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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Devon => Topic started by: KiwiHugh on Wednesday 04 October 17 10:00 BST (UK)
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Louisa Yalland was baptised at Charles the Martyr in 1831.Father Emanuel. Can anyone flesh out some more detail of this baptism please
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Baptised August 30 1840 but born Sept 1831.
Mother was also Louisa. Emmanuel was a mariner.
Gadget
PS - living Exeter Street, which is not far from Charles Church.
https://tinyurl.com/ybqshnpd
PS2 - I lived in Plymouth for over 20 years and drove around the roundabout, which now surrounds the remains of the church, nearly every day as I worked not far away.
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Thanks Gadget. Emmanuel's job helps explain his elusiveness.
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Very puzzling:
1841
Exeter Street, Plymouth
HO108/271/6/11/17
William Yalland, 35, painter
John, 25, painter
Eliza, 35
Alice, 30
Sarah, 25
Amelia, 20
Amelia, 10
Louisa, 9 - fits with birth in baptism entry
All born Devon
Also 1851
HO108/1878/225/45
Same Address
William, 48 painter and glazier
Mary A, wife, 46, b. Middlesex
Kate, daughter, 5
John, brother, 36, painter and glazier
Eliza, sister, 51, seamstress
Alice, sister, 45, upholsterer
Amelia, daughter, 19, seamstress
Amelia, sister to wife, 36, staymaker
Louisa, niece to wife, 18 seamstress
All others born Plymouth
Do you have any other info on the family?
Gadget
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I see that you have had some info on this family before:
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=619262.0
However I see on there that Louisa's relationship to William was given slightly wrongly on the 1851 that the member gave - she is down as niece* to wife and not niece.
Gadget
* niece to 'do' = wife from above entry
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Yes finally putting them in my tree. Would you interpret it as Amila Jnr being Alice's Daughter and Louisa being Amila Senior's daughter?
This then leads to the can of worms ; did this Louisa marry Jabez Scagell or live life as a Spinster?
We have the advantage in NZ that maintenance cases got reported in the News Papers which are now free to view at our Papers Past. Go National Library ;D
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I think it is very possible that Amelia (sister to Mary A) is Louisa's mother but ... :-\
Could you risk getting the marriage cert for Louisa and Jabez? It should give her father - or who she thought was her father. I tried to find the marriage but must have been a civil one as nothing showing in Devon parish records.
It seems like a very mixed up family and comng in to it at the end, I'd need to work it through.
Gadget
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Amelia Senior is a sister to the lot of them not a sister in law. Unless their Amelia died or married and Mary A had a sister called Amelia as well who also married a Yealand. Mind you they are most consistently Yalland. Or Mary A from Middlesex was nee Yealand.
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On the 1851, Amelia is down as 'sister to wife' - see clip.
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Are the females all Yallands? Do you have details of William's marriage to Mary A?
A real mixed up bunch :-\
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No. His 2nd marriage to Mary K does but not his first --- that I can find. ::)
What is more correct. I am spoiled for choice all Mary Ann 1841 Toms, 1843 Dyer, and 1843 Axworthy and lets not forget 1847 May just in case they were slow off the mark in getting married.
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Now I am remembering why I threw my hands up in the air and walked away from these relatives ;D
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I don't think Emmanuel the mariner was a Yalland :-X
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Which then begs the question. Who the heck was Louisa Yalland, mother of Louisa Yalland?
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She was baptised 8- 9 years after her birth. I'm wondering if there was a new vicar/curate who did some visits around the parish. Often this would produce a spate of older baptisms. He would not ask for proof of names of parents.
As I said, it might be worth getting that marriage cert to Jabez just in case :-\
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Well have narrowed it down as to which Mary Ann that William married. It is either Mary Ann Axworthy who a W.Y. did marry at Plympton St Mary in 1844 or the 1843 listing which I can not eliminate even one of the 3 possible couples.
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Do you know William's father's name?
Just relooking at the 1851 census page again - is Amelia down as 'Sister to Wife' or 'Sister to WY'
(http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=780019.0;attach=467774;image)
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Do you know William's father's name?
Assume parents were John (painter) and Sarah - have found Amelia/Emelia's baptism - Jan 1816, so the Plympton marriage is not correct as that William's father was a Benjamin.
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Thanks Gadget. Well that leaves Mary Ann Dyer in 1843.. Axworthy's seem to have been very thin on the ground in London at the turn of the century where as Mary Ann Dyer's were almost 10 a penny.
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:)
From GRO
Birth Reg:
Kate Yalland, June 1845, Plymouth, Vol 9 Page 397
Mother's maiden name ~ Dyer
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Also, to prove the second marriage to a Mary Hellyer:
From 1871 census, daughter Mary, aged 10 (see other thread)
Birth Reg:
Mary Yalland, Sept1860, Plymouth,5b, 223
Mother's maiden name ~ Hellyer
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Mary Ann nee Dyer died 1852
Burial
11 June 1852, Ford Park Cemetery, Plymouth
Mary Ann Yalland, aged 47
Section F, No 22, Row 6
Ford Park Cemetery is a very large cemetery to the west of Mutley Plain - north of the city proper and bordering Plymouth College.
PS - all the info about her points to a birth circa 1805 but I can't find any around then in St Luke Finsbury ( or St Giles Cripplegate) The nearest were in Holborn - possible but not at all sure.
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Back to Louisa ~
You have details of Louisa's marriage to Jabez Scagell. 1860 on other thread and 61 and 71 censuses in Plymouth, Charles ~
By 1881, Jabez and Louisa were in Dawlish:
Frederick Cottages, Dawlish, Devon
RG11/2157/63/14
Jabez Scadgell, 47, mason and Bricklayer, b. Plymouth
Louisa, 47
Laura, 17
Alfred, 15
Ernest, 8
Kate, 6, b. Dawlish
Frederick, 4, b. Dawlish
Mary R Ashwood, lodger, single 60, gentlewoman, b. Broseley, Shropshire
All others b. Plymouth
(For confirmation : Laura Louisa Scagell, birth reg. Sep q, 1863, Plymouth. Mother's maiden name - Yalland)
Louisa died 1884 - Deathe reg:
Louisa Scadgell, 49, Sep Q, 1884, Newton Abbot, v5b p 77
(Age a bit out but she was older than Jabez, so ....... )
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Thanks again. Have been tracking the Scagell children of Ernest. 3 went to USA but they have since become extinct. Have yet to find the youngest of Ernests, Dorothy Violet, born in 1922 after Ernest had passed on. From the 7 children there appears to be only two in the next generation via John who was born 1917.
OPPS Must be getting tired .Muddling my generations 3 of Jabez's children went to USA. Ernest who lived in Lewisham had 7 children and looks like only two surviving grandchildren.