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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Lancashire => Topic started by: noseyoap on Sunday 23 April 17 16:26 BST (UK)
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I have just found my grandmothers birth certificate after searching about 10yrs for her, it states that she was born at 5 Hatton Gardens,Liverpool. Can anyone tell me if this was a hospital or similar, my grandmother was illegitimate.It didn't help me finding her when the name my mother gave me was completely different from the one she was actually born with.
Thanks Pat
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What year was she born
If you Google "Hatton Gardens Liverpool". There is information about it
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Going into Hatton Garden from Dale St. on the left there used to be the linked Police and Fire Stations. From memory they were low even numbers. So number 5 would be on the right. In the 1960's there was a medical building on the right you could get immunisations there etc. Possibly that was in previous years a hospital.
I'm sure a RootsChatter will be able to give you more accurate information.
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Thanks for info as it was 1877 it could quite easily have been a hospital then, her mother actually lived in Pall Mall which looking at an old map is not far away
Pat
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On the Lancashire On Line Parish Clerk Project there is a baptism for Jessy Louise Copland child of George Copland & Emily Hasted dated 27 January 1878 the address is 5 Hatton Gardens Liverpool and the father's Occupation Superintendent of the Fire Brigade. It looks as if it was a house used for Fire Brigade personnel.
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It could be the Section House which was in front of the fire station. See the Town Plan at https://www.old-maps.co.uk/index.html#/Map/334518/390766/13/100871
Stan
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Per the 1881 census and 1881 Gore's Directory, the Police Section House was at 3 Hatton Garden, and number 5 was the Central Fire Station. The Superintendent of the Fire Brigade lived there with his family, and there were also two resident ostlers.
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The section house sounds a good bet, I don't think her mother had any connection with fire or police (unless the unknown father was stationed there!) It's all very intriguing, the whole road to finding my grandmothers birth has been intriguing. My mother always insisted her name was Ada Boston but it turns out her birth name was Edith Pritchard, but by the time she was baptised 18months later in Shropshire her name had become Ada Boston the plot thickens. Thanks for your help everybody
Pat
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The section house sounds a good bet
The residents of the Section House (3 Hatton Garden) were almost entirely single male PC's so that would be an unlikely place for a birth.
As I mentioned previously, 5 Hatton Garden was the Fire Station. There was family accommodation there for the superintendent, and quarters for the ostlers; also stables.
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From the Liverpool Mercury - Wednesday 02 January 1878.
BIRTHS: Copland - Jan. 1, at 5 , Hatton-garden, the wife of Superintendent Copland, of a daughter.
Stan
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Possibly the birth of child mentioned in newspaper.
Results:
Name: Mother's Maiden Surname:
COPLAND, JESSY LOUISA WARINGTON Order
GRO Reference: 1878 M Quarter in LIVERPOOL Volume 08B Page 97
Maybe age should be 15 months
Name: Age at Death (in years):
COPLAND, JESSY LOUISA 15 Order
GRO Reference: 1879 J Quarter in LIVERPOOL Volume 08B Page 53
The death of George Copland, Superintendent, can be viewed on following link to Liverpool Mercury Newspaper http://www.old-merseytimes.co.uk/firebrigadedeaths.html to large an item to paste into message.
Regards Jean
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Gore’s Directory
1877
Hatton Garden
5, Fire Police Station, Copland George superintendent
Link: https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QSQ-G968-NKHD?mode=g&i=903&cat=241645
1878
Hatton Garden
5, Fire Brigade office, Copland George superintendent
Link: https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-8968-JD7V?mode=g&i=189&cat=241645
Blue
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Superintendent George Copeland had held that post from 1875 until his death in 1880 age 37, so would have been living at No5 at the time of Edith/Ada's birth. Do you think George's wife could have been a relative ?
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Thanks to everyone for their interesting articles. I don't think Emma Pritchard was related to them but she could have been a friend, the only thing that doesn't ring true was why was she born there but her home address was given as Pall Mall
Pat
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I'm wondering if the mother went into unexpected labour with a quick arrival of the baby, and was taken into 5, Hatton Gardens.
Just a thought.
Regards Jean.
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I had the same thought as Jean: possibly she was en route from Pall Mall to the Infirmary in Brownlow Hill, went into labour in Hatton Garden, and was taken into the Fire Station.
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Sounds quite possible
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Perhaps Emma had been working at No 5 helping Emily Copeland as she had a son George Daniel born 11 August 1876 and then Jessy was born 1 January 1878, so would have been pregnant the same time as Emma. ???
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Think this may also be a possibility, don't think I will ever find out the truth but the whole family has been a nightmare to sort out. I still have to find a marriage for the mother Emma she was with 3 different men (as far as I know) but I can only find one marriage
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Perhaps we could help you find them, if so then what information have you got?
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My thinking too, we might be able to help with things for you.
Regards Jean
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Thank you I think I have asked before but we'll have another go. Her mother was Emma Pritchard born 1856 in Shropshire (I have all this info). My grandmothers birth certificate says her father was Frederick Boston an actor (which is what my mother always told my) and on 1881 census she is living in College Lane, Liverpool with him but I cannot find any marriage for them. The second "husband" was Peter Morris who she was with on 1901 census but he died in 1901, he was a Catholic and I have found his death records where she is listed as Emma Morris wife she have not found a marriage again. I have the certificate for her third husband Thomas Sykes who she married in 1902 as Emma Morris. She died at 15 Prescott Street in 1933 and my mother always said she kept a boarding house.
Thanks for any help you can give me
Pat
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Have you figured who Dolly Boston was ( witness to Ada's marriage in 1915) ?
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From the marriage it would appear that Dolly Boston fits in from Ada's married side to her Boston marriage as she is as widow, her father is named as Fred Pritchard, found on http://www.lan-opc.org.uk/
Regards Jean.
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There was a comedienne around at that time by the name of Dolly or Dollie Boston. Her real name was Italia Dal Paos or Dalpaos. Her father Edward (Eduardo) Dal Paos had a confectioner's shop at 67 Stanley road, Bootle. He died in 1928 aged 55.
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This is where it gets awkward, Dolly was the daughter of Edith Pritchard (Ada Boston, my grandmother) she was born 1894 as Ada Boston! The 1915 marriage certificate of Edith Pritchard (Ada Boston) to my grandfather Henry Longmore Chapman was all a pack of lies, she wasn't a widow she had lived with Henry since about 1895 but he was already married so didn't marry until his 1st wife died. Henry was 70 when they married and I don't know why her father was put down as Fred Pritchard, probably to cover her being illegitimate. She had 5 children with Henry before they married, my mother was the only legitimate child and he was 75 when she was born. Hope you can understand all this.
Pat
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Pat,
Did you notice 1901 census there is a visitor named Mary Boston born about 1824 Liverpool with Peter, Emma and Ada, address 34 Crown St Liverpool. Might be worth finding out who she is if you don't already know.
Jean
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Sorry for not replying sooner been away. Yes I have seen Mary Boston and I am presuming it is mother in law but I have not been able to tie up any ends to her.
Pat
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She is entered as friend crossed out with visitor above, she is also as single.
Regards Jean