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Research in Other Countries => South Africa => Topic started by: brigidmac on Sunday 10 September 17 10:56 BST (UK)
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I have a 1871 UK census showing Michael H Benjamin merchant age 48 and wife Rachel aged 40
their children lionel age 12 Alfred 10 Agnes 5 and Gertrude 3 were born in south Africa
But as Hyam also age 12 and Edwin H were born Surrey UK
I suspect they may have been Rachel's children from a previous marriage
Are there any marriages for Michael H Benjamin in south Africa ?
He was a freemason in Good Hope in 1863
Thanks
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I've also found a freemason record for Michael Henry Benjamin age 38 in 1857
Is it possible that the family travelled backwards and forwards to UK in the 1850',s and 60.' ?
I.m not finding travel records .?
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I can't see a marriage entry, via Family Search, in South Africa. However, there is a death entry for Alfred Montague Benjamin, son of Michael Henry and Rachael.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CS9L-9S99-K
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Thanks bumblebee
That at least shows that Alfred returned to South Africa
As a widow Rachel is in London in 1891 with Edwin Agnes and Gertrude
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That death document lists middle names of siblings too
And seems to have all as full siblings
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Micheal Henry BENJAMIN died 1879 in London and left probate to eldest son Lionel harry BENJAMIN
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If there is a south African census around 1860 the older children should be listed .
Hyam age 12 is listed under the other siblings on the 1971 census that's why I thought he might have been from a separate marriage it's a common name apparently
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Not answering your query but F M P has London, Bethlem Hospital patient admission registers and casebook for an Edwin Hime Benjamin - dated July 7th 1908 - quite a lengthy report of 4 pages
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As far as I'm aware there are no census records for South Africa - not sure there were ever any conducted.
Just a thought, and having looked again at the death entry for Alfred Montague Benjamin, I wonder whether you should be looking for Jewish records?
"Funeral Expenses - Witwatersrand Jewish Helping Hand and Burial Society"
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The hospital record says Edwin was Jewish :)
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Doh!!!! :-[
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They could have married anywhere ;D
There is a marriage in SA for a Gertrude Lizzie Benjamin though age is a few years out
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-66RQ-QGB?i=1956&cc=2063749
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1891
Rachel Benjamin widow 60 born Hendon, London
Edwin H 29 bn Clapham
Agnes M 25 bn Port Elizabeth S.A
Gertrude L 23 bn Cape Town, S.A
GRO Birth registration Wandsworth Dec qtr 1861 for an Edwin Benjamin gives Surname Benjamin and mmn as Benjamin. (not a - )
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Thanks all. Yes this family were Jewish
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I have found a few records of Benjamin men being freemssons in south Africa
And a few of Mr Benjamins traveling between england and cape town
But hard to work out whos who
I would really like to know what theor businesses were in south Africa is there any way of finding out ?
Also how do i look for the jewish records in south Africa ?
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Michael H Benjamin may also have been known as Menachem
His brother Joseph also born in the 1830.s died in london in 1928 and left probate to my great grandmother widow of his nephew edwin hime
rather than any of his neices or nephews ..i dont know if that was because they were all either dead or in south Africa. Or didnt need the money as much as her
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I think death noticertificate of Alfred Montague Benjamin from 1907 would have listed his sisters married name if it was the same Gertrude lizzie who married in 1900
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-C91Q-N3B9-T?i=813&cc=2517051
Here is the death notice for Joseph Benjamin naming his
neice in law Charlotte as executor ....it looks as tho the south African collection of death notices on family search is best source .it states no children but some notes seem to have been pencilled in.with ages 62 and 66 ?
I wonder what that was about ?
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Im coming back to this mystery while ive got worldwide access
But in fact english census and 1939 register are giving me some clues
So i believe most of elderly Josephs nephews did die before him
He had surviving neices
Agnes Miriam BENJAMIN who never married and Gertrude Lizzie married name GOODMAN
They are together on 1939 census
But maybe Joseph was particularly clise to Edwin Hyme
On the 1861 census he was living with wife and "sons" Joseph aged 15 and Harry aged 3 .could he actually be his brothers child ?
No evidence...so far of Joseph and Rachel having children in other census..
The girls appear in a boarding school
Work in progress im still slow on computer .
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I have a 1871 UK census showing Michael H Benjamin merchant age 48 and wife Rachel aged 40
their children lionel age 12 Alfred 10 Agnes 5 and Gertrude 3 were born in south Africa
But as Hyam also age 12 and Edwin H were born Surrey UK
I suspect they may have been Rachel's children from a previous marriage
Are there any marriages for Michael H Benjamin in south Africa ?
He was a freemason in Good Hope in 1863
Thanks
I am helping someone with their family tree. Rachael - the wife of Michael was also born a Benjamin in 1830. She was the daughter of Mary Ann Levy and Lyon Benjamin. Would love to share information.
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Hi Nookie
Are you on ancestry ?
The Benjamin's are only blood related to me via great grandmother s husband Edwin Hyme
I m happy to share any information and learn if you can fill in any gaps .my grandmother's half brother Eric Michael changed his surname from BENJAMIN to BENNETT in second world war tho his mother our great grandmother kept her married name .
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Hi
Thanks so much for getting back to me. I have sent you a PM
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Have found Rachel in 1951 stepney London living with widowed mother siblings Julia, Ann ,Kate and Henry all annuitants
Gmother Jane Levi 84 b germany
and uncle Aaron Benjamin .
Not found them in 1841 or 1881
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Michael + Rachel's daughters Agnes age 16 and Gertrude age 12 are in Gloucester house school
A ladies academy in Kew in 1881
There are another 2 BENJAMIN girls on the list Edith age 9 May age 8 are they related
Gertrude returned to SA to marry Goodman .
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Theory is that Surrey born Hyam age 12 in 1871
Is actually the child of Michael s brother Maurice
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Assuming that Hyam is the child registered September quarter 1858 in Newington, then mother's maiden name is Harris.
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Thanks Bumble bee that would fit.with him being son of Michael s brother Maurice who married Louise Harris ( from memory)
#.yes Hyam son of Maurice and Louisa is not with his siblings in 1871
Back with his parents following years still single in 1911
With Maurice and Louisa who have been married for 66 years with 6children all still alive ( doesn't fit in with my records of 8 children)
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LInk to topic about ladies school attended by Agnes + Gertrude
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=829656.msg6939771#msg6939771
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Re Maurice and Louisa BENJAMIN
Children
1911 census has 6 children
But I have 8 from 1861 71+81 census ..maybe 2 had a different mother
Michael b1855
Julia1857
Hyam 1859
Rachel 1860
Edward 1863
Lizzie '66
Frederick '68
David P 71
Hyam and Rachel missing in 1871
David born after 1871 census
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Copied from email ;
"Michael Henry Benjamin from London settled in Graaff-Reinet with his wife, Rachel, in the mid-nineteenth century, around the same time as his relative Joseph Benjamin and Maurice and Louis Joseph. He became a marriage officer and justice of the peace in 1853."
Maurice was his.brother as was
Joseph who died childless in London in his 90.s
I'm not sure how Louis Joseph. related
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Gertrude is on 1911 census with husband William Goodman born hull 1860
They've been married 10 years ...no children born to this couple
Sister Agnes BENJAMIN is with them
I said answer#17 that they
were together on 1939
register but I can't find this now. Apologies
The south Africa marriage has husband as Marks Will? GOODMAN is that same man as William GOODMAN
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Rachel Benjamin was the sister of my paternal great-grandfather Abraham Louis Benjamin and his brother Michael Menachem Benjamin, the children of Lyon Benjamin (died Grahamstown 1838) and Mary Anne (Levi) Benjamin (died London 7 May 1857). Michael married Amelia Marcus in the first SA Jewish wedding. Rachel married MH Benjamin two months after their mother died in the Cape Town Gardens Synagogue. The marriage certificate and a extract of the mother's probate are attached.
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Thank you for adding that Richard
I will pm you
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Lionel Harry, eldest son of MH and Rachel Benjamin, died 31 March 1915 and is buried in the Witbank (Mpumalanga, South Africa) Jewish community cemetery
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Rachel was the daughter of Lyon and Mary Anne Benjamin. Lyon's brother, Henry, was the father of Michael Henry Benjamin. Among Rachel's siblings were Michael Menachem Benjamin and Abraham Louis Benjamin, all of whom were in Grahamstown, South Africa at various points in the 1800s. I am a descendant of both of the latter (via my paternal grandfather and separately via my paternal grandmother), both of whom married daughters of Simeon and Eleanor Marcus, Amelia and Miriam, respectively.
I am a great-grandson of Abraham Louis (via his son Louis Edmund i.e. my paternal grandfather) and a great-grandson of Jane Jael (Benjamin) Langner, who was Michael Menachem's daughter and mother of my paternal grandmother, Lilian Langner.
One thing that has amazed me is how frequently they journeyed back and forth from South Africa to the UK all their lives. With such a tiny pool from whom to select, these marriages were all arranged by older family members. It is noteworthy that Rachel, like my grandmother, was 28 at the time of marriage -- pretty much on the shelf. I've attached a table showing Michael Henry and Rachel were first cousins. Her father had died in Grahamstown in 1838 and her mother eventually went back to England and died in May 1857, two months before her marriage. Michael Henry was already 37 so it was a good solution for both.
Her brother, Abraham Louis, my great-grandfather, got married two years later. My grandfather was born in 1865 and was 48 when he married my grandmother who was 28, in 1913.