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General => Armed Forces => World War One => Topic started by: K8T on Monday 23 April 18 22:33 BST (UK)

Title: J H (J A) Surnam
Post by: K8T on Monday 23 April 18 22:33 BST (UK)

There is a memorial at Christ Church, Gravesend on which J H Surnam (could be J A Surnam) is listed.  I can find a John Arthur Surnam living in Gravesend in 1911 aged 12.  There appears to be no further mention of him and no death recorded after this time.  I can find no service record, casualty record or naval (merchant or navy ) record which would show that he served.  He seems to disappear.  I have been thinking that he may have joined up under another name.

i can find a John Surman who was a casualty but was born in Camberwell in 1888 and then moved to Wales.  I cannot find a link to Gravesend.

I know the surname could be spelt wrong but have tried other combinations.  Can anyone else find a link?

Thanks
K8T

Title: Re: J H (J A) Surnam
Post by: ShaunJ on Tuesday 24 April 18 08:45 BST (UK)

The church's own website gives this information:

"Surman, John Arthur

Born third quarter 1898. 1911 census, living at 1 Violet Cottages New Street, with his siblings, at the house of sister, Emily Lucas, and her husband.

In 1901, he was at 35 Peter Street, the home of his widower father, George Surman, a Steam Barge Stoker, and 8 siblings, the oldest George W, a Waterman Barge Apprentice, he may have joined a sea service.

I can find no trace of military service by John, and he is not listed as a wartime casualty."

http://www.christchurchgravesend.org.uk/christ-church-and-the-community/ww1-memorial-stone-rededication/biographical-details-/

Title: Re: J H (J A) Surnam
Post by: jim1 on Tuesday 24 April 18 11:42 BST (UK)

There are 3 John Surman (no middle name or initial) MIC's he could be one of those or may not have served overseas so no MIC.
Have you access to the Gravesend Absent Voter's Roll ?

Title: Re: J H (J A) Surnam
Post by: ShaunJ on Tuesday 24 April 18 12:02 BST (UK)

John Surman was a deckhand on the Doria and drowned on 24 December 1915.  Aged 17, from Gravesend, address 1 Violet Cottages. Recorded in various deaths at sea records.

Title: Re: J H (J A) Surnam
Post by: mmm45 on Tuesday 24 April 18 20:59 BST (UK)

Nice spot Shaun.Not due to Enemy action so won't be recorded on CWGC.

Ady

Title: Re: J H (J A) Surnam
Post by: K8T on Tuesday 24 April 18 22:34 BST (UK)

Thanks for finding that information ShaunJ.  I did have the church information but the stone has only recently be re-cut  and rededicated as it had been lost since the 1930s and when found it was unreadable.  A book published years ago had him down as J H Surnam.

It's fantastic that you found information on him as a deckhand.  Can I ask which site you found that on?  It certainly answers the mystery.

Thank you everyone for your help with this.

K8T

Title: Re: J H (J A) Surnam
Post by: ShaunJ on Tuesday 24 April 18 23:10 BST (UK)

FindMyPast has the most information on his death.

Title: Re: J H (J A) Surnam
Post by: K8T on Wednesday 25 April 18 17:57 BST (UK)

Thanks ShaunJ  I appreciate the information