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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Yorkshire (West Riding) => Topic started by: jillruss on Friday 23 February 18 16:23 GMT (UK)
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I have been trying to find a birth/baptism about 1802 for my 3xgt grandmother Bathsheba Boothroyd - well, it seems like since Noah was a lad!!
19th century West Yorkshire folk seem to have had a penchant for naming their children by a surname associated with the family - often the mother's maiden name.
I have just discovered that Bathsheba's eldest daughter Mary Sykes not only named her first child Bathsheba (sadly, she died in infancy) but also called her only son Boyes (1858 Huddersfield reg District).
I've been trying to find some association between the surname Boyes and Boothroyd in this context without any success i.e. I need some help please!
Mary Sykes husband (and Boyes' father) was Godfrey Ellis - of course, the name Boyes may be associated with his side of the family and be no help at all in finding my Bathsheba Boothroyd - I can but hope! ::) ::)
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Not sure why, but I can't find any birth registration in 1857-1858 for a child called Boyes ????
Boyes Pickering - 1859 in Stockton Registration District - is the only instance I can see of Boyes 1855-1860. :-\
Added: Or are you referring to Boys Ellis - Huddersfield Registration District - 1858 - mmn = Sykes?
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As Yorkshire was a hot-bed for Non-Conformists, you may have to look there for Bathsheba's baptism.
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Hi,
Yes its the Boyes Ellis you mention. In other records he's definitely Boyes as opposed to Boys. Examples of what I mean by using presumably associated :- Mary Sykes/Ellis's niece Ann Holmes married a Smith Walton and named one of her sons Arthur Holmes Walton.
The thing I'm trying to work out is where, if anywhere, does the name Boyes (or Boys) figure in the Boothroyd/Sykes/Ellis family?
I've tried all the noncon records I can lay my hands on for Bathsheba's baptism/birth but no success.
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Yorkshire - and possibly elsewhere - use of surnames as forenames is rife, and you're probably right about Boyes being a relative. I have Fairbank, Holland, Jennings all used as forenames, plus Alison as a male forename - my great grandfather, his cousin, his brother in law and a cousin of the BiL - on my side it's possibly supposed to be Allenson/Allinson.
You'll just have to keep searching ;D
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It might not be a family name they might have name the child after a family friend or someone they respected.
I have a Fergus O'Connor Kitson born 1841 and you would think Irish connection but on father was William Kitson born Huddersfield mother was Eliza Fenton born Almondbury.
John
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You may well be right!
However, it feels like it might possibly be a clue to knocking down a very sturdy brickwall, so I'm not giving up yet!
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Good! And good luck!
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It might not be a family name they might have name the child after a family friend or someone they respected.
I have a Fergus O'Connor Kitson born 1841 and you would think Irish connection but on father was William Kitson born Huddersfield mother was Eliza Fenton born Almondbury.
I had a Feargus O'Connor Moon born to my Sussex family, who , apart from him called everyone the same range of basic traditional names that had been in the family for years.
But someone on here pointed me to the Chartist, Feargus O'Connor, and the practice of naming children after him!
see
http://www.chartistancestors.co.uk/chartist-children-1643-names/
I guess your Kitson family did the same!
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I'm not getting very far!
I can't even find a baptism for Boyes Ellis's father Godfrey Ellis (c. 1815 Dalton acc, to census). Must be yet another nonconformist lost to history!
And, of course, all that comes up when I google Boyes is the bloomin shop!!
Scream!! ::)
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Hi
Just had a quick look and it looks like Boyes Ellis was living with sister in 1881 census & died 1913 Huddersfield but age for death is slightly out.
Had a look for baptisms & marriages but nothing but 2 baptisms at Lockwood might be of interest. Tom Ellis 1862 & Edgar 1868 both son of Godfrey & Mary Ellis but Tom's baptism looks to give mothers maidenname as Hallis.
John
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Thanks, John.
I had found Boyes' death and on the census with his sister. It doesn't look as if he ever married.
Strange as it may seem, I think there was another Godfrey Ellis in the vicinity! Possibly, Godfrey was a family name and the two might have been related in some way.
I've followed my Ellis family on the censuses up to 1871 and I'm pretty sure its the right family because they have a grandson with them named Sykes Ellis (Sykes being Mary's maiden name).
This thing they had of using surnames as first names seems to have got a bit out of hand - Mary's sister Emma Sykes married a Mallinson Shaw Makin!! This is why I'm all but sure that the surname Boyes will figure somewhere in the family's past, but I still haven't cracked it!!
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Hi
A Boyes Ellis appears in the Crew passenger list but don't have the expensive ancestry so cannot look at it. Do you think he might have gone to America and then comeback.
Only other Godfrey I can find was in Halifax area, he also married a Mary in the 1830's.
Had another look at Lockwood and their is a Harriet Hellas. I might have made the wrong assumption & it might have been a misspelling & not the mothers maiden name. Could be worth looking at burials Godfrey was buried there.
John
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Having failed for years to find anything even resembling a baptism or birth for Bathsheba Boothroyd c 1802, I have - for a while now - been trying to find any proof or link up to a baptism for a Betty Boothroyd baptised in Holmfirth 18 April 1802 d/o Joseph (blacksmith) & Mary (nee Mountain).
I was hoping to find a link between the name Boyes and these Boothroyds. No luck there either!
Looks like I'll have to give it up again - at least for a while. Perhaps I'll have better luck when I get my DNA results.
Thanks for the input.
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You might find that the name Bathsheba has been written wrongly by the vicar, or deliberately changed, or the child was christened with another name.
The actual parish record of my grtgrandmother's baptism in Holmfirth in the 1860's still infuriates me. Her name was the highly unusual Hosetta but the vicar clearly didn't think it worth getting it right in his records. He just wrote a vague squiggle and added the sniping note the she was the illegitimate daughter of her named mother.
( we feel that the family had the last laugh in the face of this lofty dismissiveness, though. Hosetta went on to make a good, respectable life with a large healthy successful family, as indeed did her mother!)
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Thanks, bykerlads. A similar thought had crossed my mind - did the vicar struggle with the name Bathsheba and thought 'oh Betty will do!'
If my memory serves me right, Bathsheba was also called Bathias or Betty on other documents (1841 census, she's Bathias; on one of the baptism entries for her 5 daughters, she is named as Betty - the other 4 are all Bathsheba).
This is why I've pursued the Holmfirth baptism, and the distance between Holmfirth and Tunacliffe Hill where the Sykes lived is only about 5 or 6 miles. It would be good to get some kind of confirmation, perhaps through a DNA match though its going to be a difficult one as she had no sons.
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Hi
What happened to Mary's sisters did one of them marry a Boyes.
Bathsheba was down as Berthias in 1841 census but cannot find a Berthia Boothroyd
Could be Betty daughter of Mary baptised 1801 Huddersfield.
John
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Hi
What happened to Mary's sisters did one of them marry a Boyes.
Bathsheba was down as Berthias in 1841 census but cannot find a Berthia Boothroyd
Could be Betty daughter of Mary baptised 1801 Huddersfield.
John
Of Mary's sisters: Sarah (1825 died in infancy); Jane (1828) married a Smith (ought to be illegal!!), Sarah Ann (1833 - my line) married Richard France, and Charlotte (1839) married James Holmes - they had lots of children most with sensible names until they got to the 1880s when they called two of their sons Frederick Cavendish Holmes (1882) and Harold Shackleton Holmes (1886).
These surnames/first names are driving me mad! I shall have to delve into the significance (if any) of the Cavendish and Shackleton names. I was assuming Shackleton might have been after the explorer but, having googled him, its too early.
Interestingly, googling Frederick Cavendish brings up Lord Frederick Cavendish who was assassinated 6 May 1882 hours after arriving in Dublin as Chief Secretary for Ireland. 'My' Frederick Cavendish Holmes was born in June Q of 1882.
So, that begs the question why would Charlotte and James name their child for a politician murdered in Dublin? It all gets a bit muddy now - so please bear with me if you've read this far ::) - but my auntie (now no longer with us) suggested to me when I was asking her about the history of her and my mother's side of the family that there was an Irish connection. She thought it was my gt grandmother Sarah (her grandmother) who was Irish but I've proved her wrong by discovering that Sarah was actually born in Huddersfield and her mother before her was born in Almondbury (to the above mentioned Bathsheba).
So now I'm wondering if auntie was right all along - just got her generations a bit mixed up!
Anyone else got a headache? ;D Fascinating, though!!
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I have been trying to find a birth/baptism about 1802 for my 3xgt grandmother Bathsheba Boothroyd - well, it seems like since Noah was a lad!!
19th century West Yorkshire folk seem to have had a penchant for naming their children by a surname associated with the family - often the mother's maiden name.
Yes true but you might need to go back further in the tree to find the surname first used as a forename.
I have a surname, Sugden, that was used as a forename almost into the 20th century and on two branches of the tree. But I had to get back to the 1790s to find the origin of it as a surname.
It's a bit of a sad story, as the first Sugden forename I found was a boy (Sugden Hoyle bapt 1791) baptised the same day as his mothers funeral. It was his mothers maiden name. After that, it is used for many generations and as I said, on two branches. So your surname, used as a forename, might also be on a sideways branch (if that makes sense) and started as a forename quite a few generations further back
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The very strong tradition in West Yorks of using the mother's surname as a first name for a son, was explained to me in two ways:
- a way of emphasising the status and importance of the mother in a world where largely women had little real influence.
- a way of keeping in favour with the mother's family, especially if they had "a bit o'brass" (money)
It seemed to die out during the first half of the 20thC. But I am rather fond of the Sykes Briggs, Schofield Sykes and Mellor Barber in my own tree!
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I suppose, if I ever do manage to find a baptism for my Bathsheba, the surname/forename might come to light a few generations back. At this rate, I may never know!!
It hasn't entirely died out - one of my nieces (daughter of my brother so nee Russell) has given both her sons the middle name Russell, but then I suppose its a forename as well so perhaps it doesn't count! :-\
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The surname Boyes appears to be more prevalent in North and East Yorkshire during your time frame, not the West Riding.
My gt. grandfather carried the full name of his father's first employer. Huddersfield was known for its trade in woollens, which means farmers, trades people (some rich, some not so rich) would have travelled to and from the town and I'm wondering if either of your couple was or had been employed by a member of an out of town Boyes family as an indoor servant, or farmhand, or weaver, etc.
I had a quick look at the national archive website and had a grin when I saw a given name that competed with Bathsheba - his name was Bethell Boyes.