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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Aberdeenshire => Topic started by: BAC3 on Saturday 23 September 17 13:38 BST (UK)
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Hello,
I can find nothing for this gentleman other than the fact he was imprisoned (long term 7 years, commuted from transportation) from 21/09/1849 to 06/08/1855 through Aberdeen, Millbank, Parkhurst and Dartmoor Prisons. His was an early discharge on licence from Dartmoor on 06/08/1855 when he stated that his destination post-discharge was Aberdeen. He apparently had two brothers, unnamed, who were frequently in prison.
Can anyone help please?
Thank you,
BAC3
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Hi ,
National Records of Scotland has a trial for James Killhowlie in 1850.
Same address as Thomas , Spring Garden Aberdeen.
ev
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This is likely the James Kilhowlie you mention, Ev - http://faceebook.eu/kilhowlie-james-0c5cf2fd3efc86c943d1196bf230ebac
From here www.opcdorset.org/PortlandFiles/PortlandCensus/1851PortlandPrison.htm, there is a mention of:
Jas. KILHOWLIE; Prisoner; Unmarried; 20; Comb Maker; Slitrim, Ireland
Monica
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For second brother, possible 1861 entry:
Patrick Kilhowlie 34 mason's lab b. Ireland
Margt Sutherland 29 wife b. Banchory Dev, Aberdeenshire
Ellen Kilhowlie 6 b. Aberdeen
Margaret Kilhowlie 2 b. Aberdeen
Address: 64 Gallowgate Rhinds Court, Aberdeen
Can't see entries for him in 1851.
Monica
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Could this be Thomas you mention in 1862?
Precognition against Thomas Queen for the crime of theft at Main Street, Gorbals, Glasgow
Accused: Thomas Queen, alias Duffy, George; Kilhooley, John; Murphy, John, Age: 25, Address: Pettigrew Street, Duke Street, Glasgow, Origin: Native of Ireland
Also,
Sentence: Thomas Queen, alias Duffy, George; Kilhooley, John; Murphy, John, Verdict: Guilty, Sentence: Penal servitude - 4 years Previous convictions: theft - Glasgow sheriff court, 15 November 1860 under the name of John Murphy.
Monica
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Hello,
Thank you for searching.
I reviewed James KILHOWLIE's records at Portland Prison, before he was transported, but no specific family names mentioned, except that they recently arrived from Ireland and have been pests (sic) ever since in Aberdeen!!!
BAC3
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The Patrick Kilhowley we have above, there are a number of family tree for him and family on a/try.
His birth place is given as Leitrim (source not given which would help as this is the birth place confirmed for James Kilhowley). Parents down as John Kilhowley and Ann Reilly. Mother Ann died in 1870 it seems. This is showing as connected to her www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=143786098 There is a corresponding entry for this on SP (Kilhooly/Reilly).
Patrick Kilhowley died in the Dundee poorhouse in 1892. I would hope this is where the parents' name came from (image not included). Wonder if there are any poor relief papers for him.
Info for mother Ann also includes:
Prison sentence for 10 days for taking 56lbs potatoes from a Logie farm
Also Known As: Devlin, McGarry, Martin
Monica
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This Patrick Kilhowlie was first married to an Ann Rouke it seems in 1846 in Old Marchar. He remarried in 1855 to Margaret Sutherland, that magic first year for Scottish cert! Likely this is the source of Leitrim for his birth place, as it only shows as Ireland in his census entries.
You might get some clues from witness names for the marriage (although James was by now in Australia and Thomas still in prison. a few months before his discharge.
Monica
Added: Patrick's registrations vary between the variants Patrick and Peter which is not unusual to see.
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I don't subscribe to the BNA, but maybe you can source this:
SHERIFF CRIMINAL COURT
... having been led, the panel’s was clearly established, and sentence was passed of imprisonment for twelve months. . Patrick Kilhowlie, labourer, was charged with assau , inasmuch as he had made a friendly call on acquaintance, named Alexander Hogg, and had ...
Wednesday 03 November 1847 - Aberdeen Press and Journal
Monica
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Good Evening Monica,
You have certainly raised quite a few possibilities for me to consider, especially with the parents. Thank you. I shall look at the Public Member Trees too. I searched ScotlandsPeople but this turned a blank. My apprehension is simply the morphic prospect of his name changing to "KILHOOLEY".
Nevertheless the exercise so far has been positive.
Thank you again,
BAC3
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From BNA
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Thanks, Isobel :) I haven't heard the word 'lathering' in such a long time!
Monica
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Thanks, Isobel :) I haven't heard the word 'lathering' in such a long time!
Monica
For second brother, possible 1861 entry:
Patrick Kilhowlie 34 mason's lab b. Ireland
Margt Sutherland 29 wife b. Banchory Dev, Aberdeenshire
Ellen Kilhowlie 6 b. Aberdeen
Margaret Kilhowlie 2 b. Aberdeen
Address: 64 Gallowgate Rhinds Court, Aberdeen
Can't see entries for him in 1851.
Monica
Margaret age 2 appears to have been registered in 1858 as Margaret Carhooly (St Nicholas, Aberdeen). Familysearch confirm parents as Patrick Carhooly and Margaret Sutherland.
Isobel
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Incidentally Monica,
I dropped a note to two "Owners" of Public Member Trees for Patrick KILHOWLIE that you mentioned..........whether or not I receive a reply probably doubtful on past experience!!
BAC3
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Familysearch/ Scotlandspeople have a birth of a James Kilhooly son of Patrick Kilhooly and Margaret Sutherland in St Nicholas in 1864. In 1881 this same James appears as James Carhooly living in Dundee.
Isobel
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From Familysearch - children of Patrick Kilhowlie (and variants)and Margaret Sutherland
Helen Kilhooly born 1856 St Nicholas
Margaret Carhooly born 1858 St Nicholas
John Kilhooly born 1861 St Nicholas
James Kilhooly born 1864 St Nicholas
William Gilhooly born 1866 Dundee
Robert Kilhoolie born 1870 Dundee
Elizabeth Kilhoolie born 1872 Dundee
Isobel
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This family are transcribed as Collie on the 1871 census living at 12 Park St, Lochee Rd, Dundee.
Isobel
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Monica and Isobel,
I have had one response via Ancestry which, unfortunately, seems to confuse the issue. Apparently the Tree "Owner" was of the opinion Patrick KILHOWLIE (and variants) had no siblings and was possibly the child of Michael and Grace who migrated from Ireland in the 1820's. However, there was "contact" with the law at some later stage!!!
Thomas KILHOWLIE is there.........somewhere ::)
Good night,
BAC3
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Thomas is somewhere for sure....to be found still ;)
Patrick though is where he should be, the son of John Kilhowlie and Ann Reilly. The person who got back to you will need to check the certs which are available for him. Others have and include the marriage image on their tree. Marriage for Patrick and Margaret (sutherland) 1855 including his place of birth:
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Patrick's death cert from 1892 below. He died in the East Poor House, Dundee. Showing as Peter Kilhooly, widower of Margaret Sutherland. Pauper, previoulsy labourer.
Tree owner is a bertram_anna
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Ann Rielly Kilhowlie's 1870 DC detail. She died at the House of Refuge in Aberdeen, with the Superintendent as informant:
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There is another family living in Aberdeen at the same time, a Michael and Grace (Cranough).
This is a trancript of this family in 1841:
Michael Kilenhain 41 weaver b. Ireland
Grace Kilenhain 40 b. Ireland
Ann Kilenhain 18
Margt Kilenhain 15
Peter Kilenhain 13
John Kilenhain 10
Address: John St, Aberdeen
They show with many more variants over the years, including Gillooly.
Connected to the family of John Kilhoolie and Ann Reilly? Could be given they seem to be the only families with that surname in Aberdeen at that time. Maybe Michael was brother to John, husband of Ann?
Can't find it now, but think that when Michael died in 1860 Aberdeen, the informant did not know the names of his parents :-\
Monica
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This is from the Dundee Courier in 1883. May be a coincidence but a number of Patrick's children were living in Park Street in 1881.
Correction - it was 1871 that Patrick, Margaret and family were in Park Street under the name Collie.
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Thank You Isobel,
A possible sighting of Thomas at last!! Sadly the article does not mention the father's name which would have been a Godsend, but with the family background, it should help, notwithstanding the name is KILHOOLIE not KILHOWLIE. No point arguing about whether an "O" should be a "W".8)
Incidentally, I have had both responses from Ancestry but neither have any information about Thomas.
Tomorrow I intend ringing NAS to ask if the Court records contain any reference to his family. I will confirm any developments.
Finally, thank you and Monica for all your efforts, I am extremely grateful. The circumstances of researching a name that is capable of so many variants creates a dozen brickwalls.
BAC3
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This is from the Dundee Courier in 1883.
This Thomas Kilhoolie/Gilhooley, tailor appears to be the son of James Kilhoolie, tailor and Margaret Ann Prior. He was born around 1845 in Co Leitrim. He married Catherine McFadyen in 1865 in Dundee.
Father James can be found in William Street, Dundee along with wife Margaret, and two daughters, in the 1881 census. They are in Blackness Road by 1891, along with a grand daughter - Helen/Ellen Gilhooly, who is one of the daughters of Thomas Kilhoolie and Catherine McFadyen. James died in 1900 in Dundee - his parents are named as Paul Gilhooley, crofter and Bridget Crayton.
Thomas looks to have moved to Leith by 1901 - he’s in Giles Street with two of his sons - Paul and Bernard, both of whom were killed in action in WW1. Catherine is still in Dundee with a couple of her daughters - in Blackness Road. There’s a possible death for Catherine in Leith in 1915 and a possible death for Thomas in 1905, but there are a surprising number of Thomas Kilhoolies of an appropriate age… ;D
Ruth
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Looks like this is not the right one as the age is way off! What a shame.
Isobel
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Thank You Ruth,
The one aspect, and possibly only aspect, that appears accurate is his name "KILHOWLIE". All the official records, especially those from different original sources, agree the spelling. But as someone has remarked that spelling is open to so many interpretations, taking account of dialects, accents etc., that I have to look beyond "KILHOWLIE". C'est la vie de la genealogie.
For the moment,
BAC3