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Research in Other Countries => Australia => Topic started by: Adelaide Hills on Tuesday 13 February 18 06:04 GMT (UK)
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Hello , yes it has been awhile , The Qualmann Family Friedrich Gottfried Ludwig wife Sophia Mararette Elisabeth(nee Bannow) left Tarneritz Germany with 2 girls . The Article Chronicle Adelaide s. Aust.1895 1954 Sat.8th April 1905 page 10. Sophia said they arrived in South Aust.in 1842.He had died in 1892.
But can't find how they got to Adelaide. My line is Johann Carl Heinrich was born on the 12th feb. 1847 in Lobethal. A story is that they departed Hamburg 1844 on the Skjold to new Zealand then Horbart to Portland on to Adelaide.
I know this is not much to go on but if you can give it a go I would really Appreciate your time and
trouble that I know you go too.Thank you for your time Cheers Gail
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Suggest you ask for this to be moved to the Australia boards.
What sort of records are you hoping to find for internal travel, or from New Zealand to Australia at that time? Where have you looked?
If they departed Hamburg in 1844, how can they have arrived in South Aust in 1842?
As you have put 'yes it has been awhile' have you posted about this family previously?
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Hello, yes about the family that lived in south Australia which a Lady called Cando Helped me as my mother was a Qualmann and married a Gaghen..Now I am going backwards if that makes sense. About New Zealand I only got the information from a Lady who was a Qualmann. I know it was slow by boat but not that slow. Thank you for your time Cheers Gail
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HI Have just found out that Friederich Ludwig QOALMANN wife Sophie daughters Christine and Marie were Naturalised in New Zealand on 1st Jan 1844. That changes from the Quote Sophie had given in article with the dates, maybe in the translation as she could only speak German. So now not sure were to go . Did they go to Tasmania or call into Portland (Victoria ) to Adelaide. Have checked some of the shipping records but no Qualmann. Any thoughts? Thank you for your time Cheers Gail.
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On Australian naturalization request he says he has been in South Australia (and/or UK) for 8 years in 1853
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01lrr/
Ros
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Thank You so much Ros, that means (maybe)that they arrived around 1844-5 have checked shipping records ,I can't find Qualmann at all .Could they have come by a smaller ship if they were in Tasmania or Portland Vic? Is there any other type of paperwork that could give me any hints? Cheers Gail.
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10 December 1844 Trove Qualman ( 1 N only)
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article8755786
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Thank you SO MUCH they have gone from N.Z. to Hobart . they were in South Australia (1853 when sign on to be Australian can't think of the word sorry and had been there 8years)) when they left Hobart between 1844. and 1845 . to where am not sure( Portland Victoria) was mention .Would they have taken a small ship and only styed in Hobart a little while? Again Thank You Cheers Gail :) :) :) :) :)
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Hi ,Have been checking shipping records of arrivals in Victoria (I do this through our local library) with the dates between 1844 -45. No Luck.Can I check local papers from Hobart to Melbourne if so how do I fine them? Thank you for your time cheers Gail
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Here is the arrival in Tasmania - Mr Qualman with wife and 2 children arrived 7 Dec 1844 on the ship "Sisters" from New Zealand.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01lv0/
Can't see a departure, will keep looking.
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Thank You I am stuck on how they got to Adelaide some said Portland which is Victoria then to Adelaide as there is no Qualmann on the normal shipping line .Cheers Gail :) :)
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German immigrants from NZ to SA were split into different groups from Hobart, and were either on the PALMYRA, JOSEPH ALBINO or JOHN PIRIE.
This website names the QUALMANN family arriving in the PALMYRA.
http://www.familyhistorysa.org//shipping/passengerlists.html
Essie
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Essie, I am impressed with your find. I have been reading this thread just out of interest, and tried the SA Maritime Museum database to see if I can help, and nothing turned up, and it seems to have been something of a brick wall. You will make the OP very happy!
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Well Essie, my girl you have done it again. I search the S.A. but no know finds. I am so happy that I know how they came, if we could read minds we could ask they why they came this way? There are still many more Question to ask. I just wanted you to know that I appreciate all the findings that everyone does for me. I work in retail, people love to whinge but not many Thank You .Cheers to you all :) :) :) :) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;)
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The story behind all this is was because German emigrants on two ships, the St Pauli in 1843 and Skiold in 1844, went to NZ after hearing about a scheme to own land that in fact left many Germans practically destitute. Many had known German emigrants who were happy after emigrating to South Australia.
In my resources I have info from research by the late Di Cummings (Author of 'BOUND FOR SOUTH AUSTRALIA') that there was a letter of appreciation to the Captain of the Palmyra that was published in The South Australia Register on 25 January 1845 with surnames of the families. The surnames were spelt incorrectly (not unusual for german surnames when spoken and misunderstood) but Di cross-referenced the surnames with the available passenger lists to NZ, and she recognised the QUALMANN surname was written as OLAMUN in the newspaper!
Essie
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Yes, well done Essie. Great find! Di Cummings did some amazing and painstaking research.
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Well, my old notes re Di's research has a discrepancy as to the letter of appreciation.
After a great deal of searching on TROVE, the letter was actually to residents in Hobart for their help, and published 28th January - partly in the bottom right hand corner of page 2 and the top hand left corner of page 3.
I'm hoping these two links work.....
page 2
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/73841891
page 3
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/page/2285602
Essie
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How kind and generous of those "noblemen and inhabitants" to donate (some quite considerable sums) to the German families who must have found themselves in very distressing circumstances.
You've inspired me Essie to go back and do some more research into one of my German ancestors to try to find when she entered Australia, till now it's eluded me. ;)
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I would like to say THANK YOU to Essie for her find she is fantastic speaking of fantastic to all are .As i am not good useing the computre. I realy appreciate all that you do and tell everyone .…
Posting on behalf of adelaide hills :)
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Hi Essie, I am starting to put things together ,yes I know things need to be checked but I came across Friedrich Ludwig Qualmann and wife Sophie Mararetha Qualman and girls were naturalisted in New Zealand on 1st January 1844 They . Arrived New Zealand Sept 1844 but left for Hobart 22-11-1844 and arrived Adelaide Jan 1844. Maybe they were on the 1st lot of arrivals in New Zealand. Sorry to be a "problem child " cheers 😀😀😀😀😀
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Hi Adelaide Hills
I very much doubt the Naturalisation given date of 1st January 1844 since the ship SKIOLD only sailed from Hamburg 21st April 1844. The arrival date is correct - at Nelson on 1st September 1844. Arrival in SA was January 1845.
I am sending you a copy of the passenger list from Hamburg to NZ.
Essie
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Yep you are right Essie, I am not to sure where I got the date, could be Ancestry but there seems to be quiet a few mistakes there . Unless you see the original document numberscan be blurred. I am so excited about our find .when they got to Adelaide they worked very hard .Thank You will continue this journey thanks to you help 😀😀😀
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Thank you Essie, You are wonderful at what you do .Am off to work now .will ask about what they got up to in Adelaide. take care Gail :) :) :) :) :) :) :)
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You have probably seen the mentions on TROVE for the Qualmann family. This obit gives a lot of info about Sophie, who, apparently, did not use English even though she lived to be 99 years old.
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/88421745
Judith
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Hi yes Judith,this was one of the Articles that made me to want to fine out were they came from Thank you cheers Gail😀😆😆
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Morning , hope all is well with you , another question ha ha Emma Matilde Clara is my Grand Mother
One of the things was when she married Phillip Gaghen she changed her name to Clara Emma COLMAN on her marriage Certificate. Just thought just because she was young,pregnant and married a man older that her that the family might have disowned her, but I am struggling to find out about her father Johann Carl Heinrich Qualmann mother Sophia Maria nee Waldhauer. I think he died at Parkside . In Adelaide along time ago Parkside was a Mental Institution. Would this be on his death certificate and how long would he have been there ? if so this could have been the reason she changed her name what are your thoughts cheers Happy Hills 😆😆😆😆😆
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Hi Adelaide Hills,
I have S.A.Record Series 4 - Deaths in Public Institutions compiled by Jill Stratton.
Amongst the records is:-
"QUALMANN C.F.W. see Johann C.H.
QUALMANN Johann C.H. - death date 1st May, 1916 aged 69. Admitted 1915, Widower. Born in Sth Australia. Other details:- Maitland - brother of Mr. C.F.W.Qualmann, Maitland. Ref:120 Admission 111/15"
That is all that is on the register.
Admission to Parkside Hospital didn't always mean there was a serious mental health issue. Patients who had an illness which needed long term treatment, those suffering dementia, epilepsy etc were often sent to Parkside.
In regards to your question of Clara's surname being COLMAN on her marriage. I think Clara has just anglicised her name from QUALMANN to COLMAN. Sounds the same but spelt quite differently.
Regards,
Sashar
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I agree with Sashar re pronouncing the surname : Colman v Qualmann. I see the marriage was in 1892, in South Australia. I speculate that like in the other Australian colonies, South Australia's clergy collected and filled out the information that was forwarded to SA's BDM based on the info they had collected when interviewing the couple prior to marriage. I suspect the spelling is the clergy's choice, based on his verbal questions and their verbal responses. The only written document that either the bride or groom may have needed to provide would be written consent to marry if either were not yet 21 years of age.
I see Mrs GAGHEN's maiden names indexed under various spellings including : Clara Emma QUALLMANN for births of their children at the following link:
https://www.genealogysa.org.au/resources/online-databases.html
JM
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Hi Thank you ,life seemed very hard for them, on the originate death cetificate would
It state what he died of ? I think Clare fib on her marriage Certificate as she was born 1874 but yes Colman is easier to say than Qualmann and correct the person doing it again I appreciate your time and help cheers 😆😆😆😆😆😆
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Hi Adelaide Hill,
The Lutheran Archives located in Adelaide might be able to assist with actual church records.
http://www.lca.org.au/departments/ministry-support/lutheran-archives/
There are modest fees for their services if you visit or do things externally.
I visited the Archives a few years ago and had them print out a complete list of indexed records for my German family and I went from there to seeks the actual records via the archivist.
Very helpful.
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Hi Adelaide Hills,
The following should be on a 1916 Sth Australian death certificate. The information provided depends on who the informant was, so it's possible sections could be left blank. I'm not sure if these records are able to be viewed at a Library etc - another Rootschatter may be able to help you with that...........Sashar
1908-1947
Date and Place of Death
Name
Sex
Age
Occupation
Usual Residence
Birthplace
Length of Residence in Commonwealth
Age at Marriage
Number of Issue Living and Deceased
Cause of Death
Place of Death
Informant
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Thank you it was just a "maybe' but that is o.k. one door closes another opens ,cheers 😆😆😆😆😆😆
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Hi the Lutheran sounds good is there a place in Melbourne that is the same that I could use Thank you cheers 😆😆😆😆😆😆😆
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I think the Lutheran Archives in Adelaide hold records for for all of Australia, I don't know what might be available in Melbourne. Maybe consider emailing or phoning the Lutheran Archives them to find out how they could help.
My ancestors came from Mecklenburg-Schwerin to South Australia as well, have you found your Qualmann and Bannow ancestors on the 1819 Mecklenburg-Schwerin Census.
Gerry
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Hi there, which ship did your ancestors come to Adelaide on? yep Friedrich G. Ludwig and Sophia M Elizabeth Bannow are related through Son Johann H C. and Sophia M.M Waldhauer their daughter was my Grandmother. Small world when you start talking to people cheers "Happy Hills" 😆😆😆😆😆
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Hi There, Have been putting the Qualmann Family together a problem with Johana Maria Elizabeth born 28-05-1865 to Johann Carl Heinrich and Sophia Maria Waldhauer I found that she was married to George Mansbridge 2-2-1886 a big deal in trove but when he died no mention of a wife only there children. Have been looking at Diggers (we are going to lose this from the library as they can't update it to the latest techknowlege. ) I don't know where she died. Also her sister Auguste Caroline Johanna born 29-10-1868. The rest of the family I have found the husbands and wives. Any thoughts thank you cheers Gail
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Hi
"Annie" MANSBRIDGE aged 86y died 1953 in WA. Looks like she had children and grandchildren in WA
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/49231934
From WA bmds
MANSBRIDGE Joanna M A
Canning district
reg #79
"Caroline" QUALMANN married John Alexander WHITELAW on 28 Aug 1889
District DAL
Book 160 Page 646
Essie
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Great I wondered what happened that thay split up because the children stayed with there dad when he died 1950.You are so clever in sorting out the names could Auguste Caroline joanna did the same .only know.when she was born. Cheers Gail😁😁😁😁😁
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Hi Essie, just wanted to let you know the wonderful job you do .I got to meet my first cousin in Queensland a couple of weeks ago and showed her all work you have helped me with ,it was fantastic you are wonderful . Mary had some photos so I got to see my grandmother. Also on tne Gaghdn side (grandfather Philip Gaghen) she gave me his Bapismal Certificate which state's his father Thomas Geoghegan and Magaret Tool was born on the 24th April 1857 wow as Then is no record of him and his sister Annie birth. HE were baptised at the Archbishops house Weat Terrace Adelaide. Am ofv to work now again THANK YOU SO MUCH there is still more to find 😁😁😁😁😁😁😁😁Gail