RootsChat.Com
Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Wales => Flintshire => Topic started by: fluffyferret on Friday 17 March 17 22:01 GMT (UK)
-
Hi,
I'm looking for any information about the following family -
Isaac Roberts was born in 1855 in Bagillt and according to his birth certificate his parents were William Roberts a miner and Mary Roberts formerly Jones.
I've been trying to find a marriage for William Roberts to Mary Jones. There is a possible marriage at Bistre Emmanuel Flintshire in 1853.
The family were possibly in Bagillt in 1861 but I can't find them on the census so they could have been listed on the missing census pages.
I can't find a baptism for Isaac Roberts in Bagillt.
The closest Isaac Roberts I can find in 1871 is living with his uncle Thomas Roberts and aunt Caroline although Isaac is shown as 17 born in Liverpool and no parents William or Mary to find their ages/places of birth.
Isaac was married to Mary Jane Davies in 1876 in Bagillt his father William a collier.
Best wishes,
Carole
-
There is this Birth Registration in Holywell Flintshire which would be the Registration District if he was born in Bagillt.Jul/Aug/Sep 1855.Volume 11b,Page 251.
Regards
William Russell Jones.
-
Hi William,
Many thanks for your quick reply.
I have Isaac's birth certificate born Bagillt 1855 son of William Roberts and Mary formerly Jones.
I have been struggling to find the family members on the census returns and a marriage for William Roberts to Mary Jones. I have Isaac on census returns 1881 onwards.
Best wishes,
Carole
-
I'm not finding the William Roberts and Mary too readily on any Census.The only one I 'm finding is with a William Roberts born in 1804.
Regards
William Russell Jones
-
Hi William,
I hadn't noticed that one.
What year is that census with William b1804?
Carole
-
1851 I think.
Regards
William Russell Jones.
-
Thank you :)
Found William b 1804 m Mary in 1851. Mary would be about 50 in 1855 when Isaac was born?
Going with the Isaac Roberts aged 17 in 1871 living with his uncle Thomas Roberts and aunt Caroline in Bagillt if I've followed Thomas back correctly he did have an older brother William b abt 1833 Holywell son of John Roberts and Jane Davies. This is the only Isaac Roberts I can find in 1871 that might match. Looking at the original census he is definitely indexed correctly at 17. Thomas and Caroline's son was born in Liverpool and Isaac is shown as the same the rest of the family Holywell although Caroline is shown as different birthplaces on different censuses.
I suppose with the 1861 census missing it might be very difficult to find them.
Carole
-
There is a very interesting Marriage at Holywell St James in 1853 between a William Roberts and a Mary Leighton according to North Wales BMD.
Regards
William Russell Jones.
-
The 1855 birth registration Holywell, Sep Qtr, 11b 251 - mother's maiden name Leighton
There is a Holywell birth registration Jun Qtr 1857, 11b 265, mother's maiden name Jones (this may be the Whitford birth on North Wales' BMDs)
-
The 1855 birth registration Holywell, Sep Qtr, 11b 251 - mother's maiden name Leighton
There is a Holywell birth registration Jun Qtr 1857, 11b 265, mother's maiden name Jones (this may be the Whitford birth on North Wales' BMDs)
I think that is the birth certificate I have for Isaac Sept Qtr 1855 but it says mother Mary Roberts formerly Jones.
Where did you find Leighton?
-
The GRO (General Register Office) recently opened its books to allow birth registration searches to reveal mother's maiden name on enquiry. You have to register to search.
Hence my confusion when my 1855 search threw up Leighton yet your birth cert shows Jones.
-
I have the replacement birth certificate and it shows Isaac Roberts b 1855 Bagillt son of William Roberts collier and Mary Leighton :)
Also William Roberts collier son of John Roberts collier married 1853 to Mary Leighton dau of William Leighton collier both full age and of Bagillt
witnesses - Enoch Leighton (Mary's older brother - see below) and Margaret Roberts (possibly William's sister?)
Looking at the GRO births index there are 3 other possible children Sarah Roberts b 1854, Sarah b 1857 and Joseph b 1861. There was also a William b 1861 but I found a baptism for Joseph in the Bagillt baptisms booklet son of William Roberts collier and Mary Roberts of Union Row, Bagillt so the Joseph belongs to William/Mary. No baptisms for the other children at Bagillt.
Roberts/Leighton births after 1861 on the index seem to belong to John Roberts m Ann Leighton - Ann I think was Mary Leighton's sister but the John Roberts was from Caerwys not Bagillt but could still be related to William Roberts.
The last Roberts/Leighton birth I can find for William and Mary was in 1861 and I can't find them in 1871 so they could have moved or one or both parents died. I'm struggling to find what happened to the second Sarah Roberts b 1857 and the only possible Joseph Roberts b abt 1861 was in the workhouse in 1871.
Re the Leightons
Fortunately there was only one William Leighton collier in Bagillt in 1841
Pentre Bach
William Leighton 35 collier
Judith 35
Jane 20
Mary 15
Elias 15
Enoch 14
Mary 8
Ann 6
Wm 3
Emas 2
Unfortunately there seems to be 2 Marys! Looking at the original they both look like "Mary" one isn't a Margt. There is a bit of a gap in the ages between Enoch and the second Mary so I wondered if William had remarried and that's why there were 2 Marys? Perhaps there might be baptisms for the children to check for parents names?
In 1851
Willam Leighton 51 collier
Judy wife 47
Mary 18
Anne 16
William 13
Joseph 7
all born Bagillt.
Carole