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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Roxburghshire => Topic started by: RedWolf0502 on Tuesday 05 December 17 03:11 GMT (UK)
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I am researching the family of Norman Errol Miller and after going back a few generations have found the following information and I would like to check to see if these are the same people or not.
James C. Miller was born in 1850 to William Miller and Helen. After looking at the 1851 census and doing some subtraction it seems that William was born in 1815/16.
I then went into Freereg.org.uk to see if I could find some more information and came across a William Miller who was born 1818. His parents were James Miller and Margaret Ballantine.
MY question after all that is if William the father of James is the same as William born in 1818 or are the dates too far apart?
Thanks
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In my tree there are several ancestors who were baptised years after they were born. It's worth checking to see if there is a pattern of late baptisms for siblings. Also - ages given on census returns can be notoriously inaccurate!
If you can find a marriage record giving the name of William Miller's father it would settle the matter, but I think the discrepancy in dates is not unreasonable.
All the best.
Philip
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Thanks Philip,
This gives me more hope that it is the right line.
Thanks again
Matt
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Hi Matt ,
If William Miller died in Scotland after 1855 have you looked at his death certificate for parents names ?
I would doubt if his marriage record would contain parents information :-\
Was his wife Helen Cairns ?
http://maxwellancestry.co.uk/census/61transcript.aspx?houseid=799105008
ev
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If it is the William Miller married to Helen Cairns then his mother is with him in the 1871 census and her name is Susan. This would suggest possible parents might be Robert Miller and Susan Turnbull ( son William baptised 1813 in Ancrum). William and Helen had a daughter called Mary born in 1855. Her birth certificate should give ages and places of birth for both William and Helen and can be viewed for a small fee on Scotlandspeople.
Isobel
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Looks like you are actually looking for information on James Campbell Miller born in Halkirk, Caithness around 1851. He married Mary Martha Corrie in London in 1880 with father given as William Miller, Farmer. He was possibly the son born 19/9/1851 to William Miller and Ann Campbell ( who can be found on 1861 census with a number of children including James). I note his 1924 Australian death certificate gives parents as William and Annie. If this is the right family group then William the father was born around 1827 ( not 1815).
Isobel
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Marriage;
15 Nov 1850, Church of Scotland, Thurso, Caithness
William MILLER of Thurso Parish
Ann CAMPBELL of Latheron Parish
(FreeREG)
1851 in Thurso we have;
William Miller, 23, Head, Salmon Fisher, born Halkirk
Ann Miller, 22, Spouse
Christening;
JAMES Miller, 3 Nov 1851 Thurso
Birth 19 Sept 1851
Parents William Miller and Ann Campbell
(Familysearch.Org)
Siblings Births in Halkirk;
ALEXANDER 17 April 1855
WILLIAM 5 June 1856
DONALD 30 July 1858
ISABELLA 2 June 1861
ELIZABETH 27 January 1863
MARY LARNACH 7 February 1866, Death 15 September 1871
ROBERT 13 October 1868
HELEN CAMPBELL 25 February 1871 (Ellen C in 1871 Census)
1881 Census James Sister Isabella is with him and his Wife Mary in London.
Isabella marries 1881 in London to George Daniel Baker, her Father is William a Farmer.
James Campbell Miller is a Marriage witness.
George is a Policeman like James.
Trish :)
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Thanks for providing the additional info Trish.
Ann Campbell or Miller died in Halkirk in 1884 ( age given as 56,which is slightly out on census ages, but there is a cross-reference under both names, so pretty sure it is her). I think William may also have died in Halkirk in 1884. Certificates available to view on Scotlandspeople which should name parents of both.
There is a tree on Ancestry for Norman Errol Miller which contains documented proof of the link back to William in Halkirk ( in case people are wondering how we jumped from Roxburghshire to Caithness).
Isobel
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Interesting in that both James and sister Isabella state father as William, a farmer, when they both married but their father William was a mason in 1861, a Labourer in 1871 and a Gen. Labourer in 1881??
Annette
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William married to Ann Campbell was bc.1828-1830 Halkirk (depending on which census you view) and has to be the William bp.13/7/1827 Halkirk, son of James Miller and Isabel Bain.
He followed the Scottish naming tradition of naming his first son after his own father, and daughter Isabella born 1861 (with her brother James Campbell Miller in 1881) married in 1881 as Isabella Bain Miller which I think kind of clinches it.
When William died 1/1/1884 he is shown as agricultural labourer (not quite a farmer!), confirms his marriage to Ann Campbell, his parents confirmed as James Miller, shoemaker (deceased) and Isabella Miller, nee Bain (deceased) - informant was son James Campbell, of 16 Lincolns Inn Fields, London WC.
Annette
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Death certificates for both William and Ann are included on a tree on Ancestry. Ann died on 23rd Feb 1884 and seems to have met a sad end. She was killed by a train. Her parents are given as David Campbell, Farmer and Elizabeth Campbell nee Forbes. Neither are shown as deceased. James was also the informant of his mother's death with the same Lincolns Inn Field address. There is no cause of death on William's death certificate but there does look to be a register of corrected entries ref against the death which may show more. Have had a quick look on the newspaper archive, but no obvious news entry re the railway death. There is a gravestone in Halkirk Cemetery erected by James in memory of his parents
Isobel
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Thanks everyone,
After a quick reading of everything here, it looks like I might have to reassess what I have. I'll go through everything here and reply with my thoughts when I'm able, recovering from an operation so have plenty of time.
Thanks again
Matt
:)
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You say in one of your other threads that you have access to Ancestry. If you search under Public Member Trees using the search James Campbell Miller with spouse Mary Martha Corrie you will find a number of trees with contain enough information to take you back several generations from James and Mary Martha.
Similarly searching under Public member Trees for Norman Errol Miller will bring up several trees which show him to be the son of William Corrie Miller. At least one of the trees contains a copy of William Corrie Miller's birth certificate which will lead you back to the above James Campbell Miller and Mary Martha Corrie.
Isobel
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Was his wife Helen Cairns ?
http://maxwellancestry.co.uk/census/61transcript.aspx?houseid=799105008
ev
Hi ev,
I'm not sure what his wife's maiden name was, how did you come up with Cairns?
Thanks
Matt
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You say in one of your other threads that you have access to Ancestry. If you search under Public Member Trees using the search James Campbell Miller with spouse Mary Martha Corrie you will find a number of trees with contain enough information to take you back several generations from James and Mary Martha.
Similarly searching under Public member Trees for Norman Errol Miller will bring up several trees which show him to be the son of William Corrie Miller. At least one of the trees contains a copy of William Corrie Miller's birth certificate which will lead you back to the above James Campbell Miller and Mary Martha Corrie.
Isobel
Hi Isobel,
I do not have paid membership and when I click on various links to piblic trees I am unable to go any further. Due to financial restraints at the moment this won't be changing for any sites that ask for money.
We are moving soon and the place we are going to has a family history area that is apparantly very helpful so will hopefully make use of that.
Thanks
Matt
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Looks like you are actually looking for information on James Campbell Miller born in Halkirk, Caithness around 1851. He married Mary Martha Corrie in London in 1880 with father given as William Miller, Farmer. He was possibly the son born 19/9/1851 to William Miller and Ann Campbell ( who can be found on 1861 census with a number of children including James). I note his 1924 Australian death certificate gives parents as William and Annie. If this is the right family group then William the father was born around 1827 ( not 1815).
Isobel
So as I've mentioned and thought after reading all this then maybe Helen is the wrong woman, I'm starting from scratch on my wife's side of the family as her father isn't much help. I only had her grandparent's from the local cemetery which gave me a starting point.
Thanks
Matt
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Marriage;
15 Nov 1850, Church of Scotland, Thurso, Caithness
William MILLER of Thurso Parish
Ann CAMPBELL of Latheron Parish
(FreeREG)
1851 in Thurso we have;
William Miller, 23, Head, Salmon Fisher, born Halkirk
Ann Miller, 22, Spouse
Christening;
JAMES Miller, 3 Nov 1851 Thurso
Birth 19 Sept 1851
Parents William Miller and Ann Campbell
(Familysearch.Org)
Siblings Births in Halkirk;
ALEXANDER 17 April 1855
WILLIAM 5 June 1856
DONALD 30 July 1858
ISABELLA 2 June 1861
ELIZABETH 27 January 1863
MARY LARNACH 7 February 1866, Death 15 September 1871
ROBERT 13 October 1868
HELEN CAMPBELL 25 February 1871 (Ellen C in 1871 Census)
1881 Census James Sister Isabella is with him and his Wife Mary in London.
Isabella marries 1881 in London to George Daniel Baker, her Father is William a Farmer.
James Campbell Miller is a Marriage witness.
George is a Policeman like James.
Trish :)
Thank you for the detailed information Trish
Matt
:)