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Research in Other Countries => United States of America => US Lookup Requests => Topic started by: Cockneyrebel on Thursday 16 November 17 09:33 GMT (UK)
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The above was the son of George William and Ann or Annie Butler. On 21 Apr 1892, George, Annie, Frederick Geo and his brother Wilfred Henry went to Quebec, Canada arriving there 2 May 1892 but I can find no record of their return even though they're on the 1901 census in England except for Wilfred. His sister, Dora Elizabeth was b 29 Apr 1897 in Texas but passed over in the UK.
There is a Frederick George shown 12 Sep 1918 in Philadelphia in the US WW! Draft records and wonder if this is him? Later censuses appear to show that he was born in Philadelphia?
Am I barking up the wrong tree?
Cr
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Later census seem to show Frederick George Warriner was born in Colorado. Although census do say parents born England.
1920 census - https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:33SQ-GRXW-QPK?i=1&cc=1488411
1930 census - https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:33SQ-GR4H-VS4?i=5&cc=1810731
1940 census - https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-89MR-Z99Y-V?i=34&cc=2000219
WW1 Draft - https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:33S7-L1VS-D3M?i=2093&cc=1968530
WW2 Draft - https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-C9B1-S97F-4 (29 Sept 1890 ???)
Marriage of daughter - Elizabeth Cecelia Warriner 26 February 1943 - Harrisburg, Dauphin, Pennsylvania,
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:VF9B-SMT
Doesn't seem to be your man if he was born in Colorado.
Sandra
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U.S., Social Security Applications and Claims Index, 1936-2007 - Frederick G Warriner - 29 September 1887 - Denver Colorado - passed away 9 July 1950 - parents - Frederick G Warrine (as transcribed) and Mother Anna.
Sandra
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Wife Bessie nee Curtis Warriner born 11 August 1896 passed away 8 May 1947 - parents Peter Curtis and Julia Curtis both born Ireland. Informant Fred G Warriner.
FIND A GRAVE
Mount Olivet Cemetery - Wheat Ridge, Jefferson County, Colorado.
https://old.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=148959814
and Fredrick "Fred" Warriner
Headstone Inscription shows 1888 - 1950
https://old.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=148959871
Bessie Warriner 1896 - 8 May 1947
Sandra
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There is also this one - 4th Street Philadelphia Ward 33, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania in 1920
Frederich G Warriner 34 Born Eng. Imm 1910. Age at first marriage 54 years.
Mary Warriner 36 Born Eng. Imm 1910. Age at first marriage 44 years. ???
Cyril T Warriner 13 Born Eng.
Frederich G Warriner 5 Born PA.
Letitia Warriner 1 Born PA.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:33S7-9RXJ-4WJ?i=13&cc=1488411
Looks like Mary remarried and was living in NJ in 1930 - Greenwich, Gloucester, New Jersey.
Albert Edward Falheur 55 Born Germany.
Mary Falheur 46 Born Eng.
Letitia Warrener 11 Born PA. Parents Eng.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:33S7-9RCD-33F?i=45&cc=1810731
Sandra
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Cyril Frederick Warriner was born in England.
Cyril Frederick Warriner - Maiden surname - Machen
GRO Reference: 1906 S Quarter in YORK Volume 09D Page 56
A Mary Machen married at York - Registered June 1906 - 9d81 - Frederick George Warriner.
Sandra
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So Sandra you're saying that he isn't the one that went to the USA as other Ancestry trees would have it?
Thank you for your help.
Cr
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Mary Warriner 26 year from Bishophill York and Cyril Warriner 4 years on New York passenger List - 7 October 1910 - Liverpool to New York on the Mauretania - Mary's aged incorrect at 36 years -
Father George Machen - 61 Garden Street Groves York - going to Philadelphia PA.
Both Mary and Cyril have naturalization markings on the passenger manifest.
Mary - looks like 12-5-1941 and Cyril 3-12-1941
Sandra
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So Sandra you're saying that he isn't the one that went to the USA as other Ancestry trees would have it?
Thank you for your help.
Cr
The first chap may not be but the second chap in reply 4 could be correct. ??? You need to read the whole thread - not just bits.
Sandra
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Frederick Warriner born 1883 York appears on New York Passenger List - 17 June 1910 - Liverpool to New York on the Mauretania. Motor Engineer - wife Mrs M Warriner - 41 Markham Street York. Had been in Denver Colorado 1892 - 1904 - father Geo W Warriner - Larimer Denver Colorado
Had bird tattoed on back of hand. Final destination NYC
Sandra
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There is a UK return passenger list showing Fred Warriner aged 12 years and Dora aged 2 departed New York and arriving Liverpool 12 May 1900 on the Lucania.
Sandra
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Excellent research, once again Sandra, I found the family plus 2 on the 1920 US census, still trying to find them later.
Cr
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The one:
'Later census seem to show Frederick George Warriner was born in Colorado. Although census do say parents born England,' is the Ancestry tree owner's one and has a different set of children as you point out from 1920 onwards. These are presumably the ones from the 1918 WW1 draft document.
Cr
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Looking again - I've found a Pennylsvania Passenger and Crew List - 4 June 1922 on the Haverford - with George William Warriner born York Eng - aged 58 years, retired and Anna Warriner aged 58 years - daughter E J Vipond - 7 Edinburgh Terrace - Acomb. York. Had been in USA 1892 - 8 years - Denver Colorado - son was Frederick George Warriner - 4051 N 9th Street Philadelphia PA.
Same address as on the WW1 draft for Fred who married Bessie
Sandra
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UK Incoming Passenger List for Geo William Warriner - born 1864 and aged 59 years - Philadelphia to Liverpool on the Haverford - arriving 23 August 1923 - Annie Warriner aged 60 years also travelled. Both going to 10 Dodgson Terrace. Acomb York.
Sandra
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UK Incoming Passenger List - Fredk Warriner aged 10 years - New York to Liverpool - arriving 17 June 1896 - on the Campania - also Geo W Warriner aged 32 years and Mrs Warriner aged 33 years.
Sandra
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The son Edwin J Warriner 8 December 1918 - 9 November 2010 -
FIND A GRAVE
BURIAL - Fort Logan National Cemetery Denver, Denver County, Colorado.
https://old.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=72599652
Listed US Obituary Collection - Residence Place Lakewood, California. Rocky Mountain News - 14 Nov 2010 - spouse Eleanor Louise Crosswhite passed away 9 September 2000 Colorado. Last residence - Last Residence: 80110 Englewood, Arapahoe, Colorado.
Eleanor listed daily times obituary index - Sheridan Colorado -
https://old.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=25609482
Sandra
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Obituary Edwin J Warriner - Age 91, of Lakewood. Preceded in death by his wife Eleanor...........etc etc
http://www.legacy.com/obituaries/denverpost/obituary.aspx?page=lifestory&pid=146574017
Published in Denver Post on Nov. 14, 2010
Sandra
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FIND A GRAVE
David F Warriner - 11 August 1921 - 25 September 2002 -
Fort Logan National Cemetery Denver, Denver County, Colorado.
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/36121748
Sandra
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It seems to me Sandra, that Frederick had 2 families, the dob recorded on the US draft cards show the same day and month but different years, presumably hiding the truth in the 2nd one? When his son Cyril married in 1925 his mother recorded that Frederick was missing and hadn't seen his son for 4 years. Seems as though Frederick had started a new family by then. Wonder if he married Bessie and where was he in 1930?
Cr
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The occupations were similar on the 1920 census were'nt they.
1920 4th Street Philadelphia Ward 33, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania.
Frederich G Warriner 34 Born Eng. Manager Automobile Shop. Imm 1910. Married Alien.
Mary Warriner 36 Born Eng. Imm 1910. Alien.
Cyril T Warriner 13 Born Eng. (deceased 1 June 1961 - divorced)
Frederich G Warriner 5 Born PA.
Letitia Warriner 1 Born PA.
https://beta.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:MXSF-3FR
Son - Frederick G Warriner was aged 5 years on that census. US WW11 Draft gave 26 July 1914 -
U.S., Social Security Applications and Claims Index, 1936-2007 - Frederick G Warner -
Frederick G Warriner - 26 July 1912 - passed away 1 March 1999 - parents - Frederick G Warner
Mother Mary Machen. Married Evelyn Kelly in 1947 Philadelphia. Marriage License Number: 845249.
Ninth Street Philadelphia Ward 43, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania 1920
Frederick Warriner 34 Born Colorado. Machinist. Garage.
Elizabeth Warriner 23 Born PA.
Edwin Warriner 1 Born PA
Peter L Curtis 22 Born PA. Brother-in-law.
Edwin was Edwin Joseph Warriner - born 8 December 1919 -
Notice both families have youngsters aged 1 year on those 1920 census. Letitia and Edwin - strange - because if we believe that this is the same guy with 2 families - the 1930 census says first married at aged 30 years - so about 1915 ???
Bradburn Ave Westminster, Adams, Colorado 1930 census.
Fredrick S Warrner 44 First marrried at 30 years. Machinist. Automobile.
Bessie Warrner 33 First married aged 20 years.
Edwin David Warrner 10 Born PA
David Warrner 8 Born PA
Bettie Warrner 4 Born PA
Sandra
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Hello Sandra, it seems very odd that his jobs are so similar and that he appeared on 2 1920 censuses-was that possible in those days-could he have been recorded there but absent
in reality? The fact that Mary said he was missing for 4 years prior to 1925 might have been the tip of the iceberg, perhaps he was missing before 1920 from her family home?
It'd be interesting to find the marriage cert for him and Bessie?
Cr
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When his son Cyril married in 1925 his mother recorded that Frederick was missing and hadn't seen his son for 4 years.
Cr
Haven' t seen the marriage certificate for Cyril - is that where you got this info from ???
Sandra
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Hi Sandra, I found it when I was researching further on ancestry, something to do with Cyril being only 18, I'll attach it by pm.
Cr
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So this is a consent form off someone's ancestry tree ?
Sandra
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I can't remember where I acquired it but there are no trees that show him that I can find they've got the other family with Bessie as mother. There is a cert on FindMyPast that says they were married with license of the Orphans Court-wonder if that's for Cyril? It's numbered 517556. There is also on FindMyPast a hand written cert, father's address unknown!
Cr ???
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It's on FindMyPast Sandra-Mary's consent form for Cyril's marriage stating his father being missing for 4 years.
Cr
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Family search just have the marriage indexed - no cert.
Sandra
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Yes I know I looked there too but FindMyPast have both consent forms and the application for a license.
It seems to say that Mary wasn't supported for 4 years as George was 'missing.'
Cr
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Nice to be able to prove and clarify that Frederick was involved with both those families.
Sandra
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Sandra, do you think we've proved that Frederick G was involved with both families? There doesn't seem to be a marriage record for him and Bessie Curtis?
Cr
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Hi Sandra,
Looking again at what you found, where did you find 'Looking again - I've found a Pennylsvania Passenger and Crew List - 4 June 1922 on the Haverford - with George William Warriner born York Eng - aged 58 years, retired and Anna Warriner aged 58 years - daughter E J Vipond - 7 Edinburgh Terrace - Acomb. York. Had been in USA 1892 - 8 years - Denver Colorado - son was Frederick George Warriner - 4051 N 9th Street Philadelphia PA.
Same address as on the WW1 draft for Fred who married Bessie'
I found the report on Ancestry but it didn't say who they were visiting? I wonder if his parents knew of his double life?
There is one tree on Ancestry that shows Frederick and Bessie but not Mary. I've written to the owner but they've not replied-I was hoping as the tree is named Warriner that they might be related and have some knowledge?
Cr
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Index Card 1922 : https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:KF6S-NYB
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George & Annie appear on lines 13 & 13. This is a 2 page record. Use arrow to advance to next image (600)
Passenger List 1922: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:K6MQ-T4C
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Superb Sandra, I didn't realise that there was a 2nd page! Is it the same on all the shipping records for people travelling and emigrating or is it just on the Pennsylvania ones?
Cr
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The second pages are not specific to Philadelphia. The earlier passenger lists to the US don't have a 2nd page. I'm not sure exactly when they started having 2nd pages, but it was some time in the early 20th century.
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Hi shellyesq I'll have to look more carefully next time I get one of those appear.
Cr
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;D ;D pleased you got sorted John.
Regards
Sandra :)
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Thank you for all your help, Sandra, just need that A tree owner to confirm our suspicions!
Cr