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Old Photographs, Recognition, Handwriting Deciphering => Free Photo Restoration & Date Old Photographs => Topic started by: stevemiller on Tuesday 23 January 18 12:31 GMT (UK)

Title: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: stevemiller on Tuesday 23 January 18 12:31 GMT (UK)
I'm not sure if I have got the hang of resizing images, etc but here goes.

Could someone suggest a date for this photograph?

The chap seated at the right hand end of the front row is my great-grandfather 1869-1927. He was a gardener from Newbury, Berks.

This would be a long shot, but could it be Stourhead House?

Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: Gadget on Tuesday 23 January 18 20:53 GMT (UK)
I think it would be 1917-1920, going by the women's hats  and some of the men's collars/ties.

Gadget
Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: stevemiller on Wednesday 24 January 18 09:24 GMT (UK)
Thank you Gadget.

Can I ask what is it about the hats and collars/ties that pins it down to such a narrow period?

Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: Gadget on Wednesday 24 January 18 09:27 GMT (UK)
Just that that was what they wore during that period - according to my books.  The problem is that it looks like a staff photo and many of the men were in work clothes, which have a wide date range, so we have to pick up clues from the little snippets, like hats, etc.

Gadget
Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: stevemiller on Wednesday 24 January 18 09:51 GMT (UK)
Many thanks.

This ties in with a 1917 postcard from Stourhead suggesting my grandfather was going to work there with Edmund.

I suppose I should now post on the Wiltshire board?
Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: Gadget on Wednesday 24 January 18 10:04 GMT (UK)
What extra do you want to know - is it whether it is Stourhead House?
Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: Gadget on Wednesday 24 January 18 10:06 GMT (UK)
This modern pic of Stourhead has a door feature very like yours - note the section above the door in both:

https://www.linusmoranphotography.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/Stourhead-Wedding-Photographers_0050.jpg

Gadget
Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: stevemiller on Wednesday 24 January 18 10:48 GMT (UK)
Gadget,

It does look similar, but don't you think the distance from the ground to the top of the open french window [?] is much shorter in my photo?
Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: stevemiller on Wednesday 24 January 18 11:14 GMT (UK)
I've linked to the Wiltshire board
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=786404.new#new
Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: mazi on Wednesday 24 January 18 11:33 GMT (UK)
Gadget,

It does look similar, but don't you think the distance from the ground to the top of the open french window [?] is much shorter in my photo?

You would expect to see part of the windows either side of the door, they are not on your photo.

Mike
Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: Gadget on Wednesday 24 January 18 11:36 GMT (UK)
Stourhead is a very large property - it might be worth Googling some of the images. There are many. I looked at a few but have other things on!

The door feature seemed distinctive. It could have been replicated on another part of the property.

Gadget
Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: Gadget on Wednesday 24 January 18 11:48 GMT (UK)
Another pic with climbers around a window/opening?  Maybe in this area?

http://www.britainexpress.com/counties/wiltshire/gardens/Stourhead/Stourhead-170606-002016.jpg

and

http://www.dorsetcamera.co.uk/assets/images/Stourhead_house-4536.jpg
Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: Gadget on Wednesday 24 January 18 13:44 GMT (UK)
Steve

Do you have any other photos of your grandfather and grt grandfather?

Also, where were they working before Stourhead?  Was Edmund already at Stourhead by the time he sent the postcard?

Gadget
Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: stevemiller on Wednesday 24 January 18 14:30 GMT (UK)
This is the only other photo I have of my great grandfather Edmund Barlow. He was in the Devonshires Jan 1888 to Jan 1896, then recalled for South Africa Oct 1899 to Jan 1901.

He was awarded Good Conduct pay Mar 1893 and forfeited it Sep 1893 - does that tie in with the chevron and date the photo?

He was at 3 St Johns View, Newbury in 1911 and joined the National Reserve in Sep 1914 at Newbury. He was discharged for misconduct in April 1915.

I have no other evidence about Stourhead expect the photo (?) and postcard.

Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: Gadget on Wednesday 24 January 18 14:32 GMT (UK)
Had a thought!

It might be worth you sending the picture to Stourhed to find out if they recognise it.

The e-mail address is on this link:

http://www.nationaltrustcollections.org.uk/place/stourhead


Worth a try.


Gadget
Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: Gadget on Wednesday 24 January 18 14:40 GMT (UK)
I think there's enough similarity to say that the man on the right front is your grt grandfather.


Gadget
Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: Treetotal on Wednesday 24 January 18 14:42 GMT (UK)
I would agree with that.
Carol
Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: stevemiller on Wednesday 24 January 18 14:54 GMT (UK)
And this is my grandfather Bert (born Nov 1901), who wrote the postcard home [see Wilts Board] No date but late 1920's?

He was very tall for the period - at least 6 feet - and he had his father's ears.

Now I never thought my grandfather was in the staff photo - but that young chap right at the back is tall and has ears aplenty. I was very excited but, looking closer, the set of the mouth looks different.

Gadget - thanks for the link. I thought of contacting them years ago, but never got around to it. They certainly have a lot more online than when I looked before.
Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: Gadget on Wednesday 24 January 18 15:04 GMT (UK)
Think this might be your granddad:

(I'm trying to get used to a new wacom drawing tablet attached to a new laptop and not up to speed yet  ::) :-X  )
Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: stevemiller on Wednesday 24 January 18 15:43 GMT (UK)
Gadget - I don't think that chap is my grandfather - seems shorter and stockier, and older than 16 or 17.

This is Bert in 1921 or 1927 - the written date is not too clear. He is back row, far right. This gives a better view regarding height etc.

Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: Gadget on Wednesday 24 January 18 15:55 GMT (UK)
Try this.

He's got a vague resemblance to Jos Buttler (cricketer) in the 1921 one!
Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: stevemiller on Wednesday 24 January 18 16:04 GMT (UK)
Funny you mention cricket !

Bert was a great cricketer and my dad always called him "Laker" - after Jim Laker - he must have taken a lot of wickets in a match.

Is that him at the back of the staff photo?
Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: Gadget on Wednesday 24 January 18 16:29 GMT (UK)
The left hand one is a clip from the group photo, which I've enlarged and lightened a bit  - same ears  ;D
Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: stevemiller on Wednesday 24 January 18 16:44 GMT (UK)
Oh ... I don't know.

When people lean over babies and say they've got their father's chin - I never see it !

Gadget , you have been a true star with this.

I've emailed the pics to Stourhead.
Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: Gadget on Wednesday 24 January 18 16:51 GMT (UK)
When I look at that pic of my lovely Gran in my avatar, I see a lot of my dear Dad there  :)

I'd be really interested in their answer, Steve  :)

Gadget
Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: stevemiller on Wednesday 31 January 18 10:19 GMT (UK)
You may remember this group photo was dated to 1917-20, which ties in with a Stourhead postcard that my grandfather Bert sent home in 1917. http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=786404.0

I have had a reply from a very helpful historical researcher at Stourhead.

The building, and people in the photo, are NOT recognisable as Stourhead.

The researcher forwarded the photo to the authors of ‘The Long Weekend - Life in The English Country House Between The Wars’, and ‘The Country House at War - Fighting the Great War at home and in the trenches’ but neither could identify the house.

There are limited staff records at Stourhead. They do not name any Barlows, but this does not mean they did not work there.

Clearly my grandfather Bert and his father were at Stourhead – or somewhere close by? – in 1917.

I know it is a tall order, but, if not Stourhead, where was this group photo taken?  I suppose Newbury or West Berkshire would be the next obvious choice.

For completeness, I’ve attached the reverse of the photo.
Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: Coolchick211 on Wednesday 05 June 19 13:13 BST (UK)
Hi

Edmund Barlow is my great grandfather, with my deaf grandfather being Lloyd Edmund Barlow who passed away in 1992.

According to certificates i hold, the Barlows used to live in Long Lane, Newbury. My grandfather (Lloyd), went on to become a wonderful Carpenter.

Regards

Melissa Barlow
Title: Re: Date of this photo Edmund Barlow 1869-1927 at Stourhead, Wilts?
Post by: stevemiller on Friday 07 June 19 09:04 BST (UK)
Hello Melissa,
Your great grandfather Edmund (1885-1945) is different to my Edmund, but they were related - they were second cousins. In fact, practically all Barlows in West Berkshire are part of the same family.
I will send you a private message.
best wishes
Steve