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Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Wales => Flintshire => Topic started by: plimmerian on Tuesday 17 October 17 18:19 BST (UK)

Title: born Fliintshire - died Cheshire
Post by: plimmerian on Tuesday 17 October 17 18:19 BST (UK)
My friend is asking for help trying to track his ancestor:

Emma Richardson
Age 48
Burial Date 14 Mar 1888
Burial Place Knutsford, Cheshire, England

In 1881
she is aged 40
Wife of  William Richardson (bricklayer)
born   Buckley, Flintshire, Wales
Living in Ollerton, Cheshire, England

In 1871
She is aged 29
Wife of William Richardson
born   Hawarden, Flintshire, Wales
living in Over Peover, Cheshire, England

Marriage banns of 1863 in Hawarden, Flintshire, Wales have been located of William Richardson (of Over Peover, Cheshire) to Emma Ball (of this parish) - marriage date as 22nd Sept 1863!

Is the "Emma Bell" in 1861 aged 21 and a servant
born   Buckley Mouintain, Flintshire, Wales
living in Over Peover, Cheshire,  England
our "Emma Ball" ?

He can't locate her in either 1851 or 1841 in Wales, would she be there then?!
Title: Re: born Fliintshire - died Cheshire
Post by: CaroleW on Tuesday 17 October 17 18:32 BST (UK)
Any children showing on the 1871 entry?  Have you looked for a birth reg and checked mmn on the GRO website?

https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/indexes_search.asp

What was her fathers name/occ on the 1863 marriage cert?

Any birth reg for her on freebmd?
Title: Re: born Fliintshire - died Cheshire
Post by: sgf28 on Tuesday 17 October 17 18:38 BST (UK)
Marriage details:

22nd September 1863 Hawarden

William Richardson, 21, bachelor, bricklayer. Father: Joseph Richardson, gamekeeper
Emma Ball, 22, spinster, Pentrobin. Father:Thomas Ball, miner

Witnesses: David Ball,Mary Tudor?
Title: Re: born Fliintshire - died Cheshire
Post by: sgf28 on Tuesday 17 October 17 18:59 BST (UK)
Could this be Emma on 1851 Census :-\

Terrace Buildings, Stoke upon Trent, Staffordshire

Thomas Ball, born 1811, Buckley Flintshire, miner
Jane Ball, born 1807,Stone, Staffs
Samuel Buxton, wife's son, born 1833, Fenton, Staffs
Nathaniel Ball, born 1835, Long Fenton
Joseph ball, born 1835,Fenton, Staffs
David ball, born  1844,Fenton, Staffs
John Ball, born 1846,Fenton, Staffs
Isiah Ball, born 1851,Fenton
Hannah Ball, born 1837, Longton
Emma Ball, born 1843, Longton
Jane Ball, born 1848, Fenton
Title: Re: born Fliintshire - died Cheshire
Post by: plimmerian on Tuesday 17 October 17 19:04 BST (UK)
thank you so much for the marriage details

I can't find an Emma Ball birth under Great Boughton

And this is the only Thomas Ball in 1841 I can match in Wales:
NAME:   Thomas Ball (a collier)
AGE:   60
ESTIMATED BIRTH YEAR:   1781
GENDER:   Male
WHERE BORN:   Flintshire, Wales
CIVIL PARISH:   Hawarden
HUNDRED:   Mold
COUNTY/ISLAND:   Flintshire
COUNTRY:   Wales
REGISTRATION DISTRICT:   Great Boughton
SUB-REGISTRATION DISTRICT:   Hawarden
living with Hannah Ball 60 & Joseph Ball 20

Is Thomas her grandfather I wonder ?

(William's father's details are a match)

Tried finding a baptism too but nothing fits well either for Emma!

 :-\
Title: Re: born Fliintshire - died Cheshire
Post by: plimmerian on Tuesday 17 October 17 19:10 BST (UK)
Emma's 1st child was Jane and 2nd child was Hannah (William's mother was a Hannah)

Emma's first male child was William and then Joseph, followed by a Thomas then Henry!

I'll check Staffordshire births now then lol -  thanks ;-)
Title: Re: born Fliintshire - died Cheshire
Post by: plimmerian on Tuesday 17 October 17 19:12 BST (UK)
Staffordshire baptism:

Name   Emma Ball
Event Type   Baptism
Event Date   27 Mar 1842
Event Place   Longton, Staffordshire, England, United Kingdom
Parish   St John
Father's Name   Thos Ball
Mother's Name   Jane Ball

confused dot comical lol
Title: Re: born Fliintshire - died Cheshire
Post by: sgf28 on Tuesday 17 October 17 19:14 BST (UK)
Thomas and Jane's marriage:

17 May 1835
Stoke on Trent, St Peter Ad Vincula, Stoke on Trent

Thomas Ball, bachelor
Jane Buxton, widow

Witnesses:Samuel Townsend and Thomas Lake

Thomas and Jane signed with x
Title: Re: born Fliintshire - died Cheshire
Post by: plimmerian on Tuesday 17 October 17 21:19 BST (UK)
thanks for all the help - just a bit confusing - he'll have to take down the Flintshire flag now for Emma Ball and put a Staffordshire flag in it's place!  ;)
Title: Re: born Fliintshire - died Cheshire
Post by: dcbnwh on Wednesday 18 October 17 11:13 BST (UK)
1841 Census Lane Ends Buckley, Flintshire:
Thomas Ball 30 1811 Flintshire
Jane Ball 30 1811
Nathaniel Ball 6 1835
Hannah Ball 4 1837
Joseph Ball 1 1840 Flintshire
Samuel Buxton 8 1833

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M77R-L5G

Re Thomas and Jane Buxton.

The GRO references for the childrens' births give the mother's maiden name as Green. I can't find a GRO for Emma, although there is one in Lambeth.

I think this is her first marriage - Jane Green and Samuel Buxton, banksman, on 9th December 1827 at Stoke  upon Trent.

I can't find a baptism for their son, Samuel, but there is one for Johanna, of Lane Delph, in Longton on 28th September 1828 and buried on 15th February 1829

Also a burial for Samuel, born 1805, of Lane Delph, on 9th October 1832.

Samuel Buxton, b 1833, may have married twice, both son of Samuel:
8th September 1855 to Ellen Bradbury at Stoke on Trent, St Peter Ad Vincula
16th January 1870, a widower, to Mary Hampson at Longton, St John

David
Title: Re: born Fliintshire - died Cheshire
Post by: dcbnwh on Wednesday 18 October 17 11:40 BST (UK)
Joseph Ball was born on 16th September 1839 baptised in Hawarden on 2nd October. Parents given as Thomas Ball, collier, and Jane of Ewloe. It actually gives the mother's maiden name as Green.

It seems as thought Emma may have been born there also but moved away before the baptism.

David
Title: Re: born Fliintshire - died Cheshire
Post by: plimmerian on Wednesday 18 October 17 12:12 BST (UK)
this entry confuses me now - I'm confused as to which Emma is the real Emma Ball  :-\

BALL, EMMA       (mother: TAYLOR)     
GRO Reference: 1842  S Quarter in STOKE UPON TRENT  Volume 17  Page 162

or these:
BALL, EMMA       (mother: GREEN)
GRO Reference: 1841  D Quarter in LAMBETH  Volume 04  Page 220

BALL, EMMA       (mother:JONES)
GRO Reference: 1842  M Quarter in HOLYWELL  Volume 27  Page 266

 :-\

her brothers:
BALL, DAVID       (mother: GREEN)
GRO Reference: 1844  J Quarter in STOKE UPON TRENT  Volume 17  Page 180

BALL, JOHN       (mother: GREEN)
GRO Reference: 1846  S Quarter in STOKE UPON TRENT  Volume 17  Page 141

and sister:
BALL, JANE       (mother: GREEN)
GRO Reference: 1848  J Quarter in STOKE UPON TRENT  Volume 17  Page 166   

and finally:
BALL, J.  G. SEW ISAIAH   (mother: GREEN)
GRO Reference: 1850  S Quarter in STOKE UPON TRENT  Volume 17  Page 151
Title: Re: born Fliintshire - died Cheshire
Post by: plimmerian on Wednesday 18 October 17 12:48 BST (UK)
just a thank you for all the extra info ! ;D