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Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Caernarvonshire => Wales => Caernarvonshire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: Bruce McAlister on Monday 02 April 18 23:52 BST (UK)
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Trying to locate which cemetery my mother is buried in back February 1965, I was 10 years old at the time and my father wouldn't allow myself and my younger brother to attend the funeral service.
At the time we were living at 14 Glanmorfa Terrace, Tremadoc, Wales. I have been told that the cemetery was to the west of where we lived.
My mother's name is Catherine McAlister [formelry Jones] born 20 October 1926 and died 17 February 1965.
Her mother's name is Icasius Jones [formerlly Williams] and her father's name is William Williams and he was a Police Officer at Tremadoc.
My mum's parents were married 6 September 1922 and there address was 9 Market Square, Tremadoc.
I'm aware that mum had two brothers, Gwillym and Charles, unsure if there any more siblings, Charles died during World war II in Canada.
After mum died my father emigrated to Australia in May 1965, and this is where I still reside.
I would like to know where my mother is buried. My youngest daughter is currently working and living in London and once I know which cemetery my mother is buried in my daughter can go and visit. My daughter has already tried to locate but with no success, however she has been successful in finding the house where I lived.
I do have my mother's birth and death registration details.
Can somebody provide some guidance and advice on how I can find which cemetery my mother is buried in?
Also I would like to make contact with any descendants from my Mother's side of the family.
Regards
Bruce McAlister
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Welcome to RootsChat :)
Another thread on the same subject may help http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=439578.0
Kay
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Hi Kay,
Thank you for your reply and information, I shall follow through on that. Living in Queensland, Australia I have no idea in relation to where Bangor or Caernarfon are in respect to Tremadog or Pwll, as I don't have a map of that area, it is like a foreign language to me.
Again thank you for your assistance.
Regards
Bruce :) :) :D
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Try this map which does show the local area . http://maps.nls.uk/view/101607216
The largest cemetery looks to be Moel y Gest public cemetery but it is too the south west of Tremadoc http://maps.nls.uk/view/101607216#zoom=4&lat=4033&lon=4416&layers=BT
Kay
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You could contact the Gwynedd Family History Society http://www.gwyneddfhs.co.uk/ They have a list of publications which includes memorial inscriptions http://www.gwyneddfhs.co.uk/publications.pdf
Kay
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Hi,
I was also confused in trying to find cemeteries in the area and put a post on Rootschat in Jan 2014 "Cemeteries around Portmadoc".
I had replies which assisted me and one from a local Rootschatter - EmyrBorth - who has lived in the area all his life, has a great deal of local knowledge, and was extremely helpful. I am sure if you were to send him a personal message he would do all he could to assist you.
I don't think you can send personal messages until you have made at least 3 posts but this should easily be within your grasp.
Hope this helps to get you an answer.
Alan
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Hi
There seems to be be a few of us who have had difficulty finding the burial place of our relatives who lived in the Porthmadog area. From the description of the cemetery being West of Tremadog it sounds very much like the one where my Grandparents are buried. Emyrborth was a great help in me finding it. http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=779135.0
The cemetery is Bethel Cemetery, Golan. It is rather remote so if your daughter is visiting she will need transport.
Directions are leaving the roundabout near Tremadog take the A487 towards Caernarfon, about a mile or so past the village of Penmorfa there is a road on the right signed Cwmstraddlyn, after about another half mile the cemetery is on the left hand side.
I checked the MI's for Moel y Gest, Capel y Garth, St John, Capel Salem and St Mair Tremadog and there was no record of your mother's gravestone. As Tall Al suggested put another message up and then you can personal message Emyrborth since he has a lot more MI records.
Glyn
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Bethel Cemetery from Google Street
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@52.9503228,-4.1845252,3a,75y,284.76h,70.4t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1smBcYKGa7HG1c7a9Cc3c9Jg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
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Hi there Kay,
Thank you very much for sending a copy of the map, greatly appreciated. You have been a huge help.
Thank you.
:) ;) :D
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Hi there Kay,
Thank you for the thread for another link, I shall followup on that. Once again thank you for your assistance greatly appreciated. It feels like I might be getting somewhere after all these years.
Regards
Bruce
:) ;) :D
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Hi there Alan,
Thank you for that information, how do I get in contact with EmyrBroth through the personal message. How do I send a personal message.
Once again thank you for your assistance.
Regards
Bruce
:) :D
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Hi there Glyn,
Thank you very much for that information about the cemetery 'Bethel' at Golan, greatly appreciated. Thank you for the directions as well, once I know for sure that my mother is buried there I will pass on the directions to my daughter Danielle so that she can visit. I have sent a PM to EmyrBorth asking for assistance.
Thank you very much for checking the MI's for a record of my mother's gravestone at Moel y Gest, Capel y Garth, St John, Capel Salem and St Mair Tremadog. Greatly appreciated.
Pardon my ignorance but was does MI's stand for, I can make a number of guesses and I might get one of them correct, could you please enlighten me. Thank you.
Regards
Bruce
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Hi Bruce
Apologies for using the abbreviation MI which is short for "Memorial Inscription" and refers to the Gwynedd Family History Society publications of gravestone inscriptions that Kay99 mentioned. Unfortunately GFHS they have not produced one for Bethel Cemetery. The only other cemetery I can think of, which I haven't got is Pentrefelin, but I am guessing Emyr will have this. However, if there is no gravestone it will not appear in any of these publications.
The monumental masons in Porthmadog may be worth contacting to see if they have a record. I believe they are now called Madog Memorials, Madoc Street West, Porthmadog, LL49 9DU. Tel no. 01766 515206.
Glyn
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Hi there Glyn,
Thank you for your prompt reply and for the information about the abbreviation MI, no need for apologies.
Who controls the Bethel Cemetery? Does it belong to the Council, or the public, or the Church or a Chapel? Whoever controls the cemetery would they have records of who is buried at the Bethel Cemetery.
Thank you very much for the information and contact details of the monumental masons in Porthmadog, greatly appreciated.
Regards
Bruce
:) ;)
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Hi Bruce
You could try the Gwynedd County Council. Website https://www.gwynedd.llyw.cymru/en/Residents/Births-marriages-deaths/Deaths-cemeteries-crematorium/Crematorium-and-cemeteries.aspx
The only problem I can see is Bethel is not listed on the page but hopefully they can point you to the right authority. I know Dolbenmaen Community Council is responsible for the upkeep of the graveyard.
Glyn
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Hi there Glyn,
Once again thank you, hopefully that information will be fruitful and either confirm or remove the Brthel Cemetery from the list, I shall get my daughter whilst she is living and working in London to do some chasing up.
Thank you.
Regards
Bruce
:) ;)
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Hi Bruce
Just to emphasis that your daughter should state that it is Bethel Cemetery, GOLAN she is after since there is another graveyard Capel Bethel (Chapel) Graveyard near Penrhos to the west of Pwllheli.
This link has a map. http://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/1815902
All the best
Glyn
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Hi there Glyn,
Thank you for that information, I shall pass on to my daughter. Thank you for the link to the map, greatly appreciated.
Kind Regards
Bruce
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Good afternoon
Bethel cemetery Golan is looked after by the local community council - here are the contact details for the Council Clerk (she does all the admin for the council). These details are available in the public form.
Liz Watkin
Tyn Lôn
Bethel
Caernarfon
LL55 1UW
(01248) 671243 neu 07799026791
cyngordolbenmaen@btinternet.com
I know that she deals with the cemetery as I have dealt with her - my grand parents are buried there. It is a very small cemetery and I would suspect that there is a headstone as there are very few graves without there. If I have time I will have a wander up there and see if I can find her for you.
There is also another small cemetery where she could be and this is the Beuno Sant Public Cemetery, Penmorfa this is operated by the local councty council and their contact number is 01766 771000 or their email is GalwGwynedd@gwynedd.llyw.cymru
Regards
Nesta
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Hi there Nesta,
Thank you very much for those details on the Bethel Cemetery Golan and also the details on the Beuno Sant Public Cemetery, Penmorfa, greatly appreciated. Your information has given me some hope that I will find out where my mother is buried.
I shall pass the information that you have provided to me onto my daughter who is currently in London and get her to follow up.
If you do get the time to wonder up there and have a look it would be greatly appreciated, thank you.
Your assistance is greatly appreciated.
Kind Regards
Bruce :) ;) :D
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Hi Bruce
Anytime ... if she’s buried in the area the grave can be found . I’ll see what I can do
Nesta
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Hi there Nesta,
Thank you very much, greatly appreciated. If mum's grave can be found it would be fantastic, you don't know how much that it will mean to me, if found I will be eternally greatfull.
Thank once again.
Kind Regards
Bruce :) ;) :D
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Hi
Have received PM from Bruce. Have checked the MI booklets I have and also other surrounding cemeteries on microfiche at Caernarfon Archives. Also checked newspapers at Caernarfon and Bangor University, and made local enquiries. Newspaper reports say that funeral service took place at Tremadog churchyard; but there is no cemetery there. Have been speaking on the phone this afternoon with someone who had 2 daughters in same class as Bruce's brother. She tells me she was buried at Bethel, Golan and that there was a small gravestone on the grave, but that it seems to have disappeared. I'm sending an e-mail to the clerk of the Community Council to enquire.
Emyr
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Hi there Emyr,
Thank you for what you have done in your research in trying to find where my mother is buried, you have done a considerable amount of work, spent a considerable amount of time searching, it is greatly appreciated.
To look through the MI booklets, microfiche at Caemarfon Archives, checking through newspapers at Caemarfon and Bangor University, and making local enquiries would have taken a considerable amount of your time, I'm eternally grateful for your efforts and time and for assisting me in trying to find where my mother is buried, I don't know how I could ever repay you for what you have done.
Is there any chance of getting a copy of the newspaper report that has the notice of the funeral service taking pace at Tremadog, and which Church?
Your efforts are greatly appreciated, it is some comfort that it looks like that my mum was buried at Bethel, Golan, now it is a matter to try and establish the burial spot [grave]
That is good news, thank you ever so much, greatly appreciative of what you have done.
Kind Regards
Bruce
email: buzzman55@gil.ocm.au
:) :D ;D
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Hi Bruce
Popped up to Bethel this over the weekend but couldn’t find anything visible . As a long shot also checked the small church yard in Penmorfa but nothing there either .
Fantastic work Emyr .... you don’t think it could be Dolbenmaen ?
Nesta
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Hi there Nesta,
Thank you very much for taking the time out of your life and for your effort to have a look at the Bethel cemetery, Golan for my mother's grave, over the weekend, it is very much greatly appreciated.
On the work done by Emyr it appears that my mother is buried at the Bethel cemetery, Golan however, the gravestone is now missing and that Emyr is contacting the Clerk of the Community Council to enquire as to where her grave is located at that cemetery.
Your efforts are eternally grateful, I don't know how I can repay you. It would be so nice to know where my mother is buried. And one day I would love to be able to go and visit and see where my mother is buried. That will take some years before I can save enough money to afford that trip.
But again thank you for assistance, you don't know how much this means to me.
Kind Regards
Bruce
:) ;) :D ;D
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Hi
Been out running with the local running club tonight. Whilst I was out I received an e-mail from the clerk of the Dolbenmaen Community Council confirming that she is buried at Bethel Cemetery, and giving info re position of grave and name of person buried in the next grave. I'll go there tomorrow to hav a look.
Emyr
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Hi there Emyr,
Thank you very much for that information. That is wonderful news. I'm so happy that I now know which cemetery my mother is buried in. I look forward to knowing where here grave site is. If as you said previously that the small gravestone has gone missing is correct, I will need to organise to replace.
Thank you ever so much for your time, effort and assistance in finding where my mother is buried. I'm eternally grateful, I don't know how I can repay you for what you have done. Thank you for your help, it is tremendous.
Kindest Regards
Bruce
:) ;) :D ;D
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Good news Emyr ... I will be interested to know where it is if you would like to pm me. Well done for all your hard work ....we must try and get to the bottom of our dna match one day 😂
Nesta
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Bruce .... So pleased that you will finally have some closure .... should decide on replacing the stone don’t rely on the internet - contact me to get the names of local ones . I’m sure Emyr would say the same .
Nesta
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Hi there Nesta,
I'm eternally grateful for your assistance, it is relief to finally know which cemetery that my mother is buried at, and that shortly I will know the whereabouts at the cemetery which is my mother's grave. My brother at the time 7 and myself 10 were not allowed by our father to attend the funeral service.
Thank you for your offer to provide the names of companies that could replace the grave/head stone. It is my desire for this to happen however, I will need to discuss with my brother Brian.
I'm ever so gratefull for your assistance and the assistance from Emyr, it is so pleasant and nice to know of that there are people who are so willing to assist total strangers, thank you.
I can't thank you enough, my brother and I now can pass on the information to our children as to where our mother is buried.
Kind Regards
Bruce
:) ;) :D ;D
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Hi
Good news, been up to Bethel this morning and found the grave. There's a new gravestone on it, probably placed after the information in the Monument Inscription booklet was recorded. The grave is covered with 2 slate slabs, surrounded by slate kerb and with a slate headstone, all on a concrete base. Slate is the traditional material for this area and looks better in my opinion than the material that's taken over, and the work and material is of good quality.
She is buried in her parents grave: William Jones, Institute, Tremadog, died 21/10/1940, aged 54yrs, and his wife Jennie Jones, died 15/06/1948, aged 52yrs. (this part of the inscription is in Welsh).
It goes on in English:
Also their daughter CATHERINE, beloved wife of COLIN McALISTER and mother of BRUCE & BRIAN. Passed away February 17. 1965, aged 38 years.
MY LOVE.
At the bottom there's a Welsh couplet:
"Eu henwau'n perarogli sydd,
A'û hun mor dawel yw."
There's a white stone flower holder on the grave with flowers a few weeks old in it. The word "MAM"
(MOTHER) and initials "EW" are painted on it.
Will make further enquiries re possible relations living in the area, and will contact you by PM as living or recently dead persons can not be named on the Public Board.
Emyr
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Hi there Emyr,
Thank you very much for your assistance, I can't respond fully to your email as I'm too emotional. When I read the information I just breakdown, it is very raw at the moment. When I have settled and calmed down I shall respond fully to you.
However, thank you very much for all the work, time and effort that you have put into finding this information for me, my younger brother and our respective families, it is greatly appreciated. Any chance of obtaining a photo.
Shall respond again hopefully within a day or two.
Kindest Regards
Bruce
:) ;) :D ;D
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Hi
Bit 'pissed' at the moment, been enjoying an Australian wine and going for a walk before it gets dark to 'clear my head'! Bethel cemetery or Minffordd was the obvious choice for the year of death, but various issues complicated the research. Can't name people still alive or recently dead on the Public Board, but without information from and co-operation of, a number of local contacts, and a bit of luck, I would probably, partly because of mis-infomation, not succeeded. 'nestagj' is more knowledgeable about Dolbenmaen area than me. She is related to me according to DNA test, but I can't find the connection - my father and his mother were both 'illegitimate' which complicates the situation! I'll contact her to see how we can further help you.
Will contact you by PM in next few days.
EMYR
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Hello both
Yes will help in anyway I can .. I have an illegitimate grandmother too Emyr 😂 enjoy the wine you deserve it !
Can you pm me the grave location I’ll try and get a picture over the weekend .
My grandparents and uncle are there too so I’ll take some flowers for them 😄 I’ll put sone on your mum too Bruce !
Nesta
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Hi
Have sent you PM re 2 cousins of yours living in the area - will contact them. Also report of your mother's death.
Reports of funeral and move to Australia:
Caernarvon & Denbigh Herald Fri. Feb. 26th 1965:
PORTMADOC - FUNERAL:
The funeral took place on Saturday at Tremadoc Churchyard, of Mrs Catherine McAllister, 14 Glanmorfa Terrace, Tremadoc. The officiating ministers were the vicar, I Morgan Jones, and the Rev. T J Morris. The chief mourners were Mr Percy McAllister (husband) and two young sons, Bruce and Brian.
CAERNARVON & Denbigh HERALD Friday 14/05/1965
PORTMADOC - FOR AUSTRALIA:
Mr Colin McAlister and his 2 children, Bruce and Brian, of Glanmorfa Terrace, Trefadoc, left on Saturday for Australia, where they intend to live in future. On the previous Sunday at Seion Chapel, Penmorfa, the Sunday School Supt. Mr E A Morgan, on behalf of the Sunday School, presented Bruce and Brian with a bible. They are wished every success in their new home.
Your father's name appears as Percy and Colin.Did he have a middle name?
The reports also appear in Yr Herald Cymraeg, the Welsh version of the C&D. Info is same in both, except that instead of Tremadoc Churchyard, in Welsh you have Mynwent Tremadog (Tremadoc Cemetery)
Emyr
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Hi
Sent you e-mail address of a cousin of yours, who I can't name on Public Board. Have you contacted him ?
Emyr
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Good afternoon - finally managed to get some pictures for you = the flowers look about a week old so it looks like someone puts flowers there regularly.
Can you pm me your email address.
Regards
nesta