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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Durham => England => Durham Lookup Requests => Topic started by: charding on Thursday 01 February 18 13:24 GMT (UK)

Title: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: charding on Thursday 01 February 18 13:24 GMT (UK)
Good morning, all!  I have been researching the Gallagher family for quite some time.  They started in Ireland (somewhere) - John Gallagher and Elizabeth O'Hara - had a son, John, around 1842, had another son, William, in Kelso, Roxburghshire, Scotland in 1849 and baptized him in Hawick, Roxburghshire, Scotland that same year.  By 1852 they are in Hartlepool and have their daughter, Elizabeth.  I'm looking to see if they are on the 1851 census in Hartlepool.  I can't seem to find them anywhere.

They are definitely in Hartlepool from 1861 forward.  The 1871 Hartlepool census indicates that the son, John born in 1842, was born in Terone Caven, Ireland.

Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: rosie99 on Thursday 01 February 18 15:07 GMT (UK)
Welcome to rootschat

Where are the family in 1861.  Could you please give details

Rosie
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: charding on Thursday 01 February 18 16:27 GMT (UK)
In 1861 they are listed at Emerson's Yard Northgate Street:
John Golloher 
Elizabeth Golloher 
John Golloher 
William Golloher 
Elizabeth Golloher 
James Golloher 
Mary A Golloher 
Margaret Golloher

John, his wife Elizabeth, and son John are listed as born Ireland B S

I have no idea what the B S means in the birth location either.
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: rosie99 on Thursday 01 February 18 16:32 GMT (UK)
Thank you

BS is British subject  :)
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: heywood on Thursday 01 February 18 16:40 GMT (UK)
Hello,

Do you have Elizabeth’s birth certificate with an address?

Heywood
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: charding on Thursday 01 February 18 16:44 GMT (UK)
So does the term British Subject given any indication as to a location of birth in Ireland?  I am not familiar with the history of Ireland and England and really don't know what to make of the term.

They could also have been in another town during the 1851 census but I don't know the travel routes from Ireland through Scotland to England, so I've been unable to find them in 1851.
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: rosie99 on Thursday 01 February 18 16:48 GMT (UK)
I have never seen BS put against Ireland before though I am sure there probably are other entries.  It is normally against places abroad, often when the father is working abroad as in the Army/navy etc.
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: charding on Thursday 01 February 18 16:50 GMT (UK)
Heywood,
There is some indication from the 1881 census that she may have been born in Dublin but since the year would be around 1826 it is well before the freebmd records find anything.  I've not found her birth yet.
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: rosie99 on Thursday 01 February 18 16:52 GMT (UK)
I think Heywood means Elizabeth jnr  ;) 
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: heywood on Thursday 01 February 18 16:53 GMT (UK)
Of course - apologies!
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: libby9 on Thursday 01 February 18 16:54 GMT (UK)
So does the term British Subject given any indication as to a location of birth in Ireland?  I am not familiar with the history of Ireland and England and really don't know what to make of the term.

Short answer to type in bold is - NO.

This may help you understand the history

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Ireland_(1801%E2%80%931923)
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: charding on Thursday 01 February 18 17:28 GMT (UK)
Elizabeth, the daughter, is listed on the 1861 census with place of birth Durham, Hartlepool and being 9 years of age.  She died in September 1861 and the death certificates don't give place of birth.
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: heywood on Thursday 01 February 18 17:31 GMT (UK)
The birth certificate would give an address which might help if they were living in the same area.

Does the baptism of William in Hawick have an address in case they are still around there?

Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: Millmoor on Thursday 01 February 18 17:42 GMT (UK)
This is probably the birth of Elizabeth Jr on the Groindex

Galagher Elizabeth Mothers Maiden Name OHara
Gro reference ; 1852  M quarter in Stockton Vol 10a Page 69.

Hartlepool was part of Stockton RD until 1859.

William
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: charding on Thursday 01 February 18 17:49 GMT (UK)
William,
Thank you! That's great information, though it still won't tell place of birth for the parents, darn it - and see, those are the things I don't know about England - districting, etc.  Do you know if Hartlepool was listed differently in the 1851 census?  I don't have a clue why I can't find them.

Cheryl
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: Millmoor on Thursday 01 February 18 18:54 GMT (UK)
Have to say I cannot see them in Hartlepool in 1851 either. Have tried a variety of sites and tried searching using first names only, wildcards etc. and have come up with nothing. Cannot see them in Roxburghshire either.

As Heywood suggested Elizabeth Jnr's. birth cert would at least give an address for them at the start of 1852.

I note that William's was an RC baptism in Hawick - one of the sponsors was an Ellen O' Hara. Might she have been related to Elizabeth?


Free sites like Genuki are great for providing information about the counties of England - it was a link on their Durham pages which told me about the RD's.

William
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: heywood on Thursday 01 February 18 19:03 GMT (UK)
I too have searched using the same criteria with names and people born Ireland or Scotland as in William’s case.
There are a couple of variations of the name (I was hoping to find connections) but can’t find them at all.
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: charding on Thursday 01 February 18 19:55 GMT (UK)
I have assumed that Ellen O'Hara is a relation but no idea if mother, sister, cousin, etc.  It lists William being born in Kelso.  Are there directories for that timeframe in Kelso?
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: charding on Thursday 01 February 18 20:11 GMT (UK)
http://specialcollections.le.ac.uk/utils/getfile/collection/p16445coll4/id/278572/filename/312172.pdfpage/page/92

They are not listed in the Hagar & Co.'s Directory of the County of Durham, 1851
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: heywood on Thursday 01 February 18 20:20 GMT (UK)
Did your family emigrate from Hartlepool and if so where did they go?
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: charding on Thursday 01 February 18 20:33 GMT (UK)
The Gallagher I descend from, James brother of William, in 1881 was living at 40 Potts Street 40 Potts Street (in the home of his brother, William).  Ellen Lynn whom he married 28 May 1881 was living in William's house at the same time.  Supposedly, James and Ellen emigrated from England to Scranton, Pennsylvania in 1886 but I don't have the ship information on them.
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: Millmoor on Thursday 01 February 18 20:40 GMT (UK)
The nearest I can get is this

1851 Cleveland Street  81  Hartlepool showing as a lodger in the home of Joseph Fee

John Gaulacher age transcribed as 34 or 36 depending on where you look. Unfortunately showing as unmarried.

The cemetery records for John and daughter Elizabeth appear to be on Durham Records Online (free index but pay to view the full transcription).

William
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: charding on Thursday 01 February 18 20:42 GMT (UK)
William,
Thank you.  I saw that as well. I just don't think that's him.  The question becomes where would they have stopped between Kelso and Hartlepool.  How did one get from Kelso to Hartlepool?  Could they have avoided the census taker altogether? 
Cheryl
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: heywood on Thursday 01 February 18 20:48 GMT (UK)
I ask re emigration because there is a O'Hara family in Hartlepool in 1851.

1851 2384/387/40

Oliver 45 yrs and Ellen O’Hara 47 yrs with four children aged 10 yrs- 18 yrs.

There is a published tree which shows the children emigrating to Scranton before 1860.
However I think some of the information may not be reliable.
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: charding on Thursday 01 February 18 20:51 GMT (UK)
What are the numbers after 1851?
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: heywood on Thursday 01 February 18 20:57 GMT (UK)
It’s the census reference
Piece/folio/Page
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: charding on Thursday 01 February 18 21:10 GMT (UK)
Now I'm really confused.  Is that the same Ellen who was at William's baptism?  ARRGGHHHH!!
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: heywood on Thursday 01 February 18 21:11 GMT (UK)
It may be worth keeping this O’Hara family in mind but there is nothing yet to link them.

Here they are in Family Search in 1851 Hartlepool
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:SGJ2-LXZ

And daughter Barbara in Scranton in 1871
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:MZP1-2G6
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: hpool on Thursday 08 February 18 12:19 GMT (UK)
stockton & hartlepool mercury
hartlepool
7 september 1861

at hartlepool, on the 6th instant, aged 9 years, elizabeth gallagher.
---------------
note: no address given - she may have resided in either area called "california" or "egypt"!
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stockton & hartlepool mercury
hartlepool
25 september 1861

at west hartlepool, on the 20th inst., aged 1 year, john robert, son of mr john gallagher, hilda street.
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stockton & hartlepool mercury
hartlepool
19 march 1864

at hartlepool on the 10th inst., aged 45, mr john gallagher, mill yard.

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note: hartlepool and west hartlepool were separate towns until 1967 amalgamation.
--------

hpool
Title: Re: Hartlepool/1851 Census/Gallaghers
Post by: charding on Friday 09 February 18 02:00 GMT (UK)
That's great!  I know about the first one but not the second.  I can't seem place hilda street with the family.  Any idea how I can get a copy of the actual newsprints of those articles?