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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Lincolnshire => Topic started by: Wayne Cook on Saturday 17 March 18 00:03 GMT (UK)
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Hi I am looking for a Protestant ancestor "James Salter" whom previous family historians have not been able to locate.
He arrived in Australia on the Morley 2 Dec 1829
Age: 21
Occupation: weaver and butcher's labourer
Religion: Protestant
He first appeared in the Stamford Mercury 30 April 1819 page 3 Column 2 at the quarter sessions for the city of Lincoln on Saturday last .....John Sparrow and James Salter for stealing a hawser rope, the property of James Bartholomew Cuttill.
For some reason (maybe a typo) a previous family historian has his birth as about 1803 but if 21 when he arrived here it would be about 1808.
The name Robert has been passed down through our family so he probably had a sibling named Robert.
Thanks in advance
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Just having a potter about on Ancestry, and there's a lady called Cassandra Chambers in Aus who deems to have a ine that ties up with what you have, but chunks of it look a bit thi on evidence. Might be worth you contacting her, though.
Then there are some other records:
Register for the Prison Hulk Retribution, James Salter (1808) arriving from Lincoln 21/5/1829, transportation for life, but offence was stealing a silver watch (convicted Lincoln, 14/3/1829), disposed of to NSW 27/7/1829.
Convict Indents index (need Worlwide sub to see document) seems to have him arriving at Sydney Cove 2/12/1829
He may also be on the NSW Register of Conditional and Absolute Pardons
He may have married an Elizabeth Farlow
He appears to have died 17/7/1884 still in NSW
Can you get onto Ancestry Worldwide at your local library?
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Thanks, that is our James Salter. The initial post was his first offense.
PRO . Crown minute book which covers Assizes of Lent 1829 (ASSI 1 1/4)
James Salter was the first on Wednesday 18 March, charged with stealing a watch to the value of twenty shillings belonging to a John Grundy at Scampton on 24th Dec 1828
Yes he married Elizabeth Farlow 5 September 1836 at Wilberforce in NSW Australia
So far we can't find him prior to the first offense. We don't know who his parents are or when actually born/christened.
My mum is/was a direct descendant
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Jackpot! (assuming this is him)
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/155623740
"James Salter
Birth 1808
England
Death 15 Jul 1884 (aged 75-76)
Wilberforce, Hawkesbury City, New South Wales, Australia
Burial
Wilberforce Cemetery
Wilberforce, Hawkesbury City, New South Wales, Australia
Plot Portion:Right Row:14 Plot:6"
"From AustralianRoyalty.com.au:
James Salter, one of 200 convicts transported on the ship Morley, 05 August 1829.
Sentence details: Convicted at Lincoln Assizes for a term of life on 14 March 1829.
Vessel: Morley.
Date of Departure: 05 August 1829.
Place of Arrival: New South Wales."
"
Family Members
Spouse
Elizabeth Farlow Salter
1815–1887 (m. 1836)
Children
James Salter 1836–1917
William Salter 1838–1923
Robert James Salter 1841–1929
George Salter 1843–1852
Maria Salter Buttsworth 1847–1926
Henry Salter 1851–1930
John Salter 1854–1854
David Salter 1856–1923
Thomas Jerome Salter 1860–1921"
You'll need access to the Australian records to verify this lot. I've had a closer look at Cassandra's tree and ... weeeelllll... there are some very strange details indeed on there. Nuff said in public.
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Thanks for the information but I already have it and have received it from a Salter Family Historian (I am in contact with Cedric Salter and Susan Langham (nee: Downting)) with NSW BDM records attached.
I like to do my own research with information provided as yes some don't add up.
As said,
I am trying to find his family back in England of which we have not been able to locate any information on (including his baptism/christening)
Kind Regards,
Wayne
PS. I don't trust Find a grave as I have had to rectify information on it myself. They had my great grandmother's brother's middle name wrong even though he has a headstone with it on it.
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Yeah that's why I looked more closely at Cassandra's theories. However, she insists that our felonious friend is Ethel James (?!), and that his father, without substantiation, is baptised 2 years before his own birth, in places a couple of hundred miles apart. Further, the evidence of the birth and marriage of our chap's parents comes from the WW1 attestation papers of a(nother) James Salter ... My brain now hurts and I'm going to bed.
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Thanks for the help.
Yes family research can do this.
I like to see evidence (until then they are leads) although if, say 3 or more things point to it being the correct person it looks more likely it is the correct lead.
Night
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Check out familysearch which has
James Salter bp 17 Jun 1806 Lincoln, Samuel Salter & Anne Townhill Salter.
They have a couple of other daughters baptised about this time, when you click on the film no. and search by surname only for this period.
Lincs to the Past, are the online original records for parish records. Cheers
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Thanks,
I will check it out.
I have found
James's Salter 1806 St Swithin parents are Samuel Salter and Anne Townhill
also at St Swithin
Robert Salter 25 March 1802 parents Samuel and Jane
Marie Salter 25 July 1801 parents Henry and Elizabeth
Henry Salter 19 Sept 1803 parents Henry and Elizabeth
Anne Salter 29 Nov 1803 parents Samuel and Anne
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ok I will add these to the list both with parents of Samuel and Ann like the James in 1806
Mary Ann Salter 16 March 1801
Anne Salter 29 Nov 1803
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There are some records with different spellings.
The marriage at St Swithin, Lincoln, on 21st June 1800 has the names as Samuel Saulter and Ann Towing.
A witness was Henry Salter. Henry Saulter (signed as Salter), married Elizabeth Towning on 25th August 1800
An Ann Towning was baptised in North Scarle on 19th March 1775, daughter of Thomas and Elizabeth.
Elizabeth Towning was baptised there on 27th November 1768 and Mary on 10th February 1771
Thomas Towning married Elizabeth Haxton at North Scarle on 18th April 1764.
David
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Thanks, I will add these to the possible list
I wonder if there are any other James Salter born in or close to 1808 in Lincoln
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https://www.freereg.org.uk/search_records/581899cee93790ec8bc6a1a5?search_id=5aaf822af4040b9e22477797&ucf=false
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He may not be a Lincolnshire man of course, just because he was convicted there. My gt gt grandfathers first wife was frequently convicted in Stamford, Grantham and Lincoln. She lived in Nottinghamshire but was born in Middlesex...
Have you checked out the newspapers, a silver watch would have been a costly item.
The above link is the only one coming up on Freereg, for Lincolnshire.
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I am told that his convict papers say native Place Lincoln but will re-check.
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Two more reports, in case you may not have seen them:
From The Nottingham Journal 28 March 1829:-
LINCOLN ASSIZES - At Lincoln Assizes judgement of death was recorded against...James Salter and Samuel Seaton, for robbing John King, of Lincoln, of a watch.
From The Stamford Mercury 22 May 1829:-
Of the 17 capital convicts against whom sentences of death was recorded at the Lent assizes, twelve are sentenced to be transported for life...sent from the Castle for Sheerness, by way of steamboat from Hull:- ... and James Salter, for the term of their natural lives
Samuel Seaton and James Salter were also tried for High Robbery but James was acquitted.
David
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Thanks, that might explain this conditional pardon https://www.records.nsw.gov.au/searchhits_nocopy?id=65&surname=salter&firstname=james&alias=&remarks=&recordtype=0&vessel=0&year= The information I have says " Wednesday 18 March, charged with stealing a watch to the value of twenty shillings belonging to a John Grundy at Scampton on 24th Dec 1828" I will see what is on his convict papers.
do you have a reference for the High Robbery one?
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There are five images on Findmypast relating to his conviction and also for Samuel Seaton, who was also transported.
We are not supposed to give the full details but I think you can access them for some credits.
David
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dcbnwh (David) on the "Morley" was also a John Sparrow. A John Sparrow was mention in the 1819 incident with James Salter so looking like he may have been part of a gang of thieves who ended up on the same ship. John Sparrow and Samuel Seaton have Lincoln (city) Assizes and James Salter has Lincoln Assizes https://convictrecords.com.au/ships/morley/1829
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I have a cousin looking into whether James's surname should have been Slater instead of Salter (as Slater is a known error in the family in Australia).
I have located a Slater family in Holbeach Lincoln
James Slater m Elizabeth Thimbleby 2 October 1807 Holbeach, Lincoln
James Slater christened 14 Feb 1809 Holbeach, Lincoln
Henry Slater christened 12 Dec 1810 Holbeach, Lincoln
William Slater christened 3 April 1812 Holbeach, Lincoln
John Slater christened 20 Oct 1813 Holbeach, Lincoln
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The spelling on the register is Slator and James was buried in Holbeach in 1838. John Slator was also buried there in 1838 and William in 1820.
David
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Although people did travel in those days, Holbeach would not be considered "local" to Lincoln, being over 40 miles away. Scampton is 5-6 miles from Lincoln in the opposite direction.
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Thanks for the above information.
Even now there is confusion regarding the two families. My dad's sister just passed away (the last of my deceased dad's siblings) and apparently her husband's mother was a Slater. My mum was a Salter plus I believe the Slater and Salter families also married into each other's families over here.