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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Argyllshire => Topic started by: Genetrix on Wednesday 04 April 18 16:00 BST (UK)
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Does anyone know how I could find records of ancestors from Islay moving to Canada in the mid 1800's. Would there be any immigration records in Scotland that far back?
Any help would be appreciated.
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Have a read at https://www.islayinfo.com/islay-genealogy.html
more specifically about emigration from the island at
https://www.islayinfo.com/leaving-islay-history-of-islay-emigrations.html
Some estate papers are held at the Mitchell Library in Glasgow, some records are at the Council Archives in Lochgilphead and at Glasgow University Business Archives - others are scattered about in different places, very few appear to have remained on the island.
There were very few passenger lists especially early on as they were not a legal requirement and even later very few left directly from the island but moved to the likes of Glasgow to board ships there.
Unfortunately my own experience is pretty much of finding experts at putting up brick walls - very thick brick walls ::)
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Thanks Falkyrn for the information. Interesting reading but doesn't look likely that I'll trace the ancestors. Canadian records are hard to use as they expect you to know such things as the name of the ship and date, etc. Quite ridiculous of course. If I knew that, I wouldn't need to look it up at all.
Genetrix
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Unfortunately even the Islay Family History Group closed its doors a few years ago although their records & research work were handed over to the Gaelic College (The Columba Centre) in Bowmore - they may be worth an email
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Thanks again Falkyrn. I've googled The Columbia Centre so will now send them an email.
Genetrix
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Any idea where in Canada they went? Some surnames? A large group, including names like FLETCHER, MCCUAIG etc., arrived from Islay to near me in Oro Township, Simcoe County, Ontario about the 1820s, I believe.
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Hello Argyllshiregirl: I'm doing this for a friend whose having a problem with her computer. Name of couple from Islay was Peter McArthur and wife Flora McEachern. Peter seems to have been born around 1813 and I think Flora was 1825. Don't know if they married in Islay or in Canada. I think Peter first came to Pickering, Ontario and ended up in Oro, Simcoe County. I see you have McArthur on your list and wonder if there's a connection there.
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http://www.bac-lac.gc.ca/eng/discover/immigration/immigration-records/immigrants-before-1865/Pages/list.aspx?Surname=McArthur&&p_ID=15
7461 McARTHUR Peter 1838, 1839
Might be him.
Don
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Thanks Don. Could quite likely be him as my friend has discovered he purchased land in Oro, Simcoe County (Canada) in 1840.
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Hello
Peter McArthur is my great-grandfather. Genetrix posted some information on him, for me, while my computer was down. He was born in Islay, Scotland around 1813 and came to Canada - probably in the late 1830's. He worked for a short time for a Squire in what is now present day Shanty Bay, Ontario. In 1840 he purchased land on the 5th Conc. of Oro Twp., Ontario. He married a Flora McEachern and they had one son. He died on January 12, 1858 and is buried at Knox Presbyterian Cemetery in Oro. Flora was born approximately 1825 in Islay and died July 15, 1895 - also buried at Knox. As I am going to Islay this summer, I am most interested in finding the names of their parents. In the Canada Census of 1881 there was an Elizabeth McArthur living at the farm in Oro and it says she is 77 years old. I have no idea what relation she is if any.
Many thanks for any information you can provide
Marlid
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Marlid,
There are 11 Peter's baptised on Islay between 1810-1820 in those parishes which represent Islay.
These are not all the births only those baptised and not everyone was including my McArthur's who were not.
The parishes are Bowmore-Kilarrow, Kilchoman, Kildalton, Kilmeny, Oa and Portnahaven.
The original OPR documents can be viewed online for a small fee at https://www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk but you can see the above, their parents and their baptismal dates without having to download the actual image. So you could do a lot of digging in advance of your trip.
I am not sure which 1881 Census you are looking at but on the original I see Charles (72), Gilbert (25), Flora (55) and Elizabeth (77). Then there is a John/Margaret and their 4 children above.
Enjoy your trip.
Don
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Hello Don
Thank you for all the information. I will definitely check it. I am especially interested in looking again at the Canada Census for 1881 - the copy I have only lists Gilbert, Flora and Elizabeth so I will definitely have another look at it. I am surprised there were so many living at the farm house back then. My grandfather died when my father was 9, so unfortunately he didn't get to learn about the family history from his father.
Thanks again
Marlid
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nearest Peter McArthur born islay to yours is Peter 18th april 1814 in avinvogie, killarrow,
parents are donald McArthur and Margaret (peggy) McKerrol,
also a brother Duncan born 25th july 1812
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Hello Raunoll4
Thank you for all the information you have sent to me and to Genetrix about my McArthur ancestors from Islay. It is very much appreciated. I wish I known this information when I visited Islay last September. I believe the information you sent to Genetrix about Gilbert McArthur and Catherine Gilchrist are my great-great grandparents. The names and dates match up. I will continue to look into this information. I have a relative visiting Scotland this month and will suggest she visit Islay and all this should be very helpful to her.
Once again - many thanks
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your very welcome my own familly come from islay the records are there on islay in bowmore i believe
on here there is a freddie bell my cousin
he lives there and i m sure he d tell you where to view the records,
but this is the link i downloaded them from
http://sites.rootsweb.com/~sctislay/~tlarson/bdm/
only to happy to help
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Hi
once more is there anymore detail you can give me on Flora Mceachern
there is 3 fits her detail in Islay births
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Hi
might be missing something here i m looking at simcoe 1881 census Flora Macarthur
and on the same page there is 2 Macarthurs who could be Flora s sons John and Gilbert,
also a familly Gilchrists
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Hello Raunoll4
Great to hear from you again
About Flora McArthur (nee McEachern), Genetrix found some information on the 1841 Scottish Census for a Flora McEachern that matches her birth date.
It has the following information County: Argyllshire (ARL) Place: Kildalton. Civil Parish: Kildalton and House or Street Name: Kilbride. It shows a Neil McEachern, Age 65, Occupation: Agriculture Labourer Birth County: ARL then Annabella McEachern, Age 50, Birth County ARL, and Flora McEachern, Age 15 Birth County ARL. Flora’s birthdate matches with my great-grandmother. If it is her, she probably immigrated to Canada with relatives other than her parents because her father was 65 at this time.
I know she is buried at Knox Presbyterian Cemetery, Oro but when I go onto their website her grave does not come up. I have just spoken to one of their board members and he has a book from the church called Kith and Kin. He is going to go through it to see if he can find who her relatives were. Also I know where she is buried in the cemetery, so I will ask them to add it to their website.
On the 1881 Canadian Census Flora’s is Item #3697935 District 139, Family #137 – she was 55. Gilbert McArthur on the same Census is her son. He was born 1856, his is Item # 3697937, Family #137
There is also an Elizabeth McArthur, Item #3697936, Family #137, Age: 77. I believe she is my great-grandfather – Peter McArthur’s sister Elispy born October 19, 1801, Islay, Scotland. I know the year of birth doesn’t match but the Census then was not as accurate as it is now – also I have been told my McArthur Scottish ancestors only spoke Gaelic – so there would also have been the language problem.
John McArthur on the 1881 Census, Item #3697925, Age 27, could be Charles McArthur’s son. Charles is probably my great-grandfather’s brother. Here again the birth date from the Canadian Census and the Scottish Census do not agree – one says 1809 and the other 1806. It shows his occupation as Gailer – do you know if that is a Gaelic word? I don’t know what it means. John had 3 children in 1881 – Jane Age 4, Caroline 2 and infant Charles, born Feb, 1881. After that John and his wife Margaret and their infant son just seem to disappear. In the Canadian 1891 Census I have found his daughter Jane Age 14 and Caroline Age 12 living with a Charles McArthur, Age 62 and Jane his wife Age 70. It shows “L” for relationship to head of the family which may mean Legal guardian so perhaps they are the grandparents and not the Charles McArthur I previously referenced – he (my relative) is Item #3697933 on the 1881 Census.
I have been unable to find any Gilchrist’s in Oro-Medonte, Ontario that would match up with my family unless I am missing something.
Thank you once again for your interest and help
Kindest regards
Marlid
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Hi Marlin
good to hear still hard at it first gailer you ll find is actually jailer,
and your most probably correct they would only have spoke gaelic most
islanders in Scotland still use gaelic as their first language when speaking amongst themselves
even to this day can be quite funny at times imagine yourself asking 2 locals directions 1 replies
to you in english and the other contradicts using gaelic who s directions do you follow,
L on the census most likely indicates lodger that does nt mean they re not grand kids,
i went through the islay births for Flora and found 2 that could be her the fact they gave her
age at time of death in years and months would mean who ever registered her death knew
what month she was born and that suggests late january or february so ill look again as
there is Flora births for those months and approx year i looked at the 15 year old and i thought
could be living with grandparents,
i went through the oro,simcoe census's back to 1841 and my opinion is there was a mass exodus
of MacArthers and Gilchrists left islay for Canada, tracing them tells me they are all connected as they are all on the same pages in they census,
so far i can find no Flora MacEachern on the 1841or 51 Simcoe census which suggests she went to Canada sometime in between 41 and 51 and married inside that time frame in saying that i ve still to check islay 51 census to see if she s still there,
i cant remember if i sent you the link to where i get my info if not i ll send it
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Hi
attachment has the 2 best option in islay births for flora
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the 2 most likely candidates
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the tirvagarn Flora the mother is Flora Currie
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Hello Raonull4
This is similar to solving a puzzle. I have gone on line to look at Islay maps and also one I brought home with me when I visited and I cannot find Tirvagarn - is this a village or town on Islay. As I think it is almost certain my great grandfather was from Kildalton, I suspect she would have been from there as well. It might even have been an arranged marriage - for that reason I am leaning towards the Flora from Kildalton. However, there are a number of Currie families in Oro - originally from Scotland - so because the mother's name is Currie, the other one could be her. Do you know if Tirvagarn is near Kildalton. It would be interesting to know if she was still in Scotland in 1851.
Looking forward to hearing from you
Marlid
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It may be an idea to list the children in order of birth to Peter & Flora which may be of help if the Scottish naming pattern was used?
Annie
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Morning
Tirvagarn is most likely a farm name, i ll pose that question to Freddie my cousin
he still lives on Islay,
to answer the naming question im a Ronald from a long line of Ronalds and Malcolms every generation of my familly has both back to 1806,
the tirvagarn familly looks to have disappeared on the 1851 census, there is McEacherns there but its a different familly
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Marlin
i can t find an Annabell in births or marriages only that 1 on showing on the 41 census
1 possibilty is its a Jura familly thats moved over onto Islay, other possibilty is she was also known as Hannah or simply Anne thats happened in my own familly
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an offer of land if Donald McEachern moves from Islay to Canada 1943
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Tirvagarn shows as a farm on the Islay rentals, also shows up as Torvagan
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i think this is tirvagarn when i zoom in futher there is 1 large farm building
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think this is the farm as it is now
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this is Ballychatrigan
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do not laff
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Hello Raonull4
I tried checking the 1851 Canada Census to see if Flora McEachern was on it. The Census for Simcoe County is not online. I have just spoken to the Simcoe County Office and have been told it doesn't exist and they don't know why. I have emailed Knox Presbyterian Church in Oro to see if they have a parishioner's list back that far. I know the church sermons were held in Gaelic up until I believe around the turn of the century so hopefully their records are not in Gaelic.
Marlid
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Hi Marlin
i ve been accessing the the census for oro, simcoe,
the pictures i ve put on is what Ballychatigrin and tirvagrin looks like at present times
apparentlly Ballychatigrin was an old norse settlement,
the paragraph about donald mceachern is from a letter from Canada to islay 1843
i think the letter came from elgin but simcoe is mentioned,
i access canadian census records on this site
https://www.bac-lac.gc.ca/eng/census/Pages/census.aspx
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sorry your correct 51 is missing would be that one
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Hopefully Knox Church will have some records. The church is now closed but there is a board looking after it. Oro or Oro-Medonte as it is now called has seen a lot of development recently and the old timers are now long gone. There are some books about the township of Oro but nothing I could find relating to my great grandmother. I have a photo that I think is of them and I am wondering if I should post it. Thank you for the maps - can you tell from the map if the farm is near Kildalton or is it closer to Bowmore.
Marlid
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ballychatigrin is tirvagrin is slightly higher
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It may be an idea to list the children in order of birth to Peter & Flora which may be of help if the Scottish naming pattern was used?
I had a PM from Marlid...
Peter & Flora had only 1 son named Gilbert...
My question looked to have been unanswered & not of any help to others following the thread with an interest or trying to help.
Annie
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Hi Annie
i m researcbing Islay almost daily and islay familly names continued to be handed down
for a long time specially where large groups of Islay folk moved at the same time which seems to be
the case in my own familly, and when looking at emigration to Canada i ve noticed that large groups
of 20 and 30 where paid for by only one person either it was assisted passage or it was familly groups
all related in some way ie cousins inlaws paying via an agent,
i believe this to be the case with Marlins familly, looking at the census years for those i know to be her familly there consistantly appears a close link to other familly surnames from Islay ie Gilchrist,
MacArther all on the same census pages, unfortunately emigration to Canada from Islay pre 1865
isnt greatly recorded,
the way i look at is brick walls where made to be knocked down and it can be rewarding doing it
so don t give up.
Ronnie
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hi Marlin
i ve came across a donald mceachern born 1834 ballychatigrin, Islay in oro, simcoe,
found him on McEachern genealogy wiki tree, could be from flora familly,
what it does tell us is that there s a MacArthur Mceachen connection both in Islay and in oro
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Hello Raonull4
I have heard back from someone at Knox Church and he is checking some records for me. I also know the library in the city where I live has records about Oro and Simcoe county - I will try to get there next week to see if they have anything. I will check out the Donald McEachern you refer to.
I will be out most of the week-end celebrating Easter with family so you may not hear from me until next week.
Marlid
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Hello - I have been checking McEachern family history online and was viewing information on https://maceachernfamily.info/ontario/simcoe.html. I found a John M'Eachren born 1793 in Scotland - note the different spelling of the name. There were 5 children - one daughter named Flora born Islay, Scotland - no birth date given. He had a son John born in Islay in 1847 - he married in Edgar in Oro Twp. Edgar is a village very close to what was my great-grandfather's farm. On this site the spelling of the name is used both ways McEachern and M'Eachren - I am wondering if this was her family.
Marlid
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hi
forget the donald i ve found more info on him he was born mcInnis illegitamite
but there is a neil born in oro,
i ll see if i can find the 1793 and 1847 that might give me something to work on
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i m laffin at this one bells my familly name
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hi
i ll have to let you guess where Ann the daughter of the John McEachern and
euphemia Darroch was born in 1832,
HeHeHe
i would nt be that rotten it was Tirvaigain,
thats the only one listed but i ll check the 41 census
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Euphemia
even if that flora isnt yours that familly emigrating there around the correct time
gives you a very good reason for the other flora from Tirvaigain going to Canada,
she went out with uncle and cousins maybe the whole familly went,
the flora with john and euphimia i think was to young theres one with effie mceachern on the 41 census she 2 years old
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i m getting very close to betting all your money on the tirvaigain Flora
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hi
i ve gone through the 1811 tennants list and this is what i ve found The MacArthurs , Gilchrists, Calders all mostly in kildalton but there is others scattered around the Island,
Mceachern, Darroch, Currie, mostly in the Kilmeny and central area of the Island,
those Mceacherns you found in edgar most of the ones i ve checked and can identify
are all from around the same area as Tirvaigain, so is that Euphemia Darroch
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and this is where euphemia Mceachern ( Darroch) is with 3 kids on the 1841 census
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Hello Raunoll4
You are probably correct that Flora McEachern from Trivagarn is my great grandmother. A Donald McEachern and his brothers James, John and Archibald from Islay did settle in Oro. Donald was born 1781 and died 1860. He is buried at Knox Presbyterian Cemetery and it is on the website. From the old maps I have seen of Oro the McEachern's owned a lot of land in the township.
Knox's records only go back to 1864
I have read most of them came over on the Armada known as "The White Sails" I am sure there would be no surviving passenger lists and as they no doubt came steerage their names would not have been listed.
Marlid
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this might give you more to work on
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old age is catching up with me that also looks like her brother neil born about 1817
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the neil married in Scotland 1847 which suggests they sail between 1848 and 1851
with a bit of luck there might be passenger lists from Glasgow or Greenock,
the bargue ellen and the hope sailed between those the imigrant ships transcribers guild might
those 2
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i have no idea what the columns mean or if its just giving the head of a familly and numbers traveling with him however 1847 is reasonable depend when in 1847 that Neil married on islay
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Hello Raunoll4
Thank you for more information, unfortunately the chart you posted I cannot read any of it and cannot zoom in on it.
I have been researching some books written about the settlers of Simcoe County. What I didn't know is that at one time Oro was called Heytesbury. I Googled this name and a list of residents from 1831 came up. There are no McArthur or McEachern's on the list. It was prepared by a Mr. O'Brien. I have heard that my great-grandfather worked for a Squire O'Brien in Shanty Bay (this is a village in Oro) when he first came to Canada. I am not sure if this is the same Mr. O'Brien.
The Simcoe County Genealogy Society has a lot of information on their website but unless I am a member I cannot access it. I have emailed the Society asking how to register. Their next meeting is May 4th and I have marked it on my calendar to attend.
I will be in touch when I find more information.
Many thanks
Marlid
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I ve been looking at ship lists pre 1865 some have passenger lists other s
give cargo tonnage and how many passengers but no names,
the picture with this message is pre 1865 emigration
the info on the 4 brothers tells where they got the land
and how much land where doe s nt mean anything to me
But you may know where the land is
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where is Antigonish County in relation to simcoe
we ve had a mceachern dna connection to my wife
came up from there a Magaret Mceachern
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Hello Raunoll4
Antigonish is in the Province of Nova Scotia - Nova Scotia is on the Eastern seaboard of Canada. Simcoe is in the Province of Ontario in Central Canada. The approximate distance between Anigonish and Simcoe is around 1200 miles or 1800 Km.
Nova Scotia was mainly settled by emigrants from Scotland and Scottish customs such as the music is still very popular there today.
Marlid
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thank you i m trying to work out who these mceacherns are as my wife has no islay connections as far as we know but a few of her ancestors from lewis landed in Canada
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Hello Raonull4
I have some more information re my McArthur/McEachern ancestors that I thought I would pass along. Genetix was on Ancestry checking some information on her family and entered my information as well. The following information came up – I do not know who the person is that posted it but it matches with my ancestors.
“FLORA MCEACHERN
Born: February 1826, Scotland
Died: July 15, 1895
Parents: Donald McEachern 1781-1860
Flora McLean 1791-1876
Spouse: Peter McArthur 1813-1858
Child: Gilbert McArthur 1855-1922
There was side note as follows:
Death records indicate age at death 69 years, 5 months
Death 15 July, 1895 Oro Township, Simcoe, Ontario, Canada
Headstone broken and illegible - Cemeteries of Oro incorrectly gives death year as 1883.
Death year confirmed as 1895 by John F. Wright, Cemeteries Project Co-Ordinator, Simcoe County Branch O.G.S.”
The dates for this Donald McEachern matches with the Donald McEachern who settled in Oro and is buried at Knox Presbyterian Cemetery. However I cannot find any burial information for Flora McLean McEachern. I will try and get in touch with the person who posted this on Ancestry. She no doubt is related to Flora.
You mentioned your wife has a relative(s) in Antigonish, N.S. I have received a list of some search sites for Nova Scotia at a Genealogy meeting I attended. If you are interested in them, let me know and I will send you a message listing them.
Regards, Marlid
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hi
that info looks good but i d like to know where they found it as i e checked the islay parish records
and can find no flora McLean to match either in births, marriages, or in children born to Donald Mc Eachern and Flora McLean,
however on going back over what i ve already sent you the Flora Currie who married Donald McEachern was born 1892 thats pretty close to the birth year listed for Flora McLean,
And Flora the daughter of Donald McEachern and Flora Currie was born dec 31 1825, and Baptized 29th jan 1826,
if you can find an ancestry user name for who posted that info it might tell you the source of the info,
the islay parish records i have are same ones use by the gro for scotland as far as i m aware no other source exists,
so i can only conclude No records for Flora Mclean birth, marriage, or children born to her,
on saying all this i have known others on ancestry to have parents name listed for children thats totally different to whats in the records,
thers a possibilty those parents were nt from islay, but going by all the info you ve given me your ancestors deffinitly did,
i ll keep trolling i love it and anything i find i ll send,
Raonull
in english its Ronnie
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how far is erin county from simcoe
a flora mceachern born about 1795 ded there in 1873 i can t read the document
but it does say born islay
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Erin County is in Alberta, which is a very long way from Simcoe County. There is an Erin in Wellington County, Ontario, which is next-door-but-one to Simcoe County.
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its the wellington erin the flora mcearchen died 1873 there but i checked a census can t remember now if it was 1871 or 61 but she s with a donald mceachern the ages are right and i think theres a catherine all born in scotland i did nt find a catherine in the 1841 islay census but she could have been born after it going by her age
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i m getting forgetful there a book online about early simcoe settlers there s a few mceacherns mentioned in it a lot of it will have more meaning to you as you know the area,
just search early simcoe settlers you should find it
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mceachern is a margaret we ve no idea who she is only that her ancestors went there the mcearherns on my wifes side we have nt traced outside of scotland,
but the match was found through dna testing
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Hello Ronnie
I have checked every Canadian Census since 1841 to see if there is a Flora McLean/McEachern that would match the one listed on Ancestry and I couldn’t find one. Also looked on CanadaGenWeb's Cemetery Project for burial notice and found none. I even used the different spellings for the surname. I Googled the McEachern Family History in Canada and had a look at it again but nothing to match her information. There is a Flora McLean McEachern on Scotland's People - it shows residence as Kilfinichen & Kilvickeon in Mull not Islay. She was 100 years old when she died in 1876. Shows her father as Allan McLean and her husband as Donald McEachern. The father and husband match up and the year she died 1876 to the Ancestry information. The Flora McLean posted on Ancestry was born 1791 and died 1876 which would mean she died at 85 not 100. I do not think this is her – it shows her dying a pauper. It seems strange the husband and father’s name are the same and the year of death but this would mean the Donald McEachern who died in Oro would not be Flora McArthur’s father and I find that hard to believe.
Marlid
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hi
i agree with you i think the ancestry parents are highly unlikely the peter and flora are correct
but like a lot on ancestry many choose parents that they think looks most lilely without proper research,
in scotland we re spoiled as since 1855 our registration is the best i ve seen for giving detail dates address's occupations parents wittness's and so on,
before that the parish registars are nt so good the parish records i use for islay are ones transcribed
by steve gilchrist and a ted larson from the the origional parish records,
the origional parish records are still on islay and can be searched free at the gaelic centre,
going back to Donald and Flora the research i ve done from those records i m fairly certain the Donald and Flora your looking for are Donald mceachern and Flora currie and their daughter flora who birthdates fit and they show up on the 1841 census and disappear in from the 1851 census,
thers 1 other way to search for them to find the correct mother and that is to search for the marriages and deaths for donald and floras other children it may be possible that the parents are listed on one of them, if any of their kids remained in scotland and married or died after 1855 parents name became a legal reuirement after that but id suggest doing that on a visit to scotland
the gro in scotland has its own computor rooms for research and you can find a lot in one day,
you can get a good laff as well on one visit we had an american rolling on the floor laffin he d found a lunatic in his familly and someone piped up with and you still have them,
don t give up though we searched for my wifes grandfathers brother for 26 years knew he d been wounded 5 times in ww1 then he just disappeared then a few months ago out of the blue we got a contact from ancestry and a lot came to light he was a piper in the war explains the woundings
and found a pictures of him on the cover of a book then we found he d married twice illegally the second time bad lad he d added his mothers maiden name to his birth name hence the reason we could nt find him so don t give up
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try finding these ones flora from tirvargan had a sister catherine
see the attachment
also the mother on it died 1873 and its states she was born islay
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great news i have flora born 1826s 2 brothers in simcoe north 1781
archibald and neil both on the islay census at tirvargan
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this image is neils familly note both of their first sons are donalds
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1861 census for simcoe type in neil mceachron you ll find that page very interesting
its not to clear but read the full page flora macarthurs on it
i think the mother your looking for is definnitely flora curry
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sorry currie
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find this guys tree he s from flora s brother neils line neil went to manitoba between 71 and 81 from what i can see and your mceacherns are definnitely the tirvargan mceacherns on the 1851 donalds brother neil is still in tirvargan with his familly they may have remained on islay i ll check the census 's from 51 onwards i m attaching 2 photos a must for you to see
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sorry the complete pictures have nt shown click where it says jpg bettom left of each pic
peter and flora are to the right of archibald
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hi
does kawartha lakes mean anything to you
an smmceachern76 researching the same mceacherns you are
i ve took the liberty of posting a link to this chat to her
though she may not use roots chat
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Hello cousins - I am a bit late joining you, but thank you for the invite. I am new to Roots chat, but now that I found page 9 of this thread I will read backwards. Flora McEachern, wife of Peter McArthur was my husband’s cousin according to DNA matches. Flora is almost certainly the daughter of Donald McEachern and Flora Currie. In 1861 she is living adjacent to her brothers Neil McEachern, Archibald McEachern and also her Aunt (sister of her father, Donald) Catherine McEachern McIntyre. The McEachern family lands were adjacent to each other with Donald’s children and sister all living together or beside each other. Brothers of Donald and Catherine, John settled on Con 8, lot 11 and Duncan on Concession 8, lot 12 in 1837. Donald and Catherine emigrated later, between 1851 and 1861. The 1852 census for Oro has been destroyed, so that leaves a bit of a gap.
PS - Kawartha Lakes used to be Victoria County and a massive number of Islay and Mull Scots emigrated the Eldon, Mara, Brock and Simcoe, which all adjoin one another to the east side and north of Lake Simcoe in Central Ontario. I live in Eldon and my husband’s family are mostly still in the area with his uncle living on our original homestead from 1844
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hi
good to hear from you and marlin will be delighted she from peter and floras side,
i m not related i m just assisting as i lie in scotland and have islay ancestors and have the islay parish
records on my comp,
genetrix i m not certain of her connection possibly a cousin of marlin,
donald mceachern live at tirvargarn on islay,
neil mcearchern and elisabeth mcintyres first child donald was born in tirvagarn the birth date is 1846
though they re marriage is listed as 1847 on the canada census, donald is the only child listed for them so i m assuming the others where born in simcoe, when you read back in the chat theres pics i ve posted if you need anymore info i m only to hapy to help,
Raonull4
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hi
i should have mentioned they must have emigrated before 1851 they disappear from the islay 51 census,
there was a Donald emigrated in 1847
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Yes, they were already in Canada by 1849, their first son Donald having died and having another son Donald born in Oro in 1849.
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hi
do you have any info on who Catherine Mceachen Mcintyre married,
and could this be her,
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Congratulations Ronnie - looks like you've hit the jackpot! Marlid will be thrilled. Hello Shauna - you must be a cousin to Marlid who I'm sure will be anxious to talk to you. We're not cousins - just good friends who took a trip last fall to Islay in search of her ancestors. I must say I'm beginning to feel like a member of the McArthur family with all the research we've been doing together. I do have a Katherine McArthur on my tree from Argyll who married a McIntyre. My line is McIntyres from Kilmartin, Argyll. I managed to get back to John McIntyre (c.1721) who married Anne Campbell (c.1725) from Rashelly, Kilmartin but then hit a brick wall which I haven't been able to get past. Been trying for ten years now but never find anything new on them.
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hi
i found Shauna and about 6 others researching the mceacherns,
every little bit helps me locate them in what records i have,
now i m of to find mull genealogy,
mulls a great place specially during the music festival,
i worked there for 6 weeks and caused havoc
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do you have any other info on the Katherine that married the mcintyre
and does the spelling of her name change at any time
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Hello Shauna and Ronnie
Ronnie thanks a million for this information – I am so happy to receive it. You are so good at this research. Shauna – Peter and Flora (nee McEachern) McArthur are my great grandparents and Gilbert McArthur my grandfather. In 1840 Peter McArthur purchased 92 acres on Concession 5 - Lot 13 - East ½. The following year he purchased the remaining 8 acres. The farm stayed in the family until around 1998. Peter left it to Flora – as you probably know he died when my grandfather was only 2 years old. I have seen documents showing her having title to the farm. Gilbert eventually inherited it when he became of age and he left the farm to his eldest son; also named Peter (one of my uncles). Peter never married. There was a Gaelic bible in the farm house with all the family information and in the early 1970’s the farm house was broken into and the bible stolen – so all the information on the family was lost. My father was the youngest of Gilbert’s 5 sons and he purchased the farm from my uncle Peter around 1974. It was to be a hobby for him in his retirement years. My late brother purchased it from my father’s estate and he had it until the late 1990’s. The farm house and farm is now a group home for disadvantaged children. I live in Barrie so we are not too far from each other.
Knox Presbyterian Church where they are buried is having a Memorial Service June 30th at 2 pm. I know that is over a 100 KM. for you to travel but just thought I would mention it.
I have some photographs from the farm house that I think are Flora and Peter McArthur with his sister Elispy or Elizabeth and my grandfather. However, there are no names on the photographs so it is just a guess on my part. They were taken at a studio in Orillia. I will send you a private message with my email address and if you would like to contact me please do.
Marlene
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hi marlid
your more than welcome i know how good it feels when you find and meet new familly,
shame about the bible we had a similar experience eith one but fortunately it survived and will
shortly be 200 years old,
at present i m checking out genetrix info on Katherine Mcarthur who married a mcintyre,
and have came across some interesting details on islay that could have origonated from mull but will need to go deeper into it,
don t hestitate to ask if theres anythings else i can do i enjoy researching.
Raonull4
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Catherine McEachern married Archibald McIntyre and those are the correct baptismal records. Catherine and Archibald were in Scotland during the 1841 and 1851 census and then in Oro, Ontario by 1861. Archibald died in Barrie, Ontario in 1867 and Catherine in 1876. They too are buried in the Knox Presbyterian Churchyard along with a number of the McEachern family. I am so excited to hear about the open house. I travel routinely to Orillia and Barrie and beyond for work, and for Costco lol. I will be just back from my trip to England and France on the 26th and would love to attend! I leave June 6. Last summer I spent over 2 weeks in Scotland, but unfortunately only a few days on Islay. I have copies of copious amounts of records from the Bowmore museum and archives, some of which I have not yet tried to sort out. Lol. I am utterly addicted to genetic genealogy and before my husband’s grandfather passed in January this year at age 93, I got his DNA tested. So many wonderful new leads! The MacEacherns are related to every Scottish family in this area , one way or another - I have McIntyres and McArthurs and a number of Currie and McDuffie/mcPhee/McFee links. If any of you have done DNA tests we should definitely run a comparison. My tests are in Ancestry, but also Gedmatch, FTDNA and several other databases.
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the archibald and Catherine i cant be certain yet but i think theres a mcintyre link to the isle of there
all the childrens names match mcintyre famillies on mull around 1722 and later the father being nicol and mother marion, also other mcintyre famillies on islay naming children nicol and marion, more research needs to be done
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Hi Ronnie: I don't seem to have a connection with Islay. My Katharine McArthur was baptized on January 1, 1749 in Kilmartin, Argyll. Father shown as Duncan and mother Katharine McFarlane. They were married March 17, 1748 in Kilmartin. She had siblings Isabel born Oct.12, 1751 and Malcom born April 20, 1753 all in Kilmartin.
Catharine (with a "C") married Hugh McIntyre on March 12, 1775 in Kilmartin. Hugh was born September 19, 1749 in Kilmartin. He had a sister Elizabeth born Aug.2, 1747 . Hugh's parents were John McIntyre and Ann Campbell. IGI have a Family Group Record which shows John McIntyre's birth about 1721 and Ann Campbell's born about 1725 both of Rashelly, Kilmartin, Argyll. This is where I hit my brick wall.
Can't find anything further on them except for two trees on Ancestry which showed Ann Campbell's father as Colin Campbell which then went on to link her up with the Dukes of Argyll. Quite sure this was rubbish but would have made a very impressive tree for me as it went right back to Cleopatra 1st, Queen of Syria who was born in 210 BC. Even passed King Arthur and Jesus Christ on the way!! Made very interesting reading but my tree ends with Ann Campbell of Kilmartin. I did try to make contact with the two tree owners to ask where they got Ann's parentage from but, of course, they didn't reply.
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i m laffin like hell but don t disegard a campbell link to the duke your in the right area,
here s suggestion find out if theres a book of campbells,
i know there s lots of books that show the descendants of of scottish and irish clans
ie the book of MacKay in our case generally you can read them online,
but save reading them for a long cold winter in fact you might be better hibernating with it if you find one,
i sent the link to the book of Mackay to my wifes cousin and have nt heard from her since think she might trapped under the book,
also try on wiki for the duke of argyll, i know theres a lot of sites that show lairds and such and their lines ie who they succeded and who succeeded them, their children their siblings and who they married, i m attaching a sample from wiki you can click each name and follow them,
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most impressive on my line is my gg/gran she ran a shebeen, thats an illegal drinking den,
unless you include my sister whos recorded 2 albums that even i wont listen to,
now i better hide.
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hi
Rashelly may actualy be raslie as in raslie cairn, Kilmartin
photo attached
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in the kilmartin graveyard project there is both mcintyre and mctyres, and campbells from Raslie,
if you have 18th century info from that area it might be worth having a look at the project from about page 30
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I've checked out the Kilmartin Graveyard Project but don't see any McIntyres from my tree. My gr.gr.grandfather (Archie McIntyre) was a Gamekeeper. He was born in 1814 in Kilmartin. 1841 census shows him in Torranmore, Kilmartin. By 1851 census he's in Blair Atholl, Perthshire. He died in 1870 in Ardrishaig, Lochgilphead. By 1871 his wife and children had moved to Glasgow where they remained.
While I didn't expect to find him in the Kilmartin graveyard, I would have thought his parents, grandparents etc. might have been there. Father was Duncan McIntyre (born Kilmartin in 1781), mother Sarah McCallum. I saw several McCallums in the project but not my Sarah or Duncan. Only Sarah McCallum I've been able to trace was born in 1782 in Inveraray. No proof its her though. Only got their names from Archie's death certificate.
John McIntyre and Ann Campbell would have been Archie's great grandparents.
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hi
what i m reading atmo suggests your campbells where campbells of duntroon who bought raslie,
in 1590, although the spelling of raslie comes in many forms ie rashillie and so on, there is a link to the earl of argyll buying property,
this info is from kilmartin land assement,
attaching a clip about raslie,
and a pic of your castle at duntrune,
duntrune is slightly west of kilmartin but well within walking distance
with a good pair of boots,
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image
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yir wee hoose duntrune castle
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hearth tax for toranmore 1693
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theres an auther called Allan Begg he s written 2 books on deserted settlements glassary and kilmartin with names of who lived in them
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elisabeth mcintyre born 2 aug 1747 do you have that her parents are john and ann campbell
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and hugh mcintyre 19th sept 1749
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Hi Ronnie: Thanks for all the information, although the hearth tax is much further back than my line (so far). I wouldn't mind having that "wee hoose" now.
Yes, I have Hugh and Elizabeth. Hugh was Archie's grandfather who married Katherine McArthur in 1775. Their son was Duncan (born 1781 in Torranbeg, Kilmartin) who married Sarah McCallum. Don't know if Archie or Duncan had siblings. It all began with John McIntyre and Ann Campbell who seem determined not to reveal their parentage, hence my brick wall, but I'll keep looking.
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theres a strange spelling of mcintyre in the same area going a little futher back
mcintyllor and mctyre, i found a little pic of west raslie just ruins left,
torranmore and torranbeg are basiclly in the same place on old maps its toranmhor
that wee hoose isnt far from there was the campbells then went to the malcolms
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hi again
firstly i had a good laff at you ruffling feathers i think it was back in 2012,
but it made me look at something,
and what i ll say to you is don t disregard inverawe,
first i m sending you a picture read the paragraph if you find it of interest, follow the link
in this message the campbells of interest may be a touch before what you have,
but as there in Raslie (rashelly) theres a very distinct possibilty they are your line,
i ve stopped reading at that point eyes are getting weary,
http://www.inverawe.org.uk/publications/MacConnochie-Campbells-VolumeFour-Diarmid-Campbell.pdf
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hi
after researching the lines of campbell of duntoon (duntune) and their connection to Raslie (Rashelly) i ve reached the conclusion your ann is of that line from documments i ve been reading
alexander who inherited Raslie was given Raslie had brothers also at Raslie Patrick, Archibald, John who was the uncle of a colin, Colin being a witness at the signing of the handing of Raslie to Alexander
all are from Raslie,
and Before that Duntroon, the duntroon line stems from the inverawe campbells further back,
Raslie itself is mentioned in documents as upper and lower Raslie estate,
Later i believe it was called poltaloch estate,
portaloch estate people by name contains all the names in the info you ve posted ie mcintyre mccallum campbells
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Hi Ronnie: Well I read a lot about those Campbells from the link you sent me. Very dry reading I must say. Too far back from my line to draw any conclusions. So many people with the same name making it impossible to follow. The only place I've seen my Ann is on Family Search where it shows the birth of her children Hugh and Elizabeth with husband John McIntyre. Family Search also has the birth of a Colin Campbell from Inveraray (about 1705) with parents Alexander Campbell and Elizabeth Gillies but I'm sure this is connected to the Lochawe Campbells which is where those other trees I mentioned before went off the track. I think I found a profile of them somewhere a long time ago which listed their children but there was no Ann so I discarded that avenue.
My John McIntyre's grandson (Duncan McIntyre born 1781 in Kilmartin) was a gamekeeper. A bit of a stretch from the lofty Colin Campbell in just three generations, don't you think? I have Duncan's son Archibald in the 1841 census living and working (another gamekeeper) at Torranmore, Kilmartin. I understand it was part of the Inverliver estate and the proprietor was Lieut. John Campbell. So more likely that my ancestors worked for the Campbells but were not related to them. Interestingly enough though, Archie had a son named Colin Campbell McIntyre.
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Just took a look at my McIntyre chart. Colin Campbell McIntyre mentioned above also had a son and a grandson called Colin Campbell McIntyre. So, it looks likely that there was a Colin Campbell somewhere further back, unless they just liked the name!
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the research i m doing is on the cadet line of clan campbell, that s like brothers and such that werent inline for succession to be clan chief,
and as you go back in time they go further north to appin,
and on reading about the campbells and macDonalds the mcintyres have been associated with both clans going way way back,
concentrating on the campbells around kilmartin i ve found they re from the duntoon line,
i m thinking next of trying to find estate records,
i ve found some records but it is 1798 i don t know if any on your tree was still in the area at that time,but there is quite a few mcintyre famillies still there
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there is also a birth for an ann campbell 1720 to a colin and elisabeth, inveraray and glenaray, that isnt that far from kilmartin
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would any of these be duncan 1781s father or grandfather this is from poltaloch estate records
it also lists campbells and mccallums
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sorry thats 1798
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No, Duncan's parents were Hugh McIntyre/Katherine McArthur. His grandparents were John McIntyre/Anne Campbell.
Family Search also have an Ann Campbell born April 28, 1724 and another born August 27, 1727 with parents Colin Campbell/Elizabeth all in Inveraray. Don't forget, John and Anne had a daughter Elizabeth also. I think Duncan's wife (Sarah McCallum) was from Inveraray.
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right this could make your brick wall much harder to break,
in the early 1700s in and around the kilmartin area there was mackenzie's,
alias mcintyre, that generally means the mackenzies where in hidding,
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Hello! I’m looking for help tracking down my McArthur ancestors from Islay if anyone can help I would really appreciate it!
I know that Neil McArthur was born about 1893 and was from Bridgend and attended Kilarrow church. His father was also Neil McArthur, but I have no other information.
Neil McArthur if 1983 married Mary MacTaggart(of port Ellen i think) and my great aunt Maisie (mary) was born on Islay in 1913 (Neil and Mary being her parents). Neil moved to Canada that year, and Mary and Maisie joined several years later, I think that Mary’s brother and possibly Neil’s brother came to Canada with them. They settled in the Unionville/York area of Ontario.
I can track them in Canada, but finding them in Islay seems to be a challenge. I’d love to figure out our family on Islay, who Neil’s parents were especially.
Thanks so much for any help at all!
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If you are having trouble finding them, it's probably because you're not looking in the right place yet:)
Neil McArthur and Mary McTaggart were married in Bonhill in 1913.
Their daughter Mary was born in Bonhill, also in 1913.
Go to www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk and invest in a few credits. Use some of them to download the marriage certificate. It will tell you the couple's ages and the names of their parents, including their mothers' maiden surnames.
Then use that information to look for the births of Neil and Mary, and so on back to 1855.
There is a birth of a Neil McArthur in Bowmore and Kilarrow in 1890, mother's maiden surname McVorran. (McVorran could be a non-Gaelic-speaking registrar's misunderstanding of a Gaelic surname, so if you have trouble finding McVorran try McMorran.)
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Welcome to RootsChat :)
Just adding to Forfarian's info.
Have you seen this Find a Grave entry for Mary and Niel? www.findagrave.com/memorial/262444438/mary_mcarthur
From this, Mary is showing as the daughter of Neil McTaggart & Margaret Bell. However, as mentioned, you need to start with formal verification by looking at their marriage registration. There is, however, Mary's death registration in 1944 Ontario which does name these parents for her.
Monica
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There is a possible birth for Mary on www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk
MARY MCTAGGART
Mother's maiden name BELL
1891
536 / 33
Bowmore or Kilarrow
Monica
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I think this is a likely entry for the McArthur family in 1901, all showing as born in Kilarrow:
Neil Mcarthur 45 vanman
Mary Mcarthur 39
Minnie Mcarthur 16
Donald Mcarthur 14
Roderick Mcarthur 12
Neil Mcarthur 10
Mary Mcarthur 5
Alexander Mcarthur 2
Address Church Street, Bowmore/ Kilarrow
There are at least 9 children showing on the index as born to Neil and Mary, with mother showing as McVorran except one where it is listed as McNorran. From 1884 - 1905. All births in Bowmore or Kilarrow.
Marriage in 1884 for Neil and Mary (McVorran) - ref 536 / 4 Bowmore or Kilarrow.
As mentioned, if you have a look at this 1884 marriage, you will be able to step back to the previous generation.
Monica
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I think this might be the 1901 entry for the McTaggart family:
Neil Mctaggart 42 Forest labourer b. Kilchoman, Argyllshire
Maggie Mctaggart 36
Dugald Mctaggart 13
Donald Mctaggart 11
Mary Mctaggart 9
John Mctaggart 7
Angus Mctaggart 6
Katie Mctaggart 4
Address No 3 Redhouses, Bowmore/ Kilarrow
Is it brother John Bell McTaggart who you think also went to Canada. His 1924 marriage in Ontario does give the same parents as Mary (Neil McTaggart and Margaret Bell).
At least 7 children showing on SP with the mother's name given as Bell, from 1887 - 1901. There are some possible other births not showing a mother's maiden, so there could be more children born into the family. For example, John McTaggart doesn't show with mother's maiden name Bell but there are two entries on the birth index in 1893 in Bowmore or Kilarrow.
Monica
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Forfarian and Monica, thank you so very much!
I bought some credits and followed your advice, now ai’m trying to figure out the handwriting :)
The marriage certificate from
august 5 1884 shows Neil McArthur as a baker ( father Donald McArthur - gardener, and mother maybe Margaret/Margreth but I cannot decipher the last name - possibly Kelly).
Mary McVorran has only her mother listed as Mary McVorran, no other information.
I’ll work through the other records to see what else I can dig up. This is so exciting! I really appreciate the help, ypu’re both so kind and helpful.