5119/41629_625537_9955-00089?pid=5641447&backurl=http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?_phsrc%3DRBf4998%26_phstart%3DsuccessSource%26usePUBJs%3Dtrue%26indiv%3D1%26db%3Diwoservicemedalawardrolls%26gss%3Dangs-d%26new%3D1%26rank%3D1%26msT%3D1%26gsfn%3DV%26gsfn_x%3D1%26gsln%3DBrincat%26gsln_x%3D1%26MSAV%3D2%26MS_AdvCB%3D1%26cp%3D0%26catbucket%3Drstp%26uidh%3Dd43%26pcat%3D39%26fh%3D0%26h%3D5641447%26recoff%3D5%25206%26ml_rpos%3D1&treeid=&personid=&hintid=&usePUB=true&_phsrc=RBf4998&_phstart=successSource&usePUBJs=true
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You can try various search combinations on the NA advanced search page to cross check what you've been told already. http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/advanced-search using combinations of Malta or Maltese and putting WO (for army records) or ADM (for RN records) in the References box and using the dates boxes to limit the dates. However, those army records that did survive the second war, and the extant RN records are on Ancestry or Findmypast and I, and others, are using those to answer your queries.
This NA guide is very useful http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/pathways/firstworldwar/service_records/sr_soldiers.htm
A sample search on "Malta" and "service" with WO throws up 600 odd medal cards (all of which could also be found by name) and a few officers records but no soldiers records. The same search on ADM throws up 188 mostly medal records and some service records, again all of which are searchable by name.
Among these are of course the ones for the names you have given already. Significant though is that if someone did not serve in a war theatre, then there would be no medal card and if that same person's record has not survived than that means no trace at all.
Doesn't help much I'm afraid. If you have other names/dates of birth start a new thread for each and keep plugging away!
maxD
Birkbeck - yes. that is the same name V Brincat (number 3862 Maltese Labour Corps) but the poster gave the service number 10523 and the discharge date is wrong so I mentioned him just to discount him.