RootsChat.Com

England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Lancashire => Topic started by: jonsharron on Friday 12 January 18 07:57 GMT (UK)

Title: HUGHES
Post by: jonsharron on Friday 12 January 18 07:57 GMT (UK)
Can anyone help with info on a George Hughes, born 7 september 1859, Derby Road, Kirkdale, Liverpool. He married Jane Hannah Anders on 1st November 1885 at seaforth, Liverpool. I have parents listed as John hughes and Catherine Craggen but no confirmation of a marriage. Occupation of George is butcher (journeyman). I would like to trace his parents back further but I believe they may have come form Ireland, John hughes birth date being approx 1828.
Title: Re: HUGHES
Post by: Kay99 on Friday 12 January 18 08:26 GMT (UK)
This marriage in Liverpool 1854 might be a possible https://www.familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/2DSL-4GS

Kay
Title: Re: HUGHES
Post by: emeltom on Friday 12 January 18 09:19 GMT (UK)
1861 RG09/2724/F75/p14

Mathew Street, est Derby
John Hughes 33 Dockgate Man Dinagh, Monaghan, Ireland
Cathern Hughes 32 Tonen, Monaghan, Ireland
Geroge Hughes 1 Bootle, Lancs

1871 RG10/3824/F56/p10
Boundary Street East, Kirkdale
John Hughes 42 Dockgate Man Ireland
Catherine Hughes 42 Ireland
Geirge Hughes 11 Bootle
John T Hughes 8 Bootle
Patrick Hughes 5 Kirkdale

The GRO birth refs confirm that Catherine's maiden name was Craggen. Both the parents were from Monaghan but the actual place name is not clear.

Emeltom
Title: Re: HUGHES
Post by: heywood on Friday 12 January 18 09:30 GMT (UK)
1861 also has a visitor, Pat Hughes, widower 52 yrs from Donagh, Monaghan.
Catherine’s  birthplace doesn’t look like Monaghan though.
Title: Re: HUGHES
Post by: emeltom on Friday 12 January 18 09:40 GMT (UK)
I thnik Monaghan and Ireland have been run together to make one word.

Emeltom
Title: Re: HUGHES
Post by: heywood on Friday 12 January 18 09:52 GMT (UK)
Yes I can see that with Pat’s entry; John’s shows ‘Monaghaan’ or very similar but no mention of Ireland but Catherine’s is different again.
I can’t post a snippet of it unfortunately. It looks similar to ‘Tinen A.  Maghirland’.

However, a copy of the marriage certificate would hopefully help with fathers’ names and witnesses.
Title: Re: HUGHES
Post by: heywood on Friday 12 January 18 10:00 GMT (UK)
There are baptisms:

St Augustine’s
John Thomas Hughes
Birth 22nd November 1862
Baptism 7th December 1862
Parents John Hughes and Catherine Cregan
Godparents Thomas and Catherine Hughes

Our Lady of Immaculate Conception
Patrick Hughes
Birth 8th January 1866
Baptism 21 January 1866

Godparents Michael Hogan and Catherine Code.
Title: Re: HUGHES
Post by: jonsharron on Friday 12 January 18 10:01 GMT (UK)
This is great information, thank you all very much - I will review it all tomorrow as its late at night in NZ now! This is what I have been looking for I think,  it seems to tie in very nicely with the limited info I have.
Title: Re: HUGHES
Post by: jonsharron on Friday 12 January 18 10:03 GMT (UK)
PS. If there is more to come please dont stop! Very much appreciated.
Title: Re: HUGHES
Post by: Radcliff on Saturday 13 January 18 17:05 GMT (UK)
so have you ordered the certificate for John Hughes and Catherine Cregan
Liverpool register office or registrar attended in 1854
or have you eliminated them from your research
Title: Re: HUGHES
Post by: jonsharron on Saturday 13 January 18 23:04 GMT (UK)
The marriage certificate has been ordered, I am hopeful it is the correct marriage so will have to wait a couple of weeks to find out. Definitely not eliminated from research.
Title: Re: HUGHES
Post by: heywood on Saturday 13 January 18 23:10 GMT (UK)
Good luck with the cert. I would think it is correct.
Title: Re: HUGHES
Post by: jonsharron on Sunday 14 January 18 06:47 GMT (UK)
1861 also has a visitor, Pat Hughes, widower 52 yrs from Donagh, Monaghan.
Catherine’s  birthplace doesn’t look like Monaghan though.
I have found a baptism record for a Catherine Cregan, Dated of Baptism 21/1/1828. Parish/District MAHOONAGH/CASTLEMAHON. Could the unclear bithplace mentioned above be here? Surname spelling seems to change depending on source, could give me another avenue to look down.
Title: Re: HUGHES
Post by: heywood on Sunday 14 January 18 08:32 GMT (UK)
It doesn’t look like that but it has made me look again.  :)

I wonder if it Tin ... then Ar Maghirland/ Ar Maghisland and should perhaps be somewhere in Armagh  :-\

There is a Tynan in Armagh which is the next Catholic Parish to Donagh, Monaghan.
https://registers.nli.ie

Their lodgers, the Malins look to be from the same place and it is more clearly written, although not perfect  :) Tinen Armagh Ireland.
Title: Re: HUGHES
Post by: jonsharron on Saturday 03 February 18 08:08 GMT (UK)
Thank you for all this information, I have been able to unravel a little bit more information from what has been given in all of your posts.  I have spent a bit of time trying to prove or disprove the marriage certificate that I received is correct and think it most likely is correct for a number of reasons but there are a couple of things that dont match. I am very inexperienced at this research so could someone with more experience please advise me on the following:
Age in all census records have John and Catherine of the same age born 1828/9. Marriage certificate shows john being 3 years younger than catherine with age at marriage in 1854 at 21. catherines age at 24 which fits with what I have on her. Is Johns age discrepancy enough to discount the marriage certificate as being the wrong one for this research if there are plenty of other areas where a match is consistent?
I am assuming that a witness named Rose Ann Cregan is either mother or sister to Catherine, was there a protocol in those days as to which relation Rose Ann may be?
If you can help with these two questions it would be appreciated. I would attach a copy of the certificate but its over the size limit and cant upload it.
Thanks
 
Title: Re: HUGHES
Post by: heywood on Saturday 03 February 18 08:41 GMT (UK)
Hello again,
You don’t need to upload the certificate- in fact we can’t do for copyright reasons, only snippets.
You can though transcribe it with all relevant information- names; addresses and occupations etc.
Heywood
Title: Re: HUGHES
Post by: jonsharron on Saturday 03 February 18 08:52 GMT (UK)
OK, thanks. Will remember that.
Certificate says:
Date 28th September 1854, St. Augustines church
John Hughes - 21 years - Bachelor - Prof: Mariner - residence at time of marriage, Clay Shut(?), Liverpool - fathers name, Patrick Hughes (stonecutter).
Catherine Cregan - 24 years - Spinster - no occupation listed - residence Clay Shut(?), Liverpool, fathers name, William Cregan (Husbandman)

First witness name I cant decipher but looks like Francis R***h
Second witness is Rose Ann Cregan

Hope that is some help.
Title: Re: HUGHES
Post by: heywood on Saturday 03 February 18 10:01 GMT (UK)
There is a Clay Street

https://www.liverpool-genealogy.org.uk/Streets1851/StreetsC.htm
Title: Re: HUGHES
Post by: heywood on Saturday 03 February 18 10:39 GMT (UK)
I would say you have the correct marriage.
I just found George’s baptism - transcribed as Haghes

St Augustine
George Hughes born 7th September 1859 baptised 18th September 1859
Father John Hughes Mother Catharina Creaghan
Address Derby Road
Godparent Rose Ann Creaghan

I have transcribed from Latin

There is also a baptism of a child at the same church. I assume she must have died - from Latin again.
Mary Hughes born 26 April 1857 baptised 3 May 1857
John Hughes and Catherine Cregan
Address Athol Street
Godparents Thaddeus and Elisabeth Claffy


Title: Re: HUGHES
Post by: Blue70 on Saturday 03 February 18 20:25 GMT (UK)
St Augustine's RC was on the corner of Great Howard Street and Chadwick Street. Clay Street was a little narrow street off Carlton Street, Carlton Street was off Great Howard Street near the north docks. Adjust zoom on this link if at first the map does not appear:-

https://www.old-maps.co.uk/#/Map/333783/391799/13/101757


Blue
Title: Re: HUGHES
Post by: jonsharron on Sunday 04 February 18 16:48 GMT (UK)
All this information you have found has been very helpful, it has got the search going again after hitting a road block. How do I go about getting a copy of the baptism entries mentioned for George and Mary, would that be Liverpool Council or is there a better place to ask?
Thanks
Title: Re: HUGHES
Post by: heywood on Sunday 04 February 18 17:49 GMT (UK)
Liverpool Catholic Records - Ancestry.