RootsChat.Com
Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Antrim => Topic started by: mrs bongo on Wednesday 22 November 17 14:37 GMT (UK)
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hi
i hope im on the right page looking for info on mary hope family from nothern ireland she was born in 1920 she married phillp david in 1939 /1940 in newery catherdrail but we are not sure please can you hope
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Are you looking for her parentage?
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hi any imfo please would be a bonus
kind regards
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No marriage in Northern Ireland for a Hope with that Christian name 1937-1951.
Does her death certificate give a date of birth, parents or other details? or have you not gotten her death certificate yet?
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mary hope born 1920 northern ireland i was told
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1920 is too recent for the birth to be online. You will find births up to 1921 for Northern Ireland counties in the civil registration index but there are only 5 Mary Hope births listed in all Ireland for 1920s- none in Northern Ireland.
When and where did she die and do you have the death certificate?
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Someone called Philip Davies married a Mary Green on 27 July 1940, GRONI shows the marriage registered in Newry & Mourne district. Was the maiden name for your Mary definitely Hope?
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Surname given in opening post is David. Where are you getting your info from re this couple?
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If the folk concerned are the same as those mentioned in your previous topic (below), can you confirm if they are deceased?
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=782976.msg6375925#msg6375925
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In your other post you refer to the surname being Davis. What is your connection to these people as you say Philip was born in Wales.
The daughter mentioned in your other post was born 1951 so is probably still alive.
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hi all
the daughter was married to my cousin both her parents are dead
kind regards
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If the daughter married your cousin and either are still alive they should be able to clarify the daughters maiden name - David/Davis/Davies?
Also - if the parents married in 1939 and the daughter was born 1951 there are presumably other children born before that date
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im sorry she divorce my cousin i was young at the time family dosnt talk now and yes she alive
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Her name will need to be removed from your other post as Rootschat has a no living persons policy. Given the uncertainty about her maiden name and the replies re: availability of records I think you may need to clarify those issues first
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mrs bongo, you didn't address my query at reply #6, is the surname 'Green' instead of 'Hope' a sticking point?
I ask, because there are several aspects to the GRONI marriage I identified that otherwise 'resonate', including the fact that it took place in Newry Cathedral, that the 'Green' bride was born in Northern Ireland in 1920 and that there is an apparent and very probable Welsh linkage on the groom's side.
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hi
im trying to get in touch with daughter to check it out
thank you gaffy
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hi carol w
thank you for reply regarding mary and her husband both have passed away the only one alive is the daughter of whom is trying to find out more about her parents family kind regards
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So if the daughter is in touch with you she can confirm her mother’s maiden name and also the spelling of her own maiden name
She should also be able to tell you when her oldest sibling was born as there is a big gap between 1939 and 1951
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hi carol
just found out that it was mary bridget what a mistake by daughter
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In your other post you refer to the surname being Davis. What is your connection to these people as you say Philip was born in Wales.
The daughter mentioned in your other post was born 1951 so is probably still alive.
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yes carol daughter alive put mary and phillp parents passed away i sorry . mary last name is bridget not hope
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yes carol daughter alive put mary and phillp parents passed away i sorry . mary last name is bridget not hope
mrs bongo, the marriage I mentioned was for a Mary Bridget Green, can you confirm, is this a possibility?
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hi gaffy
the daughter said mary bridget there was no green mentioned so i dont know im sorry to mess you all about
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Bridget is not usually a surname. I think you need to go back to the daughter as she should have a copy of her own birth certificate showing her parents names and her mothers maiden surname.
If her parents are now deceased then their ages and possibly their full birthdates should be on their respective death certs
We are now on page 3 of this post and still don’t have all necessary info
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im so sorry about this kind regards i wish i never started this for the family
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It's always difficult getting info when you are trying to research for others.
This is just a suggestion but may help. Does the daughter have internet access? If so - perhaps giving her the link to this thread may help her to understand the information we need from her and take some of the strain off you.
What do you think?
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that a good idea carol
kind regards
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hi carol sent you a personal message
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Hi
I have just replied and am posting info as promised
It would appear that Mary had a brother who was born in Wales. I have just looked up his birth reg and his mothers maiden name was Green.
It looks like the marriage found by Gaffy (see reply 6) is the right one
EDIT - another pm received and I have asked for further info on brother as above birth may be incorrect
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I have finally managed to confirm that the birth registration in 1941 is the right one.
Philip P W Davies mmn Green
Philip Patrick William Davies died 19.4.2014 in Birmingham
So surname is Davies - not David or Davis and mmn is not Hope.
Over to you Gaffy re the marriage you found
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thank you all for your help
kind regards
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From pm - Philip Davies was born 19.2.1914 Pontypridd
Philip Davies aged 74 Birth Date 19 Feb 1914 Death registered April 1988 Walsall
Vol 34 Page 405
Mary Bridget Davies aged 78 Birth Date 22 May 1920 Death reg September 1998
Walsall Reg no C54A District 0751C entry no 116
From FS births
Mary Bridget Green June qtr 1920 Lurgan, Ireland Vol Number 1
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Thanks CaroleW, now that the name has been indicated as Mary Bridget Green, I can start off some background in Ireland. Bachelor Philip Joseph Davies of Monaghan Street Newry married spinster Mary Brigid Green of 48 Linenhall Square Newry on 27 July 1940 in Newry Cathedral (the RC Cathedral of St. Patrick & St. Colman), the groom was recorded as a corporal in the Welsh Regiment, the son of Alfred Davies a miner, the bride was the daughter of Edward Green a joiner (deceased), the witnesses were Edward Joseph Green and Mary Lynch.
The above mentioned Mary Brigid Green was born on 22 May 1920, her parents recorded as shipwright Edward Green and Lizzie McEvoy of 13 Marley Street, Portadown.
Bachelor Edward Green from the townland of Aghnamoira married Lizzie McEvoy of Cecil Street Newry on 15 April 1915 in Newry Cathedral, the groom was recorded as a carpenter, the son of Hugh Green a carpenter, the bride was a millworker, the daughter of Isaac McEvoy a millworker, the witnesses were James McEvoy and Janie McGuigan:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1915/09810/5561889.pdf
Edward Green and Lizzie McEvoy had a son Hugh in Newry the following January (1916), father Edward was recorded as being in Scotland:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1916/01355/1559141.pdf
This was Edward Green and his parents in the 1911 Ireland census, note his parents Hugh and Bridget were recorded as married 17 years with 1 child and Bridget's birthplace was stated as Wales (though Co. Down in the 1901 census below):
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Down/Warrenpoint_Rural/Aughnamoira/259175/
Bridget Green (note occupation: 'Ship wright's wife'), with her son Edward and some McMahon siblings living in Burren in 1901:
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Down/Warrenpoint/Burren/1250750/
Bachelor Hugh Green of Aghnamoira married spinster Bridget McMahon of Burren on 9 April 1893 in Burren RC Church (St. Mary's), the respective fathers were given as Edward Green and Edward McMahon, both farmers (alive):
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1893/10597/5860454a.pdf
Hugh and Bridget's son Edward was born at Burren in 1894, father's address Aghnamoira:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1894/02265/1851499.pdf
Using the McMahon sibling information in the above 1901 census return, it looks like their parents were Edward McMahon and Anne McAteer who had a number of children baptised in Clonallon parish from 1869 - 1891 (including the 1901 census siblings), I can't yet see a similar local baptism (or a birth) for Bridget which would support the indication in the 1911 census that she was born in Wales. Edward McMahon and Anne McAteer were married in Warrenpoint on 26 August 1868, Edward was a trader from Burren, the son of Patrick McMahon a farmer, Anne was from Warrenpoint, the daughter of John McAteer a shipbuilder.
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Mrs Bongo
I'm just letting you know on this topic that the topic you started requesting information for his sister has been removed in accordance with our 'no living people' policy.
It would appear that you have started a new related topic here
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=783172.0
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... Bachelor Hugh Green of Aghnamoira married spinster Bridget McMahon of Burren on 9 April 1893 in Burren RC Church (St. Mary's), the respective fathers were given as Edward Green and Edward McMahon, both farmers (alive):
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1893/10597/5860454a.pdf
This looks like a possible death for Hugh in the PRONI Will Calendars index, GRONI online shows a reported age at death of 62 which may be understated:
Green Hugh of Aughnamoira county Down retired shipwright died 21 April 1937 Probate Belfast 21 September to Edward Caulfield senior farmer. Effects £3.
Also a potential candidate for Bridget (McMahon) Green, GRONI online shows a reported age at death of 74, again possibly understated:
Green Bridget of Aughnamoira county Down widow died 11 July 1954 at Daisy Hill Hospital Newry county Armagh Probate Belfast 17 September to William Crawford lorry driver. Effects £633 10s. 8d.
There is also the following Will Calendars index entry, I'm not yet sure from reading the content, how this fits in (no mention of a son Hugh), other than it relates to the following 1901 census return:
Probate of the Will of Edward Green late of Aughnamoira County Down Farmer who died 25 December 1897 granted at Belfast to Denis Crawford of Kilmorey-street Newry County Down Publican and Peter Crawford of Aughnamoira Farmer.
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Down/Warrenpoint/Aughamoire/1250683/
Just a possibility in the following birth of a son Hugh to parents Edward Green, a farmer from Aghnamoira, and Bridget ? on 16 November 1867:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1867/03468/2273970.pdf
The Clonallon RC parish registers show a Hugh Green baptised for parents Edward Green and Bridget Higgins on 15 November 1867:
https://registers.nli.ie/registers/vtls000633258#page/139/mode/1up
The same parish registers show a number of children baptised for an Edward Green and Bridget Rocks, these include matches for the children of the Edward Green of Aghnamoira who died in 1897 whose Will Calendars index entry was mentioned above. Griffith's Valuation shows an Edward Greene farming over 11 acres in Aghnamoira (local print date 1864) and the tithe applotment books have an entry for an Edward Green in Aghnamoira in 1834, so it looks like a longer term 'Green' association with that townland.
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... Bachelor Edward Green from the townland of Aghnamoira married Lizzie McEvoy of Cecil Street Newry on 15 April 1915 in Newry Cathedral, the groom was recorded as a carpenter, the son of Hugh Green a carpenter, the bride was a millworker, the daughter of Isaac McEvoy a millworker, the witnesses were James McEvoy and Janie McGuigan:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1915/09810/5561889.pdf ...
Turning to the McEvoys, this looks so far like the best fit in 1901 and 1911 for Lizzie and her father Isaac mentioned in the 1915 marriage record:
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Down/Newry_North_Urban/Lower_North_Street/1247315/
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Down/Newry_South/Boat_Street/256409/
The parents in the above census returns were Isaac McEvoy and Mary Shannon, who were married in Newry in 1883, the respective fathers were recorded as John McEvoy a carpenter (Living) and Edward Shannon a gas fitter (Dead):
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1883/10948/8001348.pdf
Their daughter Elizabeth was born on 20 January 1896:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1896/02187/1827753.pdf
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hi gaff and carol
a huge thank you both from me and my family in helping to bring our family tree together at long last words of thanks are not enough you both have gave up you time to help us once more thank you both very much
kind regards
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Hi
We got there in the end ;D
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I have been reading through this, did you find who you were looking for? I would be very interested to chat with you.
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I see you did find who or what you were looking for... I think I could be a link within this although Im so sure how this works.
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Hi Gayntrain
Welcome to Rootschat ;D
mrs bongo who started this topic was online here earlier today and should receive a notification that you have posted so hopefully she will come back soon.
Dawn
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Thank you Dawn, look forward to it.
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hi gayntrain and dawn
thank you for your help regard mary hope kind regard
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Can we talk more ref the people you have mentioned
Philip Davies
Mary Bridget Davies
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hi what would you like to know
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The connection you may have with them or the link...
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hi
my cousin his wife are related to this family, are you related to this family
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I believe there is a link yes
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hi
may i ask how please
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They are my grandparents
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hi
that interesting who was your parents
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There youngest daughter is my mom
Who is your cousin
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is your mom collette
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Yes. Who would you be?
Is there a way this can be done privately?
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iv sent you a private message
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Hope I can get it 🙈 I’m new to this
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press green button
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Personal message help here.
https://www.rootschat.com/help/pms.php
The button is only green if you are online.
Good luck messaging off-foum especially regarding living people
Dawn
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thank you dawn