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Research in Other Countries => Canada => Topic started by: ryan37 on Saturday 07 April 18 15:41 BST (UK)
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Hi I’m trying to find the where and what came of a lot of my Samuel family
My Great grandfathers siblings all lived in Canada
William Samuel born around 1883 in peterhead Scotland arrived in Canada at age of 19
Nobody knows what happened to him or if any family still living
Helen Samuel born 1891 in peterhead Scotland lived in Canada but nobody knows what happened to her or if there is any family still living
And finally
Alexander he was born in peterhead Scotland around 1896 he served in ww1 and then married a Florence reid braid around 1919 in Edinburgh
I think they moved to Hamilton Ontario along with 3 daughters
We only know what came of one of the daughters she is Laura E Samuel and she died on November 21st 1967 along with her husband Lloyd George paddon and 2 children apparently it was a sad subject of how they died they lived at 525 dundurn street south
But we don’t know what happened to the other 2 daughters
They are called
Constance Marie Samuel and Gladys Ann Samuel both born around 1920-1921 in Scotland
Is anyone able to point me in the direction of where these people maybe married or died or if any family remain in Canada
I think the mother Florence is buried in Hamilton. Ontario
But there is a story that the father Alexander had another son to a second wife
If anyone can help me trace any of the above people it would be greatly appreciated
Ryan
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Canadian Passenger List shows Florence Samuel born 1899 aged 30 years - arriving 23 August 1929 on the Minnedosa - Glasgow to Montreal -
Gladys was aged 9 years - Constance is 7 years - Laura 5 years.............going to Hamilton Ontario.
Sandra
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Fantastic can you mail
Me
The record please?
Ryan
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U.S., Border Crossings from Canada to U.S., 1895-1960 - Florence Samuel born 1899 Edinburgh Scotland and aged 35 years - Port of Arrival Buffalo, New York - 27 January 1934 - husband Alexander - had been in the USA on various visits 1 day to 1 week. previously. last permanent address - 85 Boon Street Hamilton Ontario. This application may have been withdrawn.
Sandra
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Florence Samuel aged 23 years - also shows on Canada Ocean Arrivals (Form 30A) Peterhead, Scotland to St John New Brunswick - January 1922 - accompanied by husband Alexander. Going to brother-in-law William Samuel 125 Main Street Hamilton.
Mother - Mrs Helen Samuel, 20 St Andrew Street Peterhead.
Sandra
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Fantastic good to hear this
Thanks hope there’s more info available
This is fascinating
Thanks for your efforts Sandra
Ryan
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Canada Voters List 1935 - Mrs Florence Samuel - married woman - apt 4 Hamilton Ontario - no other Samuel showing. ???
Canada Voters List 1940 - Mrs Alec Samuel (widow) - 151 James Street South Hamilton ???
Canada Voters List - 1972 - Florence Samuel (widow) - Apartment 706 - Bay Street South Hamilton Ontario. ???
Billion Graves - Florence Samuel - 1899 - 1976
https://billiongraves.com/grave/Florence-Samuel/14769637
Sandra
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Very good info
Think I found a headstone for Florence in the woodland cemetery in Hamilton in 1976
Says dob was 1899 this ties in
Wonder where Alec went ?
Looks like Alec and wife Florence visited Canada a few times before settling ?
Ryan
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Pay per view site so only a small snippet available..............The Ottawa Journal - 21 November 1967
Mrs. Lloyd Paddon and her 21-year-old daughter Carol were found dead in their beds and a son, Donald, is, was found in a hallway. A trail of blood led from bis bed to the hallway. Mr. Paddon was found on the floor of an upstairs bedroom. He had been shot full in the face with a shotgun.............
https://www.newspapers.com/newspage/44411200/
Sandra
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Thanks Sandra
Saw that the other day sad subject
Do you think we could find
William, Alexander and Helen
Samuel
Along with Alexander’s other 2 girls ?
Is there any possible means of finding them like a marriage or death record ,
Many thanks for your efforts
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Quite possibly William Samuel born 1883 Peterhead Scotland crossed the border to the USA October 1923 - Port of Arrival Detroit, Michigan. Aged 39 years. Single. Machinist. Name and nearest relative from country whence came - Uncle John McDonald Adelaide Street Toronto. Going to friend Clifford Adams, Selden Ave Apts. Detroit. Michigan.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:33SQ-G5MJ-N6?i=406&cc=1916040
Sandra
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1930 census : Detroit House of Correction Detroit Michigan
William Samuels born 1884 Scotland. Prisoner. Labourer. Imm 1922. NA. ???
Sandra
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Helen Samuel born about 1895 Peterhead Scotland - Southhampton to Quebec on the Empress of France - arriving 7 May 1927 - single - cook - c/o Hostel Canadian Govt Toronto - brother James Samuel 20 St Andrews Street Peterhead.
Sandra
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Fantastic work thanks for your hard work , may I ask are any of the information from ancestry website as I can’t access a lot.because I’m in the uk and need worldwide membership .
Where was the information on Helen found
I’m fascinated by this thanks Sandra
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Gravestones of Lloyd and Laura are on billiongraves.
https://billiongraves.com/grave/Lloyd-G-Paddon/16504076
Children also listed on the grave.
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Thanks I have that photo of grave stone
Many thanks for your efforts
Would there be a trace of death record for William and Helen and Alexander somewhere ?
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What year was John McDonald born ?
Sandra
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Canadian Passenger List showing Alex Samuels - born 1896 Peterhead - Belfast to Montreal arriving 30 April 1934 on the Duchess of Atholl. Married. Had been in Canada 1913 - April 1934 - Home 71 Wentworth Street Hamilton Ontario.
Sandra
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John mcdoanld died in Toronto 8th January 1932 aged 79 years old
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Did you get an obituary for John McDonald ?
Sandra
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There is a memorial stone in peterhead Scotland for
Him
Ryan
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Information posted in case you have not got an obituary and someone might help -
John Macdonald - born 1853 Aberdeenshire - Age 79 years - Blacksmith - Single.
Passed Away 8 Jan 1932 Toronto, Ontario, Canada - Double Lobar pneumonia. Angina pectoris
Burial Date 11 Jan 1932 Mount Pleasant Cemetery. Toronto
Burial Place: Toronto, Ontario, Canada - Adult Single Grave P 8953
Ground Property Owner - Informant - Bidwell Nicholls Davies
Relative Name: Helen MacArthur - Relative Residence Place - Thorncliffe Park Leaside - Perhaps his niece - sister of Alexander Samuel ???
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-XXHQ-MVS?i=461&cc=1307826
Sandra
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Thanks very much ,
Think mount pleasant was where johns father passed away around 1897 it’s a house in countryside , but they are all listed on same
Stone in peterhead as memorial for son John that’s died in Toronto
So would the people
Listed under be johns relatives ?
Ryan
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Ontario marriages are covered on ancestry to 1936 - alas there is no BMD Index in Canada - Privacy Laws are quite strict.
Sandra
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Reading again
Is mount pleasant a cemetery in Toronto ?
Ryan
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Yes, Mount Pleasant is a cemetery in Toronto.
Sandra
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Amazing as his father died in a house called mount pleasant in peterhead Scotland
Do
You think there’s a way to find deaths for Alexander Samuel and William and Helen ? Or is it difficult with strict rules ?
How about the Constance marie and the Gladys Ann Samuel would we be able to find deaths or anything to do with them?
Ryan
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Ontario Marriage - Helen Samuels born 1897 - parents George Samuels and Helen McDonald - spinster - 31 years old. domestic - married Robert McIntosh - aged 35 years - born Scotland - labourer - presbyterian - 57 Alexander Street. Married 23 November 1928 - York, Ontario.
Roberts parents - James McLntosh and Mother Margaret Shalt
Sandra
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So Helen married Robert Mcintosh in Canada ?
Ryan
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Yes.
Detroit Border Crossing - Alex Samuel - 16 June 1896 Peterhead Scotland - (Canadian) Prestwick Scotland to Detroit, Michigan, USA - Airline BOAC - Flight Number 563 - 26 August 1960
Address in Canada - 3557 Tecumsem Road Windsor Canada.
Sandra
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Very interesting on Alex wonder if he had anyone traveling with him
Thanks so much for your help
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No one else travelling - I checked either side of his entry.
Canada Voters List - 1958 Essex Ontario - 3557 Tecumseh Road West - Alex Samuel - Insurance salesman and Frances Samuel - Nurse.
Canada Voters List 1945/1949 - Essex West Ontario - 3636 Matchette Road - Alex Samuel - Insurance Salesman and Mrs Frances Samuel -
Canada Voters List 1962 - 3557 Tecumseh Road West - Alex Samuel - Insurance Agent - Mrs Frances Samuel - Reg. Nurse.
and these possible - maybe Alex has passed away ???
Canada Voters List 1968 - Apt 108 - Windsor, Walkerville, Ontario, Canada - Mrs Frances Samuel - Nursing Sup. Also a Mr I**Samuel (Teacher) Riverside Drive East
Canada Voters List 1972 - Windsor, Walkerville, Ontario, Canada - Riverside Drive East - Francis (spelt that way) RN and Mr I** Samuel (Teacher)
Sandra
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Hi,
With the same birth date 16/6/96 Alexander on a UK Incoming Passenger List from Montreal
to Southampton July 1959 on the "SS Homeric"
Samuel, Alex, 16.6.1896, Insurance Broker
Samuel, Frances, 12.2.1909, Reg. Nurse
Samuel, I**, 26.?.1945
going to 13 Craigewan Cres. Peterhead for 21 days.
** possibly living
DB
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Great finds must be the son Ian to Alexander and Francis on his second marriage
My reLatives thought he was John but I think there is some kind of situation where some people called Ian and John are called vice Versa
That is fantastic finds
Thanks all for your time
Hope we can keep finding info
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Hi,
From Windsor Public Library an index for the Windsor Star newspaper obituaries,
Samuel, Alexander, spouse Frances, Sept. 15,1962
Samuel, Frances, maiden name Harrington, spouse Alex, June 24, 1997.
http://projects.windsorpubliclibrary.com/digi/obits/results.php?lname=samuel&fname=&maiden=&spouse=&m1=0&y1=0&m2=0&y2=0&lim=25&search=Search
Since you have the exact date of the obituary, you can ask the Windsor Library for a quick look-up.
http://www.windsorpubliclibrary.com/?portfolio=ask-a-librarian
DB
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Iam
So thankful for all your efforts
The address mentioned is where Alexander’s brother James stayed in peterhead they had been visiting and all
Adds up now
Would there be anyway to find what happened to helen and Robert Mcintosh and to see if they had any family ?
Also wonder where the Constance marie and Gladys Ann Samuel went ? Which was Alexander’s 2 daughters
This is fascinating thanks for all your time folks
Ryan
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Was looking back an email from a connection of samuels
He said Constance marie Samuel married a “bud” not sure what he means by bud ? and they had 2 children , thought that family probably died in Hamilton
And Gladys Ann Samuel went to Montreal and never came back ?
Would there be any way to trace these 2 lady’s ?
Also would there be a way to find William who was seen in the Detroit house of correction and what came of him?
Wonder what he did to end in the jail,
The whole thing is fascinating and will get all the info sorted and filed
Thanks for everyone’s help
Ryan
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Hi,
You're welcome. :)
I think the best way forward for Alex's daughters, would be to get his obituary from the library,
and fingers crossed, it mentions them.
DB
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Thanks I have done that ,
Would there be a way to find William
Who ended up in the jail ?
Or could we find the helen Samuel who married Robert Mcintosh mentioned earlier in the post
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Did you get an obituary for John McDonald ?
Sandra
John MacDonald obituary in the Toronto Star... 9 Jan 1932 page 12
It says that he died on 8 January 1932 at St. Michaels Hospital. He was in his 80th year, a native of Aberdeenshire, Scotland and a veteran of the Northwest Rebellion. Interment in Mount Pleasant Cemetery.
RK
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Was looking back an email from a connection of samuels
He said Constance marie Samuel married a “bud” not sure what he means by bud ? and they had 2 children , thought that family probably died in Hamilton
.........
Ryan
I think I found Constance....and Gladys :) :)
There is an obituary in the Globe and Mail newspaper for Constance Marie Stewart.
She died at the Henderson General Hospital on July 14 1974. Her address had been 550 East 27th Street Hamilton. She was Constance Marie Samuel, wife of R. H. (Bud) Stewart. Mother of Mrs. S. Miekuz (S is her initial) and S. R. (a son), both of Hamilton. Daughter of Mrs Florence Samuel of Hamilton. Sister of Mrs Gladys Katzenmire of Montreal. One grandson is named. Interment Woodland Cemetery.
Globe and Mail paper 16 July 1974 page 43.
Will PM you with the full names of Constance's two children.
RK
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Brilliant info folks thanks very much for everyone’s input it’s so interesting
On find Constance and Gladys
Is there anyway I can also find helen and Robert Mcintosh death I saw something on family search of a burial of Helen Mcintosh 20 sep 1980
At Mount Royal cemetery , Montreal Quebec
But I have no idea if this is them
Wonder if there’s an obituary notice available there’s also Robert mcIntosh I think it was burial in 70s same
Place but I have no
Idea if it’s the right people this was from
Family search website
Also would be good to find out about Gladys katzenmire
Thanks again for everyone’s help
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The above helen was maiden name
Samuel
Also thanks for info on John McDonald
Ryan
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I think I found Constance....and Gladys :) :)
There is an obituary in the Globe and Mail newspaper for Constance Marie Stewart.
She died at the Henderson General Hospital on July 14 1974. Her address had been 550 East 27th Street Hamilton. She was Constance Marie Samuel, wife of R. H. (Bud) Stewart. Mother of Mrs. S. Miekuz (S is her initial) and S. R. (a son), both of Hamilton. Daughter of Mrs Florence Samuel of Hamilton. Sister of Mrs Gladys Katzenmire of Montreal. One grandson is named. Interment Woodland Cemetery.
Globe and Mail paper 16 July 1974 page 43.
Will PM you with the full names of Constance's two children.
RK
RK finding Constance by first name only, you are amazing. Well done mate. :)
DB
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I know I’m fascinated by the efforts everyone has made
Thanks again to you all
Hope we can find more on Gladys katzenmire marriage or death and if had any family ?
Also about helen and Robert mentioned in above post?
Regards Ryan
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Hi,
The Helen who died Sept. 20, 1980 isn't yours. Obit in the Montreal Gazette, Sept. 23, Helen
McIntosh, nee Ralph wife of Fergus McIntosh. Page 37.
https://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=Fr8DH2VBP9sC&dat=19800923&printsec=frontpage&hl=en
DB
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Thanks is there any way I can trace Gladys
And the helen and Robert Mcintosh
Many thanks folks for helping me ryan
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Pay per view site so only a small snippet available..............The Ottawa Journal - 21 November 1967
Mrs. Lloyd Paddon and her 21-year-old daughter Carol were found dead in their beds and a son, Donald, is, was found in a hallway. A trail of blood led from bis bed to the hallway. Mr. Paddon was found on the floor of an upstairs bedroom. He had been shot full in the face with a shotgun.............
https://www.newspapers.com/newspage/44411200/
Sandra
Just in case you haven't seen the entire thing, here's my transcript:
"Murder-Suicide Wipes Out Family
"HAMILTON, Ont. (CP) -- Four members of a Hamilton family were found dead of shotgun wounds today. Police said it was apparently murder-suicide.
"Mrs. Lloyd Paddon and her 21-year-old daughter Carol were found dead in their beds and a son, Donald, 15, was found in a hallway. A trail of blood led from his bed to the hallway. Mr. Paddon was found on the floor of an upstairs bedroom. He had been shot full in the face with a shotgun."
Regards,
Josephine
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The Brandon Sun
22 Nov. 1967
"Four Killed in Hamilton
"HAMILTON (CP) -- A 21-year-old university student Tuesday found the bodies of four members of one family shot to death in an apparent triple murder and suicide.
"Lloyd Paddon, 49, a salesman; his wife, Laura, 44; a son, Don, 15, and daughter, Carol, 21, were found in various parts of the upstairs floor in the house.
"Lieut. James Campbell, head of the city's homicide squad, said it is apparent Paddon shot his wife and the children with a shotgun and then shot himself.
"Margaret Awrey, who lived next door, went to check the Paddon house after learning Carol did not arrive for work."
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Nanaimo Daily News
1 May 1968
"Relatives of a family of four killed last Nov. 21 in what police say was a murder-suicide in Hamilton, will share an estate of more than $185,000. Lloyd Paddon, 49, his wife Laura, 44, their daughter Carol, 21, and son Donald, 15, died from shotgun blasts in their home."
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Thanks Josephine
For your info
Must have been a tragic time
And I’m sure it was massive in that region the whole community must have been shooken
Ryan
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You're welcome, Ryan. It is a terrible story and you're right: it must have affected the whole community.
It most certainly would have been covered extensively in the local newspaper. The Hamilton Public Library might be able to do some look-ups for you, since you have names and exact dates: http://lha.hpl.ca/ .
The paperwork regarding their estate should provide names and addresses of beneficiaries. It's quite a lot of money.
Hamilton is in Wentworth County. It looks like the estate files should be located at the Archives of Ontario. See: http://www.archives.gov.on.ca/en/microfilm/surrogate_court_wentworth_t.aspx
Good luck in your search.
Regards,
Josephine
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That’s fine thanks very much Josephine it may be a source of info on the family I’m trying to trace
Would there be anyway of finding out more about William Samuel born 1884 and why he was in Detroit House of Correction , strange how he seemed to dissapear ?
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He could have passed away ??? There doesn't seem to be a border crossing of him returning to Canada. He doesn't seem to appear on the 1940 US census. Could he have returned to Scotland ?
Sandra
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Thanks will keep searching
Ryan
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found 2 new records for William Samuel on ancestry
US SOCIAL SECURITY APPLICATIONS AND CLAIMS INDEX 1936-2007
William Mcdonald Samuel
Birth 12 jan 1883
Scotland ,UK
Claim date - 12 mar 1947
ssn 382031053
notes - 19 Aug 1977 , name listed as William McDonald Samuel
ALSO FOUND
US WORLD WAR 2 DRAFT REGESTRATION CARDS 1942
this has a lot of info I cant read but maybe somebody can find it and check it out
basic info is
William Mc Samuel
male
residence age 60
birth date 12 jan 1882
residence date 1942
residence place Detriot MICHIGAN USA
This is definitely him as it says peterhead place of birth
Can anyone explain what these records are and what they mean?
also does this information help us trace where he might have died or any other info related to his life etc
ryan
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That would have made life easier had we known William had a middle name.
WW2 Draft does not mean William served - otherwise known as "The Old Mans Draft"
https://www.newberry.org/old-mans-draft
The U.S., Social Security Applications and Claims Index would indicate a claim was made in 1947 - it doesn't say life claim so I wouldn't think it was a death claim - could be he retired about then ???
The SSDI (Social Security Death Index) was not up and running until about 1963 so he might not show on that which could mean he passed away between 1947 - 1963.
https://www.familysearch.org/search/collection/1202535
Michigan Death Index -
https://www.familysearch.org/search/collection/1675357
Try Find a Grave to see if he is listed
https://www.findagrave.com/
Who is Mrs Chillis ? Is that a relative ?
Sandra
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Thanks Sandra I have no info on that lady? Fascinating what is the info at 1977 on the claim form?
Ryan
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I think that means the information was just added to that index in 1977
Sandra
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Many thanks Sandra please excuse my incapable efforts I’m New to roots and don’t know about linking posts etc
Ryan
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More questions than answers but also bear in mind that although we found a marriage record for Helen Samuel to Robert McIntosh 23 November 1928 in York Ontario. The death certificate of John McDonald in Toronto, had a relative names Helen McArthur. So did Robert Mcintosh pass away ? Did Helen and Robert divorce ? Is Helen McArthur, Helen Samuel McIntosh ???
Sandra
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Starting to look like this could be the case , I will keep looking hopefully someone can find them
Thanks for your hard work
Ryan
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For the old mans record can you depict the writing so I can record the information please
Ryan
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William McSamuel - 130 Selden Detroit Michigan - 12 january 1882 - 60 years old - Peterhead Scotland - name and address of person who will always know him at that address is Mrs Chillis 270 E Alexandrine City - place of employment 3385 Gratiot Detroit Michigan -
signed William M D McDonald.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:939V-KKH2-J?i=5087&cc=1861144
Sandra
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Thanks
Hope that’s someone comes up with any new details on the 2 posts
Many thanks Sandra
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Found the obituary for Laura paddon (Samuel)1967 it mentions sister Mrs George Katzemier (Gladys) ( Montreal) could this help us tracing Gladys
Ryan
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Found the obituary for Laura paddon (Samuel)1967 it mentions sister Mrs George Katzemier (Gladys) ( Montreal) could this help us tracing Gladys
Ryan
Slightly different spelling to the surname for Gladys mentioned in the obituary Run Kitty found in reply 40 - Katzenmire ??? Still couldn't see anything in Montreal.
Have you checked Montreal directories - given by RK in reply 8 ???
http://bibnum2.banq.qc.ca/bna/lovell/index.html
Sandra
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William McSamuel - 130 Selden Detroit Michigan - 12 january 1882 - 60 years old - Peterhead Scotland - name and address of person who will always know him at that address is Mrs Chillis 270 E Alexandrine City - place of employment 3385 Gratiot Detroit Michigan -
signed William M D McDonald.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:939V-KKH2-J?i=5087&cc=1861144
Sandra
Mrs Chillis - was Nellie nee Steinmaier Chellis - 278 E Alexandine Detroit, Wayne, Michigan on 1940 US Census - born Connecticut. Widowed.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-L9M1-KFW6?i=7&cc=2000219
Sandra
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Thanks Sandra was that info from previous world war 2 old mans record ?
Wonder what connection of this woman is to William? notice in the newspaper death his age is 60 but think he would have been about 5 years older , quite possible that this happened if his personal details were stolen
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Thanks Sandra was that info from previous world war 2 old mans record ?
Wonder what connection of this woman is to William? notice in the newspaper death his age is 60 but think he would have been about 5 years older , quite possible that this happened if his personal details were stolen
Yes, that was following up on Mrs Chillis named on the WW2 Draft. Doesn't look like she was related - he could possibly have been a lodger/boarder at her house.
Newspaper announcement said "about 60" - they would be roughly quoting info they had.
Sandra
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That’s fine thanks seemed that William
Floated around , wondered where he is buried ? And if there was another entry in paper regarding his death or burial/obituary
So sad that probably none of his siblings or family were aware of this
Ryan
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found a record on family search for a death of a baby McIntosh in York Ontario Canada ( very sad)
parents are Robert McIntosh and Helen Sanwell
death is 7 feb 1929 in toronto
Robert is from Dundee Scotland and helen is Aberdeen Scotland
address is 497 church street
could this be the couple that married in York on 23 November 1928
note - Samuel looks wrong on helens surname ?
ryan
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It looks like the same couple, even though the surname is spelt differently on the babies death record - might be that the Scottish accent of Robert made it sound like Sanwell rather than Samuel ???
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-6SJ7-HHW?i=399&cc=1307826
On the marriage record the name of Roberts mother was Margaret Shalt but I think that was quite probably Sharp. Parents married 1878
Sharp Margaret - McIntosh James - 1878 - 282/2 123 - St Mary
1881 census Brown Street Dundee.
James McIntosh 29 born Coupar Angus, Perthshire. Iron Ship Builder.
Margaret S McIntosh 24
Thomas McIntosh 2
James McIntosh 1
Sandra
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Very interesting Sandra could well be , and definetly looks like spellings could have varied a good bit as we have seen with Samuel and samuels , wonder if there’s any way to trace this couple Robert Mcintosh and Helen Samuel for a death or obituary
Or if was any more family
Ryan
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The marriage record in 1928 said Robert was 35 years old - the birth could have been slightly earlier because he does appear with James and Margaret on the 1891 Scotland Census.
James McIntosh 41 Ship Caulker.
Margaret McIntosh 34
Thomas McIntosh 12 James McIntosh 11
Margaret McIntosh 7 John McIntosh 5
Robert McIntosh 1 born 1890
1901 census 26 Lowdens Alley Liff and Benvie Angus.
James Mcintosh 53 born Coupar Angus, Perthshire. General Labourer..
Margaret Mcintosh 44
James Mcintosh 22 Carter.
John Mcintosh 16 Low Mill.
Robert Mcintosh 13
Jane Mcintosh 9
Ernest Mcintosh 5
Sandra
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Yes I agree with you Sandra , that looks like the family
I hope I can find out what happened to this couple also I want to find Gladys Ann Samuel and George katzenmire ( few spellings are about) katzemeir , she was seen as Mrs George katzemeir of Montreal on some of her family’s obituary notices
Ryan
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Found out that James
Samuel born 1903
Arrived Hamilton Ontario Canada - 1928
He was a keen footballer he played for some football teams during his time in Canada , would there be any way of finding some
Info on football teams or photos around 1928-1933
Ryan
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The passenger list for James Samuel born 1903 Peterhead - says he went to his sister Miss Helen Samuel, 92 Rosalib Ave, Bedford Park, Toronto. How do you know he was in Hamilton Ontario ?
Probably a tall order to find photographs of him in a football team - you would need to be specific on area for someone to trawl newspapers.
Sandra
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He apparently worked at the mental assylum there
I’m gathering small pieces of information from elderly members of family
Ryan
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Trying to work out more about William
Samuel , his brother James had never seen him so William
Had been 21 years old before James was born and James never saw him after trying to visit Hamilton Ontario Canada to find William , this indicates to me that William must have left scotland before the records we already have
I wonder when William
Did arrive in Canada as on his other brothers border crossing ( Alexander ) it’s says contact is William
Samuel Hamilton Ontario
Ryan
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Can anyone help I have found Helen m Mcintosh buried at mountpleasant cemetery Toronto
On 27 October 1980
Think this could be the Helen I’m looking for ? Can this help us check newspapers before or around the time of her burial to see if we can find additional info ?
Many thanks for any help given
Ryan
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Can I suggest that in the meantime you might e-mail the cemetery to see if they can give you further information on the 1980 Helen M McIntosh.
My gut feeling is that she may have remarried to a McArthur - unless you can find another John McDonald relative called Helen ???
Sandra
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Have already tried that’s why I have asked here about newspaper obituary’s , as I have now a burial date , I received the burial date from
The cemetery all I need now is extra details that could confirm it is her ,
Thanks again
Ryan
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Hi,
I had tried to find the Helen who died in 1980 using a name search....that was unsuccessful. Thanks for the date of burial. I have been looking through both the Toronto Star and Globe and Mail obituaries from Oct 23 1980 to Oct 29 1980.
Oct 25, 1980, there is an obituary for Helen (Nell) McIntosh. She died in Ajax on Oct 24 1980. She is buried in Mount Pleasant Cemetery. She is the Aunt of Betty Martyn, Margaret Frayne, J and A McIntosh and G and D Peech. It says she is the Nana to several named people. No mention of her husband or children. ???.
RK
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Very interesting think that’s about as close as i have heard ? Was it nell? Or Neil? She was known as Nell , ( Helen) thanks for the efforts in searching for her . I wonder if this is her but fair point no mention of husband or children
Ryan
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Hi,
I thought it was Neil at first, but when I looked more closely, I can see that it says "Nell". Just to be sure, I looked at the obituary printed in the Globe and Mail paper and in the Toronto Star paper. The one in the Globe is a little clearer... and it definitely says "Nell".
RK
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Obituary for Margaret Frayne in the Toronto Star, Feb 9 1995 page D14. She died in Toronto on Feb 5 1995. Cousin of G Peech and J McIntosh of New Jersey ...(not sure if both are from New Jersey, or just J McIntosh??). Aunt of 4 ... all with surname Peech.
RK
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Obituary for Elizabeth (Betty) Martyn in the Toronto Star, 22 Aug 1994 page E6. She died in Toronto on Aug 20 1994. Cousin of Margaret Frayne, G Peech and J McIntosh of New Jersey. Aunt of the same 4 Peech children.
RK
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Hi,
Looking at the obits for Margaret Frayne and Betty Martyn again... each obit says that the lady in question is the aunt of 4 Peech children (presumably the children of G and D Peech).
In the obituary for Helen McIntosh, it says she is Nana to 4 named children (only first names given....no surname here). The first names of these 4 children are the same as the Peech children listed in Margaret and Betty's obits. So - looks like "Nana" in Helen's case means "great aunt".
I hope these obits can help you either rule out this Helen (who died in 1980) or confirm that she is "your" Helen.
RK
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Thanks for your contributions I really appreciate your help these are good clues to figure out
This is one I think needs worked on , it is so difficult to put a tick next to her as we know nothing after 1928, Sandra made a fair point about the Mcarthur but could this be a spelling error ? We really don’t know unless we find something with her maiden name or her hometown mentioned I guess which is quite frustrating as it’s sad that someone’s existence and passing is just lost through nobody’s blame it happens , I appreciate I have made good progress and want to continue to work on this but this is only possible with help and guidance from people like yourselfs , please excuse my determination as I know it may look like I’m going on and on but if people are willing to help I will work on
Many thanks
Ryan
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Hazel Blanche McIntosh 12 December 1894 - Sarnia, Lambton, Ontario, Canada
passed away 1 July 1960 - Toronto, York, Ontario married Orlo Frayne 1893–1970
born 31 July 1893 - Bosanquet, Lambton, Ontario, Canada passed away 3 May 1970 - Toronto, York, Ontario.
This couple had a daughter Margaret Mary Frayne - 1916–1995
born 31 December 1916 - Ontario, Canada passed away 5 Febriary 1995 - Toronto, York, Ontario.
FIND A GRAVE
Margaret Frayne -
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/139641566
Sandra
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Thanks for that as time goes on it seems maybe this may not be my Helen ?
But il keep looking
Don’t think there would be much relatives over there unless they made a family themselves but never no,
Ryan
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Definitely no connection - this is the McIntosh family in 1921 Sarnia Lambton West Ontario - all born Ontario
James Mc Intosh 72 Elizabeth Mc Intosh 64
Dollina Martin 59 Helen Mc Intosh 24
Chas Mc Intosh 30 Gladys Mc Intosh 22
Better (Betty) Martin 5
Sandra
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She could also be buried as Helen Samuel i suppose
Maybe Sometime it will come up that we find her
Ryan
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Exactly - never say never. Maybe a relative may read what has been written and come forward at a later date - very often happens.
Sandra
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Looking back at previous notes I also discounted a McArthur couple who lived in York Ontario
Roderick Mc Arthur and Helen A Scott who were married 16 October 1914 York Ontario.
https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/168581567
Sandra
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James returned to Scotland and died in 1981 ?
James Samuel - aged 78 years - mothers maiden name McDonald - 1981 - 313/ 119
Peterhead
Was there a death notice obituary in Scottish papers ???
Sandra
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Very interesting point that I’m not sure but that’s a good idea that could lead to a clue
Ryan
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4th June 1981 I believe is when he passed
Ryan
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Have you traced all these Samuel family that show on the 1901 census 38 James St Peterhead Aberdeen ?
I know we found Alexander and you know about James passing in 1981
Oh and William.
George Samuel 45 Helen Samuel 42
William Samuel 18 Mary Samuel 4
Andrew Samuel 7 John George Samuel 13
Isabella Samuel 10 Helen Samuel 8
Alexander Samuel 5
Henry Samuel 3
Sandra
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George died 1918
Helen died. 1926
William died in Toronto 1947
Alexander died in Windsor 1962
Andrew died in Buckie , Scotland
Helen the is mystery???
Isabella died in Peterhead in the 70/80s
Mary died Peterhead or Aberdeen
John George drowned at brought ferry working as a policeman around 20 years old
James 1981 - great grand father
That’s a quick summary
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This is the father George -
George Murray B Samuel - 62 years - 1918 - 232/1 18 - Peterhead
suspect this was the mother Helen McDonald Samuel
Helen Samuel - aged 67 years - 1926 - 232/1 106 Peterhead
Neither of those deaths would help find any further info on Helen though :'(
Sandra
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Henry also died in Peterhead haven’t exact date but can find out easily
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Can you get info - death notice on Isabella - she would be the nearest in age female to Helen ?
Sandra
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Yes I will try
Will keep u posted
Ryan
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Scotlands people is down for maintenance so I can't look at anything at mo
Sandra
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I have a death cert- I will give you details this evening
Ryan
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Isabella Samuel
Dress maker - retired
Single
DOB 18 FEB 1891
Death 28 SEPTEMBER 1978
At Peterhead cottage hospital
Usual residence - 21 Atlantic Avenue
Parents George Murray bogie Samuel and Helen Samuel
Mycordial degeneration and atherosclerosis
Informant is John Samuel nephew , he died in 1998 I think at age 80
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Hey Ryan,
Just came accross this site and your post and thought I'd say hello.
I am also researching my grandparents, Andrew Samuel born August 30, 1883 Edinburgh, Scotland.
He married Emma Barry and they emigrated to Canada, settling in Cape Breton, Nova Scotia.
Any information or resources you can provide would be greatly appreciated. We did have a Ron Samuel contact us from Scotland back in the 80's but I believe he has since passed away. Any Samuel's or Barry's, or anyone reading this post who may have any leads, please feel free to send a PM.
Thanks,
-Rich
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Looking to help rich out
Looks like his grandfather Andrew Samuel ,was born in Edinburgh in 1883 but can’t find the record on Scotland people ,
I think he married a woman called Emma Barry
But don’t know if they married in Scotland ?
Can anyone find any details that might lead to learning more about this couple
Ryan
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Thanks for the help Ryan! 😁👍🏻
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Hi, and Welcome to Rootchats RichSam
From Nova Scotia Vital Stats., there is a marriage Feb. 7, 1910 in Stellarton, Nova Scotia
Andrew B. Samuel, age 28, bachelor, plasterer, b. Edinburgh, Scot., residence Port Hood,
parents James and Janet
Emma Barry, age 23, spinster, b. Port Hood, residence Port Hood, parents William and Andrea
Bottom of the page,
https://www.novascotiagenealogy.com/ItemView.aspx?ImageFile=1833-46&Event=marriage&ID=108745
DB
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Hi,
1911 Canadian Census, Port Hood, Inverness, NS
Samuels, Andrew, age 30, b. Scot. immigrated 1902, occupation machine ? (can't make it out)
Samuels, Emma, age 22, b. NS
Samuels, E. Pearl, daughter, age 10/12mths
Barry, Martha, age 19, sister in law
Andrew and Emma at the very bottom of the page,
http://automatedgenealogy.com/census11/SplitView.jsp?id=69590
Pearl and Martha at the very top
http://automatedgenealogy.com/census11/SplitView.jsp?id=69591
Using the Nova Scotia Vitals website, you can see Pearl's birth record, agree to terms and
conditions, then add Samuel, Pearl
https://www.novascotiagenealogy.com/
DB
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Hi,
Andrew served in WW1 with the CEF (Canadian Expeditionary Forces),
Samuel, Andrew, b. August 30, 1883 Edinburgh, Scotland, miner, next of kin wife Mrs. E. Samuel,
New Waterford, CB, rank Captain
Click on the PDF format, it's his complete service file, 68 pages, it is very slow to load.
http://www.bac-lac.gc.ca/eng/discover/military-heritage/first-world-war/personnel-records/Pages/item.aspx?IdNumber=212444
DB
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DB thank you so much!
I have his military and census infomation (btw his occupation was coal miner).
The marriage information is new to me.
Thanks again,
-Rich
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You're welcome. :)
What else are you looking for?
DB
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I never met him, he died long before I was born. I vaguely remember my grandmother Emma. I am hoping to find out where exactly he grew up in Scotland, any potential relatives there, and I would love to find photographs of them. I'm planning a trip to Scotland some day to trace his roots and Ireland to trace my mothers family roots as well.
Thanks again,
-Rich
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Ah ....you may wish to create a separate post on the Scotland boards with everything you know about him. On the right side of the home page, scroll down to Scotland and post away. :)
On the census he says he immigrated in 1902, just going to have a look for that passenger
list.
DB
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Good idea! ..as soon as I figure the website out more I will definitely do that. You and Ryan are awesome btw! 😁👍🏻
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Aww.. thank you. :) And yes, Ryan is awesome.
Come back if you have any questions about the website.
DB
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Definitely! Thanks again
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My reLatives thought he was John but I think there is some kind of situation where some people called Ian and John are called vice Versa
Iain/Ian is gaelic for John
Annie