RootsChat.Com
General => Armed Forces => World War One => Topic started by: DavidJP on Thursday 16 November 17 23:32 GMT (UK)
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Hi all,
I am somewhat confused at present & not at all sure that I have got the right chap that I thought that I had! I need fresh eyes to take a look for me please.
Allow me to explain. The Chap in question Frederick Manson appears on a website linked from a thread that I looked at here: http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=782631.0
His entry on the website in question is here: http://ww1hull.org.uk/index.php/streets-people-came-from/search-for-people-who-died/LIVERPOOLSTREET/4553-manson
The problem is that the Frederick Manson that they have him down as, cannot be correct! The reasons for my saying this are as follows:
In a newspaper article (The Hull Daily Mail) of January 27th 1917 a report of his fathers (Frankland/Franklin Manson) funeral appears & states the following:
"All the sons (3) are with the colours. One in the Field Artillery, one in the infantry (at present in France), and the other in the Navy. This last one has recently been home on leave after serving in the Mediterranean for many months"
The one in the field artillery was Frederick's brother John Frankland Manson & the one in the infantry was his other brother Charles Manson (known as G Charles on WW1 records), he sadly died whilst on active service on 8th Sept 1917. That leaves the last one being in the Navy & that is Frederick!
Frederick Manson (1895-1962) number K 21467 joined the Navy on 16th December 1913 leaving in early 1929. The reason that he had 'recently been home on leave' was that he had got married to Lily Hayton in early 1917. He & Lily had four children & Frederick died in 1962.
On his Naval records he is shown as a joiner/joiners apprentice. In 1911 he is shown as an apprentice wheelwright & joiner at Leconfield nr Beverley in Yorkshire.
Frederick Manson was the son of Frankland/Franklin & Jane Manson (Nee' Spink)
Have I made a monumental cockup or has the website made a mistake? If so what should I do about it? I have not come across this before & the last thing that I want to do is cause offence/upset to anyone as regards the website.
My thanks for reading this & for any & all assistance given.
Many thanks in advance.
Kind regards
David
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David when you look at the CWGC site there is very little information on the F Manson who died. I think there has been an assumption made.
We don't know from there if F is for Frederick or not. Is there a fourth son with the initial F? If not then I would have a look to see if you can find any further information on F Manson to back your claim and present it to the website. I will check the register of soldiers effects to see if there are any clues there.
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I agree with NJ - have you confirmed that the date of birth given on the Naval records for Frederick Manson is the same as your Frederick?
From CWGC - no name or date of birth given.
MANSON, F
Service Number 28442
Died 13/04/1917
8th Bn.
East Yorkshire Regiment
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It would be interesting to know if the man is recorded as F Manson on the War Memorial or Frederick.
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Back again. The register says M and sole legatee Catherine. I presume the M stands for mother.
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H Nanna52,
David when you look at the CWGC site there is very little information on the F Manson who died. I think there has been an assumption made.
We don't know from there if F is for Frederick or not.
I would tend to agree with you that an assumption has been made. As you say the CWGC entry doesn't have much info, just F for the first name & no age given.
Is there a fourth son with the initial F?
There was a fourth son Frankland Manson but he was born & died in March Qtr 1886.
The number of children for Frankland/Franklin & Jane on the website is also wrong, they say 10, they actually had 12.
Many thanks for checking the soldiers effects register, much appreciated.
Kind regards
David
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So that doesn't fit with the name of his mother - Jane. Also if it was your Frederick, then surely the sole legatee would be his wife, Lilly?
Wrong person!
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Hi Nanna52,
Back again. The register says M and sole legatee Catherine. I presume the M stands for mother.
Many thanks for that, much appreciated.
I would tend to agree that the M probably stands for mother.
My thanks again.
Kind regards
David
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Hi Jan,
I'm glad its not just me that thinks its the wrong Frederick! Had me scrambling, checking my research though! ;D
Kind regards
David
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The man who died was also called Frederick Manson - his records are on FindMyPast. His address was 7 Brunswick Avenue and his mother Catherine, some of his siblings are also listed. He enlisted June 18th 1915 in Hull.
Here he is in 1901
RG13; Piece: 4477; Folio: 108; Page: 20
Alexander Manson 41
Catherine Manson 35
Benjamin Manson 16
Alexander M Manson 14
Christiania H Manson 12
William Manson 10
James M Manson 8
Eliza B Manson 6
Frederick Manson 3
John M Manson 11/12
The address of this family in 1911 is 7 Brunswick Ave - so I think that is enough proof for you to send to the owner of the website to say that he has the wrong family.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X7TS-XSR
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Well done groom finding that. I have been looking at the website and I have the impression that the owner would appreciate corrections. There has been a lot of hard work put into it.
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Hi Jan & Nanna52,
Many thanks for your replies & info, much appreciated.
Jan, many thanks for that 1901 info, that's brilliant. Although the address on the website is Liverpool Street, Hull there is a secondary address listed & that is Brunswick Ave, Hull, which matches the 1901 census address for the Manson family that you have found.
Nanna52, thanks for that, that's good to know, I'll get everything together & let them know.
Just to finish things up I read the Hull Daily News article mentioned in my OP again today & the name of one of the mourners caught my eye, he being 'Stoker Manson'. Frederick in his Naval records was a Stoker 1st class at the time of his father's funeral.
I think that we can call this one completed now. My thanks to all who have assisted with this, very much appreciated indeed.
Kind regards
David
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Hi David JP, Frederick Manson was my Nana's brother. Jan's post is correct. The family had 5 sons serving. Ben - navy, Alex - navy, James - navy, William - army and Fred - army. Fred was killed in action during the battle of Arras on Friday 13th April 1917 aged 19.
I have a few photos of him with his battalion. If I can help with anything else please post it.
Thanks
Metsy
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Hi Metsy and welcome to RootsChat, David hasn't been active on RootsChat since April. When you have made one more post you will be able to send him a personal message, you can do this by clicking on the icon beneath his name.
Carol
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The addresses listed as Brunswick avenue and Liverpool st are one and the same: Liverpool st had many small avenues one of which was called Brunswick.
Thanks for the tip Carol
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Hi katieleah,
My apologies for my non response until now. The major reason being that my PC died on me which left me offline for quite some time. Was unable to do anything about it until fairly recently due to financial constraints. Even now I'm only using a laptop but it is better than nothing!
Its great to hear from you. Thanks for getting in touch re your Frederick Manson, much appreciated. As can be seen from the thread our Frederick Manson's are clearly two different men.
My apologies again for the delayed response.
Best wishes & kind regards
David