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Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: Jamesgb on Friday 16 February 18 09:04 GMT (UK)
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I have had some great help with tracing my family tree on here on my Fathers side and have managed to go back a lot further than I thought, so thank you everyone.
I am now at a stage where I have ordered a couple of birth certificates so cannot go any further until I have them so in the meantime I thought I would have a look at my mother’s side of which I don’t have a lot of information.
What I do have is the following and this is the furthest I have been able go back on the Nightingale side so if anyone could help in going back any further that would be great. As far as I know the Nightingales are all from the London/Essex areas.
William Nightingale (1866 – 1932)
Married Jane Ann Boness (1872 - ?) in 1890 in Mile End
They had the following children as far as I know;
Jane (1891) – Canning Town
Florence Elizabeth (1892) – West Ham
William (1894) – West Ham
Lilen (ABT 1895) - Poplar
Annie Maud (ABT 1897) – West Ham
Frederick John (1901) – West Ham
John (1904) – West Ham
George William (1906) - West Ham – My Great Grandfather
Rose Hannah (1908) – West Ham
Daisy May (1910) – West Ham
Any help or direction would be great, thank you again,
James
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1891 census transcript gives William b Norfolk and Jane ann born Bedfordshire.
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q21N-MPZ
1901 (no William)
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X9NC-TT5
1911 (jane is a widow)
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XWF3-WMC
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William's birth record?
NIGHTINGALE, WILLIAM HITCH
GRO Reference: 1865 D Quarter in ELY Volume 03B Page 537
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Thank you,
I have Williams Death in 1932 (I am not sure where I got that from)
So it was before that?
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Marriage 6 April 1890 - St Paul, Bow Common
William Nightingale age 22 - labourer -father James Nightingale-shipwright deceased
Jane Ann Boness father Frederick Boness occ Labourer
wit Richard Johnson & Ann Emma Boness
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Marriage 6 April 1890 - St Paul, Bow Common
William Nightingale age 22 - labourer -father James Nightingale-shipwright deceased
Jane Ann Boness father Frederick Boness occ Labourer
wit Richard Johnson & Ann Emma Boness
Ooohhh that's great, his fathers name :)
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Marriage 6 April 1890 - St Paul, Bow Common
William Nightingale age 22 - labourer -father James Nightingale-shipwright deceased
Jane Ann Boness father Frederick Boness occ Labourer
wit Richard Johnson & Ann Emma Boness
Ooohhh that's great, his fathers name :)
Is that a double barreled surname? James Nightingale-Shipright?
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Marriage 6 April 1890 - St Paul, Bow Common
William Nightingale age 22 - labourer -father James Nightingale-shipwright deceased
Jane Ann Boness father Frederick Boness occ Labourer
wit Richard Johnson & Ann Emma Boness
Ooohhh that's great, his fathers name :)
Only if he is telling the truth :)
Shipwright was his occupation
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William's birth record?
NIGHTINGALE, WILLIAM HITCH
GRO Reference: 1865 D Quarter in ELY Volume 03B Page 537
I think we may be able to eliminate this one :-\
1891 was married to Helen
RG12 /1296 f54 p11
Marriages Jun 1890 Ely reg district
Deaths Dec 1896
Nightingale William age 31
Ely 3b 329
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What I am not sure about is that I have Williams Death as 1932, this may be wrong and I am not sure how I came about this date but..
On the 1901 Census Jane is Head of Household and William not noted.
On the 1911 Census Jane is Head of Household and its noted she is a Widow.
Dazie Nightingale his daughter was born in 1910 though?
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NIGHTINGALE, VIOLET MARY mmn BONESS
GRO Reference: 1912 S Quarter in WEST HAM Volume 04A Page 371
I am wondering if this child born after Jane Ann is supposedly widowed is in fact the lodgers :o
Maybe some of the others were too
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And another one
NIGHTINGALE, WILLIAM ALFRED mmn BONESS
1915 Sept Quarter in WEST HAM Volume 04A Page 327
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That could be the case for Dazie and others, I don't know when William died though ???
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Maybe
Deaths Jun qtr 1898
Nightingale William age 32
W. Ham 4a 65
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Maybe
Deaths Jun qtr 1898
Nightingale William age 32
W. Ham 4a 65
I just found the same (actually 2 but your one fits with his age and location)
NIGHTINGALE, WILLIAM 32 Order
GRO Reference: 1898 J Quarter in WEST HAM Volume 04A Page 65
NIGHTINGALE, WILLIAM 34 Order
GRO Reference: 1899 S Quarter in TENDRING Volume 04A Page 460
What this does mean is that William (1866) Is not actually my Grandfathers dad :o
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What this does mean is that William (1866) Is not actually my Grandfathers dad :o
Good job it is on your mothers side as otherwise your surname may be in doubt ;D ;D
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Thanks for your help, I may have to look into someone else a bit later as this has come to a bit of a end.
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The only William Nightingale in West Ham registration district in 1891 that would fit that 1898 death is your William. :-\
Getting the death certificate should confirm if he was your William.
The 1901 where Jane states she is married could just be covering up the fact she has young children. Please ignore it says she is widowed
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Rosie - Are we looking at the same 1901 for Jane?
The one I see is Jane as a widow with Jane, Florence, William, Annie & Frederick. Living at 48 Scott St., West Ham
Piece number 1583
Folio 78
Page 27
Have I picked up the wrong family?
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Sorry GG Yes that is the one, I had been looking at the familysearch record and not the original, don't know why I assumed she was saying she was married. I will put a line through that comment on my other post
Rosie
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Thank you both for looking into this :)
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I have had a look into this further this weekend and have been able to view some certificates.
I have my Grandfather's (George Nightingale 1906) Birth certificate and there is no father named, I also have his marriage certificate which has the father as John Nightingale which an occupation of Boilermaker.
Now we had seen that John Webb lived as a Boarder at the address according to the census and had an occupation as a Boliermaker, could this be the same person and he just didn't put his real surname on the marriage certificate? Is this something that could be done?
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He could name who he liked as his father on his marriage certificate, it would not have been checked.
Fathers names are often 'made up' on marriages to cover illegitimacy.
It is possible that John Webb helped bring him up but no evidence that he was the father of the children born after William Nightingale's death.
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That could be it, or John Webb could be a red herring and only have stayed there for a short time as the only record we have seen is the 1911 census.
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Marriages Mar qtr 1917
Nightingale Jane A
Webb John
W.Ham 4a 358
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That’s fantastic!! Thank you. I need to look into him more :)
I never found a death record for Jane Ann but never looked for Webb.
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Rosie99 and GirlGuide have found that Jane was a "widow" living at 48 Scott in the 1901 census.
John Webb the boilermaker was, in 1901, a "widower" and living at 51 Scott with his parents and siblings.
I use quotations, because if they delayed getting married until 1917, there is always the chance that one or the other wasn't really widowed, but no longer with their spouse and was waiting until they really were widowed to remarry. Very people could afford or qualify for a divorce in them there days.
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Hi Bbart,
Thank you for that.
Would you have the link or details for the 1901 Census for 51 Scott? It would be good to look at the parents that are noted as it looks like John Webb could be my Great Grandfathers dad on my mums side.
Many thanks,
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I think I have managed to find the record and it has the following living there in 1901 so the John Webb that went onto perhaps marry Jane Nightingale must be John J Webb the Head of the house as his son would not have been old enough.
John J Webb Head Male 38 Woodham Walter, Essex
Mary Webb Wife Female 32 Whitechapel, London
John Webb Son Male 7 Canning Town, Essex
Elizabeth Webb Daughter Female 6 Canning Town, Essex
Rebecca Webb Daughter Female 4 Canning Town, Essex
Henry Webb Son Male 1 Canning Town, Essex
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You are looking at the wrong entry for Scott Street in 1901, the house number is 51
Reference RG13 /Piece 1583 F72 p15
This is the family in 1901 - please ignore the name of Woodstock as it should be Webb it has been transcribed wrongly (Extracted from F M P )
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X9NC-B8J
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Thanks Rosie,
I don't know where to go to find the details of that record, to see who is listed there.
Any help or can you paste it in here if you are able to see it.
Many thanks
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Thank you :)
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You are looking at the wrong entry for Scott Street in 1901, the house number is 51
Reference RG13 /Piece 1583 F72 p15
This is the family in 1901 - please ignore the name of Woodstock as it should be Webb it has been transcribed wrongly (Extracted from F M P )
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X9NC-B8J
Thanks for that, Rosie99. I think I must be in the opposite time zones; hence my delay in getting back.
Also in the same household of 51 Scott in 1901 (probably not included in the index at either Anc or Familysearch, as it was the next page of census) are:
Joseph Webb head age 33 dock labourer, born Plaistow Essex
Emma Webb wife, 31, born Canning Town, Essex
Lily, dau, age 7 , born Canning Town, Essex
Joseph, son, age 6 born Canning Town, Essex
Elizabeth, dau, age 3, born Canning Town, Essex
Frederick, son, age 2 months, born Canning Town, Essex
It must have been a crowded house!
I think you have hit the frustrating part of family research, in that there is no way to prove or disprove who the father of the younger Nightingale children is. >:(
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Thanks for that, Rosie99. I think I must be in the opposite time zones; hence my delay in getting back.
As my profile says I am in England ;)