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Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Wales => Flintshire => Topic started by: Jane Lucas on Tuesday 10 October 17 11:08 BST (UK)
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Can anyone identify this place please? It is written in the Northop, Flintshire Parish Register for baptisms as the father's Parish. I've tried various permutations and googled them but nothing quite seems to fit. It looks like 'Llanrhud' to me, except that the h doesn't have a loop, which the certain h elsewhere on the register do have. There is a Llayrhydd in Denbighshire, but that doesn't seem quite right.
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Sorry, I can't post the image however I try!
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Does the word appear anywhere else in the register that you can see?
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Hmmm looks like an "o" at the end but is there another letter(s) under the thick black line :-\
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It's definitely Llanrhudd and would be pronounced the same as Llanrhydd:
http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/DEN/Llanrhydd
see also :
http://www.coflein.gov.uk/en/site/27420/details/llanrhudd-hallllanrhydd-hall
http://map.coflein.gov.uk/index.php?action=do_details&numlink=27420
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OK, thanks gadget. I guess I'll go with that. I agree millipede, it does look like an o at the end, but it's probably the bend in the page. There weren't any other same name places. I looked over several pages.
So, that's in Denbighshire, which isn't too far from Northop. I'll look for the father in Llanrhud/Llanrhydd then. Thank you.
I do find identify places in Wales, and which church or chapel even more difficult, even when I find a Register entry!
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My 2 x great grandmother's sister lived there before she died and I think it was spelled Llanrhudd then.
Gadget
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Do you know where Pen y Park is? That is the parents residence. I assumed it was Northop because I thought that is where the chapel is. But in fact it is the Calvanistic Methodist Chapel of Rhosemor (near Northop). Although the mother's Parish is Northop, Pen y Park could be somewhere else.
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The only Pen y Park/Parc that I know of is in Chirk parish, Denbighshire - a considerable number of my family lived in that area. There was a Methodist Chapel there - my paternal great grandfather was a preacher there .
There could be another one. It means head of the field/park or park head.
what were the names and dates?
Gadget
(changed my avatar to my lovely grandmother :D )
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Parents Robert & Ellin Ellis (née Griffith) residence Pen y Park. His Parish Llanrhud. Hers, Northop. their daughter (plus 2 later ones) is born June 14 1810 Northop and bapt. June 27 1810 at Rhosemor Chapel Northop. This is a Calvanistic Methodist chapel. So the Pen y Park bit is a mystery. The record is on FindMyPast.
The parents marriage place is indexed as Connah's Quay in FindMyPast, but the marriage Register says they are both of the Parish of Northrop. The marriage was in 1807. Confusing!
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Sorry.. daughter's name Mary Ellis
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Hi Jane
I'll do some looking this evening - off to a class now.
Maybe Roger/despair might be able to help you. Can you PM him to alert him to this thread.
Gadget
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Thanks Will do.
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I can find a Pen Y Park in Northop in census data,as well as a Pen y Park farm(Caerfallwch)so it may be a property rather than a district.With such a generic name there are probably many such around.I'll see if I can find the Northop one on an old map.
Regards
Roger
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I think the one you want is Pen y Parc in the middle of this map,close to Midlist Farm.
http://maps.nls.uk/view/102342357
Regards
Roger
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OK, thanks gadget. I guess I'll go with that. I agree millipede, it does look like an o at the end, but it's probably the bend in the page.
No, it's not an O at the end, it's a curly D, different from the one before it, but often used at the end of a word. So yes, it is Llanrhudd. The Pen-y-parc found by Despair is shown on that map in Caerfallwch parish, so that is confirmed.
The only Llanrhydd I can trace is just SE of Ruthin.
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I think the one you want is Pen y Parc in the middle of this map,close to Midlist Farm.
http://maps.nls.uk/view/102342357
Regards
Roger
Glad you were able to help, Roger. I had to dash. I knew you'd find it :)
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Anything but patronymics...
Regards
Roger
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Do you know where Pen y Park is? That is the parents residence. I assumed it was Northop because I thought that is where the chapel is. But in fact it is the Calvanistic Methodist Chapel of Rhosemor (near Northop). Although the mother's Parish is Northop, Pen y Park could be somewhere else.
Rhosesmor used to be in Northop parish (it isn't now)
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Do you know where Pen y Park is? That is the parents residence. I assumed it was Northop because I thought that is where the chapel is. But in fact it is the Calvanistic Methodist Chapel of Rhosemor (near Northop). Although the mother's Parish is Northop, Pen y Park could be somewhere else.
Rhosesmor used to be in Northop parish (it isn't now)
And so did Connah's Quay! It was a huge parish
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Thank you all... that makes sense. It might even have been the Pen y Park Farm which is now a fun park I think. Ellin or Eleanor Griffith was born Caerfallwch and gives her parish before marriage as Northrop. Good.
I have quite a few 'old' Lancashire families who used patronymic names.. what a headache!
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Thanks Chris.. I thought that.. it's the only way all the baptism and marriage entries make sense.
Rhosesmor used to be in Northop parish (it isn't now)
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And so did Connah's Quay! It was a huge parish
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I wondered why there used to be a "Northop Magistrates Court" in a village of less than 1000 when there were perfectly good courts 3 miles north and south at Flint and Mold. In fact they met at Connah's Quay which was carved off Northop in 1896 to form its own UDC.
Connah's Quay now has a population of 17000 so it's as well it was hived off. These south Flintshire parishes used to be huge - Hawarden was another, only a village but the population of 20000 odd included Queensferry Shotton Saltney Broughton and half of Buckley.
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Thanks. It takes a bit of getting your head round. I am used to searching records in small villages where people pretty much stayed put for 300 or 400 hundred years. There was one Anglican Church until mid 19th century when a couple more were added and the odd methodist chapel appeared. I know exactly where to look! Whereas in Wales, which I've pretty much just started, there are a bewildering numbering of options, especially within the non conformist chapels/churches. Finding them and any surviving records is proving a challenge. Still, very good for learning the ropes.
And very good to meet all you very knowledgeable people in this community.