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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Carlow => Topic started by: NicolaasMars on Tuesday 19 September 17 16:21 BST (UK)
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Thomas PENDER and Brigid JORDAN marry on 31 Dec 1940 in Carlow. Thomas' father is, according to the marriage certificate, Michael Pender, farmer.
I did not find Thomas in the 1911 census, so I assume he was born after 1910. I seem to be unable to find him in IrishGenealogy.ie. His mother's maiden name is LAFFAN (based on the records of Thomas' brother James Pender (born 1901, Carlow; he marries in 1944 Brigid's sister Mary Jordan)).
I do find in FindMyPast the birth of a Thomas Christopher Pender, Carlow 1912 first trimester (vol 3, page 315). That birth, however, I cannot find in IrishGenealogy, and FindMyPast does not have the mother's maiden name. Furthermore, the "Christopher" bit has me worried.
Help in finding the birth of Thomas Pender will be greatly appreciated!
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Only 3 results for Pender with mother's name Laffan http://www.rootschat.com/links/01kr3/ on irishgenealogy
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Family Search
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FBR3-1Z4
also shows not a twin different page numbers same quarter
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FBR3-Y53
also not on civil index on IrishGenealogy
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Thomas Christopher was born Christmas Eve 1911 and registered in Jan 1912
unfortunately his parents are Thomas and Winifred Tracey of Borris
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1912/01500/1609712.pdf
found that by going through the Jan Feb March births page by page
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Carlow/Borris/Borris/309707/
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Image
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On the off chance that you may have the wrong family
Michael Pender with son's James and Thomas
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Carlow/Ballinacarrig/Cloghna/310383/
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The family dathai found is of Michael PENDER and Alicia BYRNE that married on Feb 09 1893
Another Michael PENDER married Mary Anne LAFFAN on Feb 13 1899 - LINK (https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1899/10372/5776501.pdf)
This is the family on the 1901 census - LINK (http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Queen_s_Co_/Graigue_Rural/Springhill/1646434/)
at 22 in Springhill (Graigue Rural, Queen's Co.)
By the 1911 census they had had three children one of whom died - LINK (http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Queen_s_Co_/Graigue_Rural/Springhill/808874/)
living at 6 in Springhill (Graigue Rural, Queen's Co.)
LINK (https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/civil-perform-search.jsp?namefm=&namel=pender&ddBfrom=&mmBfrom=&yyBfrom=1899&ddBto=&mmBto=&yyBto=1920&locationB=&keywordb=laffan&ddMfrom=&mmMfrom=&yyMfrom=&ddMto=&mmMto=&yyMto=&locationM=&keywordm=&ddDfrom=&mmDfrom=&yyDfrom=&ddDto=&mmDto=&yyDto=&locationD=&keywordd=&submit=Search) to children's births
Edward Dec 31 1899
James Mar 02 1901
Katherine Jul 29 1902 d. Jan 07 1903 of Influenza
I notice on the marriage of Thomas PENDER and Brigid JORDAN that one of the witnesses is a Dan PENDER - LINK (https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1940/08846/5198985.pdf)
which is a name in the family dathai found
Could your information about his brother James be incorrect?
i.e. the LAFFAN name
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Is this not Thomas Pender in 1911 ?
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Carlow/Ballinacarrig/Cloghna/310383/
Birth of a Thomas Pender Cloghna to a Michael Pender and Alica Byrne on Irish Geneology dated 03 06 1905.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1905/01771/1696994.pdf
Would this be the parents marriage?09 02 1893 Michael Pender(Rossmore) and Alica Byrne(Rossmore) married in Graigue church.Parents Daniel Pender and John Byrne both deceased.Witnesses John Pender and Annie Mcwey.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1893/10590/5858156.pdf
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On the 1901 census you have Michael Pender and Alica (Byrne?) living in Cloghna, Carlow with family Dan 6 James 3 Mary 2 and Kate 1.
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Carlow/Ballynacarrig/Cloghna/1040143/
Also on 1901 census you find Michael Pender and Mary Anne (Laffan?) living in Springhill Graigue with family Edward 1 and James 0.
Is this Michael birth (02 03 1901)
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1901/01963/1757505.pdf
Is this the parents marriage?
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1899/10372/5776501.pdf
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Looking at all that(it's late!!) could it be that the 2 Penders married to the Jordans were not in fact brothers but maybe cousins?
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Looking at all that(it's late!!) could it be that the 2 Penders married to the Jordans were not in fact brothers but maybe cousins?
They could only be distant cousins if both had a father named Michael
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Looking at all that(it's late!!) could it be that the 2 Penders married to the Jordan's were not in fact brothers but maybe cousins?
They could only be distant cousins if both had a father named Michael
That's true alright.Must have been too late for me including rehashing all the info from a previous post which I only happened to see after posting!!!!!!
Looking at the addresses given on the marriage returns both men were from the same area of Carlow ie Rossmore (Michael and Alica Byrne) and Springhill(Michael and Mary Anne Laffan).Those townlands would be very close , if not actually adjoining.
Presume the Michael married to Anne Byrne moved to Cloghna after marrying as he is there in 1901 census and their eldest child (born in 1894)is registered as being born in Cloghna.
Any of the likely looking Penders on Griffith's Valuation seem to be in the general Tolerton/Ballickmoyler area in Laois(Queens County) civil parish of Kilabbin.This would be very close to Rossmore/Springfield ie the addresses on the marriage returns from c.50 years later.
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Knowing why it is believed why Thomas PENDER who married Bridget JORDAN was the brother of James PENDER who married Mary JORDAN would be step one. If there is some documented proof of this then it is brothers being searched for.
Then next having documented proof that James' PENDER's mother was named LAFFAN would imply there was a Thomas in that family that was missed although unlikely unless Mary Ann PENDER nee LAFFAN had a child after 1911 and a ten year gap. It is not unheard of...
If there are assumptions in the original details then the possibilities are many as there are several families of PENDER in the area
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